shirtless in parks-how do you feel
How about the sanitary issue? Who here wants to sit down in a coaster train after someone's bare sweaty back was just in it? I have a hard enough time sitting down after someone who's clothes are still wet from their time in the waterpark?
Mike, what the hell is wrong with you? Seriously, you need to chill out just a bit.
Sure, things change over time. What was taboo a century ago may not register at all nowadays. But there are some things that need to stay the way they are for a reason.
Im sure thats the way they thought back then too, now thats not the case.
Dress codes have changed a lot throughout the years but that doesn't mean that the natural wave of change is eventually going to lead us to become a completely nude society in another hundred years.
I dont want society to become a completely nude society, thats a whole different can of beans. Im not talking about nudity, im talking about having the freedom to go shirtless.
Why? Because as perverted as some people are, the vast majority of people don't want to go around having to look at a bunch of fat, ugly naked people.. or naked people at all for that matter.
Not everybody is fat or ugly and even if they are they have as much right to be able to exist and be comfortable in this society without self absorbed stuck up people who have some hangup about looks harassing them or degrading them because they are not on the same level as everybody else.
And how do you maintain that no one is forcing people to look at people that chose to dress any way they choose? The only way to avoid that is to poke my eyes out with rusty nails and I'm not about to do that just so some people can live as you feel men are "intended to live".
You dont see shirtless men everywhere you look, its quite easy to turn and walk the other way and most likely never encounter a shirtless man again for a long time. There are alot of other things that bother people alot more that are much harder to avoid and yet people still find a way to learn how to deal with them weither they want to or not.
Just because things change doesn't mean that we are eventually going to turn into a society without rules.
I realize that, I just dont think there should be as many rules as there are and if there are going to be rules they need to be fair and make sense and be practical. This country is obsessed with rules because of all the fundies who run it.
Whether you care to admit it or not, the majority of people in this world prefer that men wear shirts when in public and just because you feel differently doesn't mean the rules will be altered.
What they prefer or dont prefer doesnt change the fact that men have the right to go shirtless and its perfectly legal so they should be able to do so without getting any trouble from people who happen to dislike it.
Maybe walking into a KFC and downing a 12-piece meal with a hairy gut hanging out is okay in certain parts of this country but in most places bodies are covered with pants and shirts and regardless of how you feel, that's the way it's going to be. Might as well accept that and save yourself the ulcer now.
I dont necessarily think its attractive but then again its not my place to question such things because I feel every man reguardless of his appearance has the right to go shirtless where he pleases. Now hopefully I wish that the man would chose to wear a shirt if he looks like that but if he tells me to go to hell theres not much I can or would want to do about it.
So, speaking of Columbus, OH, it is legal for women to walk around in public without a shirt, just as God intended them to be.
Some places it is, like New York. This is mostly reguarding men though, not women. Most women have the luxury of wearing bikini tops and alot of them wouldnt be caught dead shirtless in a park anyways. if they did want to go shirtless however they have the right to do so too.
But does anybody do it? Outside of the Pride Parade, no. And why not? Because it is a stupid thing to do!
So what? Even if its stupid, its still legal and people still have the right to do it. You cant ban everything just because its stupid otherwise people wouldnt be able to do anything.
Ah but if I am working for the park, and the park policy is that you must be wearing shirts, then it is my job to enforce the policies, weather I agree with them or not.
Sometimes though you have to set your priorities and deal with the more serious issues and let little things go. Park employees let alot of much worse things slip so its not like youre gonna get penalized just for letting a few shirtless customers go by.
And I have said that I do agree that on the midways, shirts should be optional.
Yeah but isnt it annoying to have to put a shirt on and take it off whenever you get to a ride? Dont you feel kind of guilty making people go through that kind of rigorous procedure? I certainly would. I would much rather just take the shirt off and keep it off for the duration. Of course I wouldnt even bother bringing one.
And I don't believe that telling someone to put their shirt on is discrimination, as long as the rules are telling everyone the same thing. Now if a good looking women is walking around without a shirt, and an overweight male is also, but only the male is told to put on a shirt, that is discrimination. But the rules apply to everyone not just to overweight males.
