CP #16 Criticism Unwarranted
Coasterdude, if it was sleeting at 300 feet in the air that is realy *not* that high up. The means that the temperature was obviously close to freezing. I would be willing to bet that there were very few people left in the park when it closed. It probably got so cold outside that there were not sufficient customers to justify the costs of staying open, therefore, they shut the park down.
If you notice by the coasterpoll on the main page, while most of us say any temperature is fine with them to ride coasters, the second biggest response (and the GP's most likely response) is about 40 degrees - and I'd say to adjust for some "enthusaist factor" that its about 45 degrees. So it just makes good business sense to keep operations low when its that cold out. There's no reason to pay probably close to as many employees as you have customers, when you have that few people at the park.
If you can give me an example of any other park that has had full operations in sleet/ice conditions, I will give up my arguement, but until then, I maintain that there is nothing pathetic about only having Iron Dragon and the Carousel open for your visit.
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1. Kumba 2. Millie 3. Mantis 4. Lightning Racer 5. Wicked Twister (Front Seat)
-- Brett
If the park is going to be open, then it *is* pathetic to have just a handful of rides open. If they're going to close due to lack of customers (which they did), then that's fine and acceptable too. But to do so without refunds is inexcusable. When you pay to enter a park, you pay for the rides to be open (with weather exceptions) and you pay for them to stay open the hours they announced. The rides weren't necessarily down due to weather, it's more like they were down because CP didn't want to open them due to small crowds. And as I said, that's fine. But then those rides should have been listed on the board coming into the park, and refunds should be given when a park closes early. Even SFWoA did that two nights later.
-Nate
coasterdude318 said:But then those rides should have been listed on the board coming into the park, and refunds should be given when a park closes early.
Why not write Cedar Point your dissatisfication on the issue vs arguing with people on here. I'm sure they will give you the direct response that you are looking for? Trust me, I have.
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100th coaster....Dania Beach Hurricane!
Cedar Point has never, not in any time I've been going in two decades, had only five rides open. Tell me the day you were there.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com - Sillynonsense.com
DELETED!
I seem to remember seeing somewhere "Cedar Point is does not issue rainchecks for inclement weather, ride closures, etc". Maybe I'm hallucinating or something though.
And just cause a park closes down does not mean they owe you anything. Part of the reason they're closing in the first place is to cut costs for that day. I've been tossed out of Kennywood multiple times before even 10pm when its been crappy weather outside. I would say that at least for the region I live in, getting a "free pass" just cause the weather didn't coordinate with your visit is the exception, not the rule.
Just try www.weather.com next time before you go.
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1. Kumba 2. Millie 3. Mantis 4. Lightning Racer 5. Wicked Twister (Front Seat)
-- Brett
When you pay to enter a park, you pay for the rides to be open (with weather exceptions) and you pay for them to stay open the hours they announced.
Tell that to Six Flags! I don't think I've ever visited one of their parks when all the rides were open. In 2001 I visited SFGAd and there were no ride closures listed at the time the park opened. Well, only two of their flats were open that day....the frisbee and one other. When I left the park, over 20 rides were listed closed, including 3 coasters. A summer visit to SFAW in 2001 found four coasters closed the whole day....
CP's 96% figure speaks for itself. No other corporate/chain park can even come close to that!
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- Peabody
*** This post was edited by Peabody on 12/19/2002. ***
The old Geauga Lake tried a program that I think was called the Sunshine Guarantee. The just of it was that if it rained for "x" number of hours you got a ticket to come back to the park another day after 5:00 or if it rained "y" number of hours you got to come back to the park another day for all day.
It was a pretty wet summer as I recall and the program no longer exists. Take that for what it is worth.
PittDesigner said: I seem to remember seeing somewhere "Cedar Point is does not issue rainchecks for inclement weather, ride closures, etc". Maybe I'm hallucinating or something though.
