Cedar Point says Top Thrill Dragster is done, sort of

I think the thing that folks need to warm up to is that Intamin is not a magical flower, or even a little unique. Other companies can and do make better products. This is the cognitive disconnect I see over and over again. Some companies have a history of building reliable, amazing crowd pleasers, and they think that the extremeness or whatever has something to do with it. It does not. Big rides like Dragster or Millennium Force could have been built by anyone, but only Intamin offered to do so at the agreed upon price. It's all money, not capability.

Oh no, I understand that, but each company I am sure has slightly different ways of doing things, different vision, etc., and I’d think that would factor, if even only a little bit.

Also, isn’t Intamin the only firm that has done massive launch coasters like TTD, KK, etc? Couldn’t there be something said about their capability versus other firms to “re-imagine” a design that they’re pretty much the only ones to successfully complete?

My opinion is that the hydraulic launch likely provides the most instantaneous energy of any system, because it scales, in theory, infinitely. You can put as many motors as you want with gearing to pull a cable. But then you have complexity and probably some limits to cable strength (not theoretical, given the potentially catastrophic failures of Xcelerator and Dragster), there's risk in that.

But electric motors are pretty exciting too, you just need more runway, or enough back-and-forth to build though energy to get over a hump. I mean, the launch area of Icebreaker is tiny, but it's enough where three passes gets you the speed you want.

bunky666:
Oh no, I understand that, but each company I am sure has slightly different ways of doing things, different vision, etc., and I’d think that would factor, if even only a little bit.

While I can certainly see that as a potential issue, I guess I have to point to Phantom's Revenge at Kennywood. That's a different company than Steel Phantom, and all in all, the new ride is vastly superior to the original. Arrow built the original; Morgan the newer ride.

Brian Noble:

There aren’t many things more entertaining than listening to enthusiast rumors about unannounced coasters.

They're like small children trying to talk their wishes into reality.

Right now there are videos that claim the new Adventure Express at KI is teasing a new Son Of Beast. And you can't utter the words "new coaster" into the wind without hearing "Could this be the 500 foot T-Rex?"

When I thought about it a little longer, I could think of at least three coasters off the top of my head that were made with the assistance of more than one firm, so yeah, I guess it doesn’t matter all that much. Still, a ride of this magnitude seems like a project for the original designers/manufacturers to me. I’m not an engineer though, so I’m certainly not gonna continue to speculate.

Walt S, funny you should mention Phantom's Revenge, or more specifically, Morgan. Does anybody remember how many steel coasters Morgan had built before building Wild Thing for Valleyfair!? Exactly two: they had built but not installed the Quicksilver Express for Hecker Pass/Bonfante Gardens/Gilroy Gardens, all of 38 feet tall, and they built West Coaster (55' tall) for Pacific Park. And yet, Cedar Fair had no issues with hiring them to build Wild Thing (207 feet) for Valleyfair!, and was apparently happy enough with that one to order Steel Force and Mamba. Yes, I know there were some personnel issues involved (Steve Okamoto left Arrow to design coasters for Morgan) but at the time was there any evidence at all that Morgan could manage the project and have the fabrication done? That their train could operate at 70 MPH? Their lack of corporate experience building hyper coasters (or for that matter ANY steel coasters) could have been disqualifying, if many of today's enthusiasts were in charge!

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

Walt S:

While I can certainly see that as a potential issue, I guess I have to point to Phantom's Revenge at Kennywood. That's a different company than Steel Phantom, and all in all, the new ride is vastly superior to the original. Arrow built the original; Morgan the newer ride

Morgan had experience with hyper coasters at that point and had already built ones that rode superior to the original Arrow hyper coaster.

This doesn’t have to be Intamin but a company with building successful launching coasters and switch tracks or transfer tables (if is going to have a swing launch). would be preferable IMO. Mack or Premier for example.

One of three things is going to happen.

1. The ride is going to be a success and life will go on.
2. The ride will be a complete failure and one person will complain and reference this thread to prove he was right about Zamperla being a terrible choice for the project.
3. (Most likely): The ride will be a success but experience the occasional technical shutdown that we all expect with groundbreaking rides and one person will complain and reference this thread to prove he was right about Zamperla being a terrible choice for the project.

They should just replace it with a dragon wagon and call it a day.

It's pretty clear CF made a bulk deal with Zamperla, but again, especially with CF its all about cost, and they generally use the same engineering firms.

I just want a good GCI on Millenium Island... since we haven't had a new wood since 91, hopefully, the Zambezi Zinger fun hasn't hurt the GCI CF relationship.

Sharpel007:

It's pretty clear CF made a bulk deal with Zamperla

It is?

"Bulk deal with (insert your favorite manufacturer)" is the most 2002 thing you could type on a forum.

Raven-Phile:

They should just replace it with a dragon wagon and call it a day.

https://coasterbuzz.com/Forums/PostLink/981490

bigboy, that may well be the case, but in this case we have the evidence: of all the rides being installed in Cedar Fair parks in 2023, there are only two that didn't come from Zamperla. I hope Adam Sandy (who I remember from rec.roller-coaster) is justifiably proud of himself.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

super7*:

superior to the original Arrow hyper coaster

You're dead to me.

8 rides, and curious about what the rest of the chain will get with placemaking next year...

CP - Wild Mouse

KI - Cargo Loco, Sol Spin

CW- Air Racers, Gear Spin, Air Walker, Wind Star

GA - Pacific Gliders

Also not to mention every Peanuts expansion since the merger are mostly Zamperla, and all the Disk"O's that have been added.

It seems that there are very obvious benefits to having a good working relationship. Whooduhthunkit?! 😂

If you want to add a flat ride these days, you're almost forced to go with Zamperla -- other flat manufacturers out there are few and far between. Saying that Cedar Fair is (allegedly) going with Zamperla for TTD because of the flat ride purchases or vis versa is a bit of a stretch.

Buy 8 rides get a 400 foot swing launch coaster 50% off!