Cedar Point, The Best?
Something being "the best" is always subject interpretation. I really hate the question of what is best. I also hate people throwing awards in my face as most award winning films are not even close to being my favorites movies, that theory holds up every year.
On the other hand, as I have said before:
1) One or two bad visits does NOT a bad park make(thank you Yoda).
2) All Six Flags park were NOT created equal or the same despite what you've heard.
3) The double standards that I see among enthusiasts is ALMOST enough to make me not trust their opinions.
4)Lying and exaggerating is just SO easy to do on the internet, but read it carefully enough and the person will usually reveal their real agenda, sometimes it's right there in their sig...
5) I have never been to an amusement park where I didn't have a good time and THAT'S what I'm paying for. So cool it with the whining...
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"Escuse me, can you tell me where the heck the Mystery Lodge is"?
I have never in my life seen so many people unwilling to face or accept any criticisms of something like CP fanboys, and then turn around and act like total hypocrites and lay the smack down on the smallest of offenses on competing chains. Jeesh people, grow up. CP is far from perfect. Yes it's a great park, but it is far from the only one, and it does have some problems that can certainly be addressed. Especially in some areas of park ops like he experienced.
To give a contrast, last year when I went to SFMW to ride V2, it was closed while everyother coaster was open. I had a good time still, but was disappointed. I stopped by guest relations to fill out a form commenting on what I liked and disliked (landscaping was a beef of mine), and when they asked I commented how I was a little disappointed that V2 wasn't open having driven a long ways for it. They immediately offered me a free readmission pass. It wasn't asked for or expected, they just did it.
Thats the kind of PR you would never ever see at CP. There is far more to a park than just it's coasters, and while CP has some incredible coasters, well, it does have other problems.
And so does my home park, and the others near it. But at least I'm willing to admit that and not worship any of them like some "enthusiasts" do.
*rolls eyes*
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Sometimes it's up. Sometimes it's down.
But with God, life is one thrill ride that you'll never regret being on.
I have never in my life seen so many people unwilling to face or accept any criticisms of something like CP fanboys, and then turn around and act like total hypocrites and lay the smack down on the smallest of offenses on competing chains.
Read, read and re-read... I think we've established several times in this thread alone that us fanboys criticize our home just as much.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"
However Jeff, you RARELY see anything bad being said about CP on CoasterBuzz. You have to read GTTP to get the negative nuggets. But half (not a scientifically counted half ;)) the people that defend CP here are NOT GTTP regulars. It's *those* people I have beef with. Funny thing, those tend to be the people that are not exactly *local* to CP but are angry with the "home" park they go to daily and think that their isolated visits to CP prove that it is a veritable "Mecca" in the amusement park world. They then respond to a disparaging comment hoisted at CP as if it is attacking a belief core to their very being. Then it's like "Bama, take a chill pill!"
lata,
jeremy
--an admitted Six Flags Lunatic...but loves DisneyLand and HersheyPark almost as much
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It was only a fantasy, the wall was too high, as you can see, no matter how he tried he could not break free, and the worms ate into his brain.- Pink Floyd "Hey You"
*** This post was edited by B&M_Lover on 6/19/2002. ***
Cedar Point is a great park, and I really enjoyed my second visit there, so please don't think I don't like it, which I realize I might have given that impression a bit.
And Jeff, I don't have a problem with those that really like CP that are willing to give out the beef when necessary. But you have to admit that there are a ton of people who refuse to do that. And there are a whole lot of those who refuse to admit any faults with CP that won't hesitate to flame away on Six Flags.
If what was posted even on this one thread was to be believed, then IOAfan is a total moron for finding even one thing that he didn't like about CP (which I'll agree it wasn't a real legit gripe, but still) and that anyone who does must be just an idiot. Plus the same goes for anyone who like SF parks cause everyone with a brain knows that they suck. Well, at least according to the majority posting on this thread.
I'll give you this though, it's not as bad here as a lot of places. Coasterforum/Thrillnetwork with all their little kids is a big joke in that department, as is some of the definately lack of decorum on RRC. But never-the-less, you see that far more out of CP fans than you do in the reverse camp. And to many are sure to not let the facts get in the way.
And now that I've taken this way off topic... lets try to get it back
IOA, yes it's sad that WT was down for you. But it can take a while to get a part and put it right. That and there was more than one problem on the coaster kept it closed. Sorry you missed it, but they had it closed for a very good reason.
But even with that you obviously experienced a lot at CP, and a lot that you enjoyed. CP is a lot more than one coaster, and I'm sure even you would have to agree with that.
Even so, it would be nice in a situation like that that if someone politely complains in the park ops office it would be nice if they comped them a free drink or something. Something that doesn't cost the park anything but makes the customer more than happy. But sadly CP refuses to do anything like that, no matter how well deserved it might be. And since yours wasn't as deserving as several situations I'm aware of (and have experienced) there, well, you're out in the cold.
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Sometimes it's up. Sometimes it's down.
But with God, life is one thrill ride that you'll never regret being on.
2hostyl;
Like I stated before, parks have their good days and bad ones..maybe IOARules caught CP on a bad one..but from what we have experienced from other parks, CP has done no wrong to us at least.