I meant though that if a shirtless man/woman is not allowed into a park but a shirted man/woman is then thats discrimination. Especially if theyre both not doing anything wrong and have both paid to get into the park. Its like you cant deny a christian admittance to a park but let an Athiest in, same thing.
And I don't really see how going shirtless (compared to going "shirted") is a thrill.
Just because its comfortable and I feel more free and uninhibited by unecessary clothing. I also want to be able to exercise my freedoms and rights that people fought so long and hard so I could enjoy. If I dont exercise my freedoms then I run the risk of losing them in the future.
What makes being shirtless so great? Do women (or men, depending on how you swing) throw themselves over you because you're nice and built?
No and I dont care if they did, thats not why I go shirtless. I could care less if people see me shirtless or not.
Are you perpetually hot and the shirt increases your body temperature?
Sometimes. When I get hot or feel uncomfortable I feel I have the right to take my shirt off so I can cool down and feel more comfortable.
Are you too poor to afford clothing so you save money for things like underwear by avoiding the purchase of shirts?
I have plenty of money and clothing, I just chose not to wear as much of it as often as I can. When I can be shirtless more often it also saves me on costs of buying more stuff in the future that I would otherwise need.
Are you aiming for skin cancer?
Perhaps if you enlightened us a little, we'd understand.
No, but if it happens it happens, ill cross that bridge when I get to it. Im gonna die eventually of some form of cancer anyways so I might as well not fret about it and enjoy my life until that time comes.
Dont you feel kind of guilty making people go through that kind of rigorous procedure?
So putting your arms and head through three holes is rigorous? Wow. Walking at the park all day must be a killer. *** Edited 5/24/2006 7:55:26 PM UTC by Sarah Jackson***
And no, I don't feel guilty about people having to put their shirts back on in public when asked. That's just insane.
Thats just it, if it is a rule in the park then the employee has to enforce it. It does not matter weather they agree to it or not, if they are employed by a park, then it is their responsibility to enforce the park rules. No matter what they are.
Then why are so many other rules ignored and not enforced then? If its their duty to enforce it, then why areint they? That never stops them.
And most parks don't hire all people who think the same way they do. With (Cedar point as example) over 2,000 seasonal employees, and most only hired over the phone (and I don't remember a question about whether you think shirts should be aloud in the parks during my interview) finding that amount of people who agree is very unlikely.
I meant they hire people who generally agree with their policies. I wasnt trying to be specific about just the shirt rule I mean overall.
*edit* Most of these businesses are also looking at what mainstream society considers acceptable, not what a minority considers (and yes at this time you are in a minority) *** Edited 5/24/2006 7:35:16 PM UTC by Morté615***
So what? Minorities have rights too and that doesnt change just because the mainstream society doesnt like it. Do people have the rights they do today just because of popular concensus?
What? Amusement park owners ask if you agree with their "must wear shirts" policy before they hire you?
No, not exactly but im sure its a plus if the person does.
Really? I thought they hired people who could check restraints and push a button every 75 seconds. Silly me.
They do but it helps them to have people who are comfortable with the rules or who agree with them enough to be willing to enforce them and less likely to slip on them.
Most park employees probably feel they're underpaid and would like a raise. The consensus among park employees, then, is that they should get a raise. You're telling me that means management feels that way too? That's great news! I'll look forward to my raise later this week.
No, I just meant that if an employee says or acts a certain way people will beleive that is what the management thinks as well. Thats why they have to be careful what they say and do because it reflects on those above them and their other coworkers.
Seriously, your logic is some of the most flawed I've ever seen posted here. You continue to claim it's not a big deal to be shirtless. Then why is it a big deal to wear a shirt?
Because im being forced against my will to cover MY body with something unnatural that I know and feel is totally unecessary.
People who are mature enough to not care about nudity also shouldn't get so worked up about having to wear clothes.
Nudity and shirtlessness are two entirely different things.
True nudists, for example, enjoy being nude but do so in a respectful manner, and don't do it where it's not appropriate and/or allowed. This seems like a maturity issue to me.
Some feel this way but alot just dont go nude in public simply because its illegal not because they want to respect people's wishes. Thats a whole different can of beans though.
Lets say you win the agrument and are now allowed to go shirtless in a park. Are you then going to force the parks to letting you walk around without pants next?
