Flying Turns Update

If I had the Phoenix in my park (among many other rare, cool and GREAT things) I wouldn't worry too much about my website. But of course, would be nice if it were updated. *KNOEBEL'S BIG HUGS**** yay

Vater said:
12/22/10 - It's still not open.

There ya go, Mike. :)

Mikes helping Mikes. That's a beautiful thing.

I just noticed that this topic has been going on for 58 pages, and began March of 2006. WOW!

LostKause said:
I just noticed that this topic has been going on for 58 pages, and began March of 2006. WOW!

Yeah...but it took a year and a half off. Wish I could do that...

Mike Gallagher said:

Mikes helping Mikes. That's a beautiful thing.

Mike likes Mikes helping Mikes? ;)

12/24/10... still not open, and dangerously close to being unfriended by Kosmo.

I personally don't care one way or the other, because the ride will open when it's ready, and I know this is a "process". However, I think there's some truth to the statements that some people are defensive and taking the park's side, simply because it's Knoebel's.

If this was at Great Adventure or Cedar Point, I do believe a lot more people would be all over the "why isn't it open yet?!1" camp.

Again, I don't care either way because I will ride it when I ride it, and because I do love Knoebel's, I will keep returning regardless of FT's status (just don't make me stay in that cabin again, please!).

Another side of that argument, though, is that Great Adventure or Cedar Point would never attempt to resurrect an old-style wooden bobsled ride that hasn't existed in decades, with very little information on the original to reference, and have it meet today's safety standards.

However, if something like this was attempted by one of the large corporate parks, I'd probably give them a bit less leeway if they ran into the same issues. That's not to say I'd be all, "why isn't it open yet?!1"...instead I'd probably just roll my eyes and say, "figures" silently to myself. :)

The question I was asking myself was, if the trains are the issue, then why did Knoebels award the contract to a flat ride company to design and build the first sets? As far as I know, Larson International closest thing to coaster trains are the cars on their Ring of Fire rides and that's about it. Intamin, Mack and even B&M got experience in designing bobsled cars that work, so perhaps their expertise would have been more useful than an inexperienced company.

I thought Larson was just doing fabrication to designs provided by Knoebels. If I remember correctly, the first version was designed by Steve Okamoto, who has a little bit of experience with roller coasters, including trains; and the latest designs have been done by Mike Boodley, who also knows a thing or two about wood coasters and wood coaster trains.

One problem, of course, is that the Flying Turns configuration is not a conventional track design, and the train will not interact with the track in the same way that it would on a conventional track. So lots of experience with coaster trains is useful, certainly, but this ride is still something a little different.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

For me it's not about defending a park regardless of who they are, but it's the factthat I see this as a home-made project that no company is making or has perfected, so there should be no expectations to meet any conventional deadlines.

If Knoebels was having Intamin do this, it would be a different story. ;)

And that's biased and hypocritical, Matt. If Intamin decided to do this, they'd be in the same boat as the current designers.

I got tired of waiting on the darn thing to open, so I finally went to Knoebels. At this point, I really don't care either way, it's not my money sitting there looking all smug every time a coaster enthusiast walks by, taunting them by not operating.

I'm not being biased or hypocritical at all.

I meant if Intamin sold Knoebels on the idea that they had this design all worked out and it would be done over a single winter and ready to open in April... THAT would be a different story. I'm differentiating between buying a product that is promised to work vs. experimenting and devising your own from scratch. Big difference!

It doesn't taunt me one bit. It's just a pretty reminder that something awesome is to be had in the near future.

Yeah, but I know you well enough to know that if Intamin came in and gave the same line that Knoebels did from the beginning, "It'll be done when it's done", you wouldn't give them any slack ;).

Of course not, Intamin is in the business of building/supplying rides, contractually on time and on budget. Nobody in their right mind would contract with firm with that attitude. It's a whole other story when it's a project that is done almost entirely inhouse.

I'm not sure about the contracturallg on time and budget part anymore...

Regardless if it's intamin or not, prototypes take time to complete.

Exactly, Dutchman!

Oh please...don't let Intamin try and anything similar. Just let them create tried and tested things, like flumes...

Or Giga Coasters.

LOL They take ride styles that have worked flawlessly for a 50-100+ years and find a way to make them break down constantly.