I have been to 6 SF parks but SFGAD alot more because it is the closest. And they are the worst with SFWOA at a close second and SFGA a third. They may all run a BIT differently but in a nutshell, they are OWNED by the same company. I remember the park before Warner got involved and believe me, it was alot better. After they threw their hat in, everything started going to pot.
If after going to 6 SF parks and you basically see the same going-ons at all of them..what would you think about SF? It would leave a bad taste in your mouth and you would choose to take your family elsewhere. I don't care if they have the fastest, biggest, longest coaster in the galaxy..I know I haven't been the only person who complains about them on a daily basis and I won't be the last either.
We have never had a problem with Hershey in the 6 years that we have been season pass holders, the only problem we had at Dorney was the fight in the Steel Force line between 2 juveniles and punches were thrown, blood was spilled and they were arrested..and right in front of my daughter who is 6. Other then that Cedar Fair has been wonderful.
The only problem we had at PKI was getting stuck on the lift hill on King Cobra but that problem is now resolved since the coaster went c-ya!
PKD had hypersonic running a few trains at 5+ hour waits..other then that and Volcano being down 4 hours and I STILL WAITED IN LINE to ride it..the visit was pleasurable.
Now getting back to the argument intended for this thread..he had a bad day..but you can't bash a park after ONE bad visit..I have had NUMEROUS bad visits in 17+ years at SF and that is why I bash them. It wasn't one bad apple..the whole damn orchard is bad too. :)
Case closed.
See ya at the Point!
Jeff said:
In the end, there's a reason that many of us in Northeast Ohio are so crazy about this park (in light of the fact we had more than one to choose from).I'll give you a hint... it has very little to do with the actual rides.
Toss Upstate NY in there too to show that it's not just Ohio people. I'd love to say a park that is closer to me (SFNE, Great Escape, SFDL, SFGAdv, etc) is better than CP, but honestly I can not. CP IS NOT PERFECT! They are out of line charging $3 for soda, they could use more shade, Mean Streak blows, they have stooped to the same level of other parks in not allowing a simple bottle or snack through the gates, etc. There are several things that I, personally, do not like about CP. However, when somone starts saying that CP does not work hard to keep rides open, that is rediculous. I have NEVER been to a park that has most, if not all their rides open more consistantly than Cedar Point. CP is not perfect, but in the area of ride operations and capacity, they are as close as I've seen. Seasonals and managers at that park bust their butts to make sure as many people as possible experience their rides each hour, day, week, month, and season.
Also, I would expect that IOA is currently tauting Hulk as the number one steel coaster according to Discovery viewers. If they are not, they are missing a marketing opportunity. Don't get upset about CP marketing their awards. They are real awards given by industry publications, enthusiasts, and professionals. Not everyone has to agree with them, but to say they are self proclaimed titles is just not true!
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-Matt
2001 Magnum Crew
Hello-
This is a helluva thread. I just wanted to state my opinion that Cedar Point, to me, is disgusting.
There is only one reason why Cedar Point is the best Park in the Midwest --
Ready...
Here it is:
Cedar Point follows Six Flags Great America's lead. Just look at the facts...this has been stated before, hmmmm.
-Vertical Velocity for GAM, WT for Cedar Point, but it has to be longer, taller and "different"
-Raptor. Suped up Batman: The Ride. Faster, longer, taller, more inversions.
-Raging Bull, speed coaster... MF, taller, faster, longer.
-Interestingly enough, Demon and Corkscrew opened the same year, 1976
Now this post will frusterate some people. Sorry, but this is my opinion. You can try to change it if you want...
If a person expresses negative opinions or suggustions CP on this Site...CoasterBuzz... I challenge Jeff, I challenge all Buzzers to take the comments in, and accept the opinion.
I love my Great America Dearly, and most people that like CP like Great America. Vice Versa...but on this site.... people are much more accustemed to bashing Great America with out any crap than CP.
This is life, Pointers....your park could do w/ some suggestions, as does mine.
CoasterSmith
RCT InSomniAcS
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Oooooh...I did bring up the ease of being an "Attention Ho', right?
Fresh from his barely-literate, run-on ramblings and frequent poundings on URC, let's give a big welcome to Attention-Ho-come-lately.
Good to see you using full sentences these days....but I challenge you to pop a Ritalin and read the thread. We discussed your 'subject' a little while ago.
Besides, if your 'follow SFGAM' theory was true
- American Eagle would have been built before Gemini
- SFGAM would have built a suspended coaster before CP's Draggin Iron
- CP's Magnum would have had 7-8 loops instead of zero
- Giant Drop would have been built before CP's PT
(wait a minute, it WAS....but then CP would have built an Intamin tower, not multiple S&S towers, which WOF did first)
- CP would be removing all of their classic spin-and-spues
- CP would have kept the Jumbo Jet
- And how could I have forgotten? CP would have built Raptor and Mantis with two trains instead of three.
So it really doesn't hold water.
Besides, I already claimed Attention-ho rights to this thread.
-'Playa
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The CPlaya 100--6 days, 9 parks, 47 coasters, 2037 miles and a winner.....LoCoSuMo.