Sure. First, that's a statement to cover CP's ass so nobody can get upset over ride closures due to weather. I wouldn't expect a refund for bad weather, nor would I expect one for a few rides closed. But I *do* think one is deserved when all rides are down all day *without warning*, and the park closes early (after only being open for three hours). When they close rides for weather they at least keep the park open, as there are other things to do, and they keep as many rides open as possible. Neither were done that night.
And just cause a park closes down does not mean they owe you anything. Part of the reason they're closing in the first place is to cut costs for that day.
That's Cedar Point's problem, not mine. I treat parks as a business, not a charity. That's bad business to charge people to enter a park with no warning that nothing is (or will be) open, and then kick people out early without a refund.
I've been tossed out of Kennywood multiple times before even 10pm when its been crappy weather outside.
If I recall correctly, Kennywood doesn't have set hours. CP does.
I would say that at least for the region I live in, getting a "free pass" just cause the weather didn't coordinate with your visit is the exception, not the rule.
Funny how sad, sad SFWoA gives out passes upon closing early after they've been open *all day* with *all* rides open, while CP can't give passes when *nothing* is open and the park itself was only open for three hours.
Just try www.weather.com next time before you go.The weather report said "rain" - not something that would cause the closure of almost every ride at CP.
Peabody said: Tell that to Six Flags! I don't think I've ever visited one of their parks when all the rides were open. In 2001 I visited SFGAd and there were no ride closures listed at the time the park opened. Well, only two of their flats were open that day....the frisbee and one other. When I left the park, over 20 rides were listed closed, including 3 coasters.
At least they bothered to put the rides on the board when they realized they couldn't/weren't going to open them. Apparently that was too much trouble for CP. It was also too much trouble for CP to warn people the park was closing at nine as people were entering at 8:30, paying full price.
A summer visit to SFAW in 2001 found four coasters closed the whole day....
I don't care about ride closures; that's part of going to an amusement park. I do care when people are being jipped out of their money, which was very obviously the case at CP that night.
For the record, it was the Friday before PPP, 2001.
-Nate
*** This post was edited by coasterdude318 on 12/19/2002. ***
*** This post was edited by coasterdude318 on 12/19/2002. ***
How bout you read the brochure given to you when you enter a park. "Enter park name here does not guarantee that all rides will be open. Rides and attractions may be closed at any time without warning." (or in whatever other words they choose, pretty much covering their rears legally)
That right there is your warning that a ride might not be open during your visit. The park belongs to the company and can do as they please. Now it would be totally different if it was a pay per ride coaster (or attraction) and at the ticket booth the "person" says the ride is open then you turn right around and it has been closed all day. Signs are not always accurate and they are a common curtesy so you see them before you get into the park and can decide to go home then. If it doesn't list something you really wanna ride, ask the sales person before you buy your ticket, they will find that out for you, its their job.
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Wood Rules!
You go Nate! I know CP is an illmatic park. But it does have its imperfections.
I should be the last to talk tho cause I am very protective of Great Adventure....which has many faults.
But coasterdude, you are not treating Cedar Point as a business if you expect them to refund you if nothing is running. A business is run ruthlessly, they're out to make money. It's a side benefit if they care enough to keep their customers happy (yes, I know that's how you stay in business - but it's not the only way). And speaking of customer service, if you were that pissed off at what happened to be your bad luck because of the weather, you should have gone to guest relations before leaving and complained. That's why that booth is there, its not just for decoration.
I'm well aware that Kennywood doesn't have set hours, but its extremely rare that on a summer day, they would close before 10pm.
And I know I shouldn't but I just have to - maybe because SFWoA is giving out free passes left and right for things that aren't under their control as opposed to taking a "enter at your own risk" approach, they wouldn't be in the financial mess they're in.
And "rain" on a cold day can easily turn into ice or sleet when you're by a lake, and when it turns dark and the temperatures drop.
Going back to the business comment: if you were treating Cedar Point as a business, then maybe you have a point, but you're not. You're treating them as an entity out only to serve your needs and you should have to assume no financial or enjoyment risk, or have to make any effort to inquire as to the status of their operations on a day of questionable operating conditions. (yea I know two operations in the same scentance ... couldn't think of another good word =) )
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1. Kumba 2. Millie 3. Mantis 4. Lightning Racer 5. Wicked Twister (Front Seat)
-- Brett
I still can't think of a time when Cedar Point rides were down like Coasterdude is describing. I remember the water spouts closing rides temporarily. I also seem to remember a severe power outage but that was some time ago.
Coasterdude, if you tell me the date that this happened I could get it verified pretty quickly and probalby get an explanation as well. Or, are you just spouting to hear yourself spout?
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Best inverts:
1. Talon
2. Volcano - The Blast Coaster
3. Raptor
*** This post was edited by Eric 013 on 12/19/2002. ***
PittDesigner said:
But coasterdude, you are not treating Cedar Point as a business if you expect them to refund you if nothing is running. A business is run ruthlessly, they're out to make money. It's a side benefit if they care enough to keep their customers happy (yes, I know that's how you stay in business - but it's not the only way).
No, I'm treating CP as a business. As a business, I pay them for a service I am about to receive in the park. What happens when CP never delivers on that payment? *That* is bad business. There's a reason businesses give refunds. Have you ever worked in customer service? The basic principle is to keep the customer happy, (practically) no matter what. It hurst CP a lot more to lose a customer than to refund the $30 (or whatever it is) to enter the park. Businesses do this all the time. Other than what was paid to enter the park that night, we didn't spend a cent. If we had been given free passes, we would have gladly returned, spent more money, and been happier. Both parties would be much better off. That, my friend, is the essence of good business.
And speaking of customer service, if you were that pissed off at what happened to be your bad luck because of the weather, you should have gone to guest relations before leaving and complained. That's why that booth is there, its not just for decoration.
No need to insult me - how stupid do you think I am? Of course we paid them a visit as soon as we heard they were closing early and were told no refunds would be given. Want to hear about worse customer service? One of the members in our group wrote a letter to CP after returning home. About a month later, he received a phone call from someone in operations (don't know who) who said a refund would be sent out. Not only did he never see that refund check, but further phone calls and letters to CP went unanswered. That's sad for a park consistently considered to have some of the best customer service personell.
I'm well aware that Kennywood doesn't have set hours, but its extremely rare that on a summer day, they would close before 10pm.
That's a completely different scenario. The majority of guests in the park probably do not know KW normally stays open later than 10pm. They can close when they want because there are *no* set closing hours. It's not like KW said "We'll stay open past 10" and then closed, but that's basically what CP did.
And I know I shouldn't but I just have to - maybe because SFWoA is giving out free passes left and right for things that aren't under their control as opposed to taking a "enter at your own risk" approach, they wouldn't be in the financial mess they're in.
Oh bull. SFWoA had a bad season because attendance was down for several reasons ("free passes" were not one of them). On the contrary, I'm sure the free passes *helped* SFWoA a lot more than it hurt them. Think of all the people who came back and spent money in the park, *and* left with a good impression and would be more willing to come back the next year. Why do you think parks throw out discounts left and right? They certainly don't hurt the park. I think the fact that, at least that week, SFWoA's customer service kicked the crap out of CP's speaks for itself.
And "rain" on a cold day can easily turn into ice or sleet when you're by a lake, and when it turns dark and the temperatures drop.
This was a Friday during Halloweekends. We entered at six and the weather was decent (a light rain, nothing terrible). It never really got any worse, but nothing opened. They closed at 9 (two hours early, I believe) and we left at eight. It certainly wasn't sleeting at 300' by 8pm.
Going back to the business comment: if you were treating Cedar Point as a business, then maybe you have a point, but you're not. You're treating them as an entity out only to serve your needs and you should have to assume no financial or enjoyment risk, or have to make any effort to inquire as to the status of their operations on a day of questionable operating conditions.