*** This post was edited by CoastaPlaya on 6/20/2002. ***
they have stooped to the same level of other parks in not allowing a simple bottle or snack through the gates, etc.
That is another small gripe I had. They wouldn't let us bring the water in the park that we braught from THEIR own hotel. I don't know if all other parks do this because I can't actually remember whens the last time I had a drink with me, but either way, it's still an anoyance. About Fastlane, it works good. They don't overload the times and mess it up like IOA did, but the problem with it on Millennium Force was that they filter you right into the line with the people that have been waiting in line. Me and my friend got a few harsh comments from the people behind us who we got filtered infront of. They weren't pleased with people who didn't wait getting to cut infront of them. Once we explained how it worked they calmed down a bit, but the whole situation could've been avoided if they built a separate path like Disney and Universal have done.
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"This time I think ... I think it's ... it's going to work!" - Dr.Bruce Banner
*** This post was edited by IOArules on 6/20/2002. ***
Hello
Coaster Playa, TWO WORDS:
SPEAK ENGLISH!
And, I've never had a conversastion with you, so whatever you are thinking of from the past, is the booz talking.
- And how could I have forgotten? CP would have built Raptor and Mantis with two trains instead of three.
This comment or factor is single handingly the dumbest thing I've ever read. You want to use this as evidence against my theory?
- CP would be removing all of their classic spin-and-spues
I'm not talking about flats -- Flats do help a park, but they don't make or break one. I'm talking coasters here.
- CP would have kept the Jumbo Jet
The reason why J.J. was removed? Space. Inivertingly, allowing more room for CP to build off of Great America.
-(wait a minute, it WAS....but then CP would have built an Intamin tower, not multiple S&S towers, which WOF did first)
Just like I said, CP follows Great America, but has to one up them -- four towers, 100 feet taller.
- CP's Magnum would have had 7-8 loops instead of zero
TRUE, however-- look at the facts: Same company, plus Shockwave was the tallest coaster in the World. CP wants the tallest, gets the same company and Magnum is born.
Fresh from his barely-literate, run-on ramblings and frequent poundings on URC, let's give a big welcome to Attention-Ho-come-lately.
I'm 47 years old-- grow up...be a little mature and SPEAK ENGLISH.
CoasterSmith
RCT InSomniAcS
*** This post was edited by CoasterSmith on 6/20/2002. ***
Coaster Playa, TWO WORDS:SPEAK ENGLISH!
And, I've never had a conversastion....is the booz talking...his comment or factor is single handingly..... Inivertingly, allowing more room for CP to build off of Great America
Inivertingly enough, this is from a guy who tells me to 'speak English'. Make up your own punch line here.
Do I engage in a battle of wits with the witless or take pity on him? After intelligent debates with the likes of Jeff Tolotti (sfogviper) every winter, is this what it's come to? Some embittered, phonetically-challenged home-park fanboy with the flimsiest of theories? It just ain't what it used to be.
Tell you what: Since he has little to no clue about CP's capital expansion history, I explain it so he does. Maybe.
If CP followed SFGAM, then why did SFGAM build American Eagle -- then the tallest racing coaster -- AFTER CP built Gemini, which was the tallest racing coaster in 1978? That's SFGAM following CP's lead. Not to mention CP already had the 'world's tallest' title in the late 70s....years before SFGAM did. Reclaiming the 'world's tallest' title had nothing to do with SFGAM.... or even with PKI, who actually took the title away with Beast.
If CP followed SFGAM's lead, why didn't they redo their Corkscrew to include additional inversions a la Demon?
Why didn't SFGAM build a suspended coaster to CP to copy?
CP had enough space to add a half-dozen more coasters after removing Jumbo Jet, including the sprawling Mean Streak and MF--that's not the reason it was removed. Sorry. And they have yet to build a coaster in the parking lot.
You're old enough to remember that everybody and their mother was hiring Arrow to build those head-rattling multiloopers in the 80s. CP broke the mold by deciding to build the world's first massive steel coaster without loops--which enthusiasts dubbed the 'hypercoaster.' Eventually, more and more companies began copying the idea. By the time SFGAM got around to following the crowd, even tiny CF sister park VF had one up and running. Now who's copying who?
SFGAM was the first to build an inverted coaster and that's that. Other than the Z-force and the orignal Mariott layout concept, that's the only time they weren't following the popular trends themselves. Iron Wolf had been done before at SFMM when Giovanola was brokering B&M's business.
As far as three trains vs two--maybe you don't realize how important that is until you're standing in an hour-plus line for B:TR and Iron Wolf week after week after week. The lower capacity equals long waits all year while CP folks get more ride time for their money.
WOF built a twin S&S tower before SFGAM got around to their Giant Drop ('97)--which they weren't the first to have anyway. CP went for a taller model of the ride one of their sister parks already had.
Still doesn't hold water.
-'Playa
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The CPlaya 100--6 days, 9 parks, 47 coasters, 2037 miles and a winner.....LoCoSuMo.
*** This post was edited by CoastaPlaya on 6/20/2002. ***
Way to go... you guys finally killed it.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"
Closed topic.