No, I'm treating it as a customer and a business. If I was treating it as some entity that owes me, then I would be one of those people who go to a park and whine because *one* attraction was down. That's not the way it was. *Thirteen* coasters down is inexcusable. As I explained above, it would have been much wiser for CP to give out free passes than not. You don't seen to understand business very well.
wahoo skipper said:
Coasterdude, if you tell me the date that this happened I could get it verified pretty quickly and probalby get an explanation as well.
As I said above, it was the Friday before PPP, 2001. If I remember correctly, that would have been Oct 5 or 12, 2001.
BeastFreak said:
That right there is your warning that a ride might not be open during your visit. The park belongs to the company and can do as they please. Now it would be totally different if it was a pay per ride coaster (or attraction) and at the ticket booth the "person" says the ride is open then you turn right around and it has been closed all day. Signs are not always accurate and they are a common curtesy so you see them before you get into the park and can decide to go home then. If it doesn't list something you really wanna ride, ask the sales person before you buy your ticket, they will find that out for you, its their job.
It doesn't seem like you've been paying much attention. It's not as if one "ride I really wanna ride" was down, it's that they were *all* down *all* night. The board is there to inform your guests of what rides are closed. I would have been upset if I entered the park and found a ride or two closed that weren't on the board. Instead, *nothing* was listed on the board, yet *everything* was down. That's hardly a "common courtesy." How about the people entering in the park at 8pm who were not told the park would close (early) at 9? They paid full price to enter and nobody at the gate said a *word* as they entered about ride closures or the park closing early.
You all seem to be missing my point here. It's not that CP is a bad park, or that I don't like it, or that I'm "attacking" it because I'm tired of fanboys. I happen to really like CP. I've had three great visits there and the one really crappy one (which, I might add, goes down in history as being the *worst* theme park visit ever). I'm just pointing out that all parks have their days, even Cedar Point. It is *not* just Six Flags that has extreme and unusual ride closures or bad customer service. To suggest otherwise is ridiculous.
-Nate
OK, so you left before they closed, and you're complaining about early closure? I was there that day... there was no one in the park, it was wet, it was Friday night, with limited operation in the first place. Light rain my ass... that was a terrible night to be there.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com - Sillynonsense.com
DELETED!
It was a bad night to be there, yes, but I've ridden in worse rain - at CP no less!
-Nate
For Friday night Halloweekends only Millie, Maggie, Raptor and perhaps Mantis are open anyway, correct me if I am wrong. Whats the big deal?
First night of haloweekends this year was awful. Rode Raptor and then played ddr for two hours because nothing was running because of the rain.
It was miserable for a while there and I new I was taking a chnace when I left from home. If I would have gotten there and not been able to ride anything it woudl have been my fault and a waste of an hour and a half drive. WOudl I have blamed the park? Heck no.
Wanna talk about customer service? Closing day Dick Kinzel took the time to talk to 4 20 year olds who were asking him dumb questions. Show me any other corporation of that size where you see the CEO let alone talk to him.
Heck I saw Mr. Kinzel so many times at the point this year it was ridiculous, alwyas talking to people or picking up trash. That guy is the biggest class act ever.
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1989, 9 years old bawling my eyes out because I didn't want to ride Magnum. I did anyway and look at me now. Why did ya make me do it Dave? ;)
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I really don't like the Bengals. Can't wait to ride CPR(Cedar Point's Revenge)
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Don't Fight It, Ride It, RAGING BULL!!!!!!- SFGAm
It's not my fault the rides were closed. It's not my fault they closed the park early. It's not my fault CP decided refunds and customer service aren't necessary. It's not my fault CP doesn't list closed rides before entering the park. It's not my fault CP doesn't inform its guests that it is closing early, still charging full price for an hour in the park. And it's not my fault CP lies about refunding people.
So tell me, Blink, what exactly about my experience is MY fault? Maybe you should grow up and learn how to spell.
-Nate
*** This post was edited by coasterdude318 on 12/19/2002. ***
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