No, I actually like wearing pants. Im content to just go shirtless. Most shirtless people would not be caught dead in public nude.
Just because you want to be a nudist doesn't mean you have a right to force anyone else to conform to what you want.
I want to be shirtless, not a nudist. There's a difference, some people have a hard time seeing that.
Sometimes though you have to set your priorities and deal with the more serious issues and let little things go. Park employees let alto of much worse things slip so its not like you're gonna get penalized just for letting a few shirtless customers go by.
Well this is getting more into my work ethics then. My personal work ethics are to enforce the rules as they are stated. I don't care if I could get away with it or not, thats not the point. I am employed by an employer and the rules that they have handed down are saying you must wear a shirt, then I am going to enforce that rule. That is my job. That is one of the things I was hired to do.
And I have said that I do agree that on the midways, shirts should be optional.
Yeah but isn't it annoying to have to put a shirt on and take it off whenever you get to a ride? Don't you feel kind of guilty making people go through that kind of rigorous procedure? I certainly would. I would much rather just take the shirt off and keep it off for the duration. Of course I wouldn't even bother bringing one.
Yes i can see where it would be annoying, but there are both health and safety issues involved in wearing shirts on a ride. Lets start with safety:
Shirts offer another degree of protection. Even thin t-shirts can be the difference between a scratch, cut, or worse.
Also a shirt offers protection from your hairs getting caught on bolts and other items, and from being ripped out when you get up (not much I know, but it hurts>
And move into health:
There are types of disease that can be transfered more easily from direct contact with the skin. Again a t-shirt offers protection from those.
Sweat also carries bacteria that might be harmless to you but not necessarily to the next person in line behind you.
Morté aka Matt, Ego sum nex
Dragon's Fire Design: http://www.dragonsfiredesign.com
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/mattdrake
The thought of sitting on someones butt-sweat is fairly gross.
Its just sweat like from anywhere else. Besides if you see it on the seat, how do you know its butt sweat? You cant be grossed out by it if you dont know thats what it is.
So putting your arms and head through three holes is rigorous? Wow. Walking at the park all day must be a killer.
It is for someone who goes shirtless often and is an important part of their life and when its hot outside is told to put a shirt back on dispite the heat and the fact that being shirtless isnt harming anyone. If you did it alot and felt the way I feel youd understand.
Geez, I didn't think you were serious enough to respond to everything. Holy sh**! I really don't have anything else to say and don't think it's because I agree with you, it's just because you're a lot more bent than I originally gave you credit for. I can't believe that you feel a society that pushes men to wear shirts in public is on the verge of causing you to lose all of your freedoms.
Well there are other reasons why I feel freedoms are being lost in this society but im trying to keep the posts relevant. Its not just that.
And no, I don't feel guilty about people having to put their shirts back on in public when asked. That's just insane.
I would feel guilty because I know how it feels when im asked to put a shirt on when I dont want to and know its not hurting anyone. I couldnt ask anyone to do that. I dont care what the rules are. Of course I wouldnt tell the employer that ;)
I meant they hire people who generally agree with their policies. I wasn't trying to be specific about just the shirt rule I mean overall.
So did I, I just used that as an example because that is what we are talking about. But the whole point of working at a park like CP (or any where else, park or otherwise) is that you are expected to enforce the rules.
Then why are so many other rules ignored and not enforced then? If its their duty to enforce it, then why areint they? That never stops them.
So just because some people decide not to do their jobs, you expect everyone not to. So just because some people didn't check some harnesses on a ride, you expect me not to.
So what? Minorities have rights too and that doesnt change just because the mainstream society doesnt like it. Do people have the rights they do today just because of popular concensus?
Aww but telling you to put on a shirt does not infringe on your rights, as long as everyone else is being told the same thing.
Which at the bottom of it is what should be happening, now if one or two (or more) people are not enforcing the rules, it does not matter they are the rules.
Morté aka Matt, Ego sum nex
Dragon's Fire Design: http://www.dragonsfiredesign.com
Facebook: http://www.facebook.com/mattdrake
As the train crests the lift hill, they let loose one of the biggest farts in history, sounding even louder due to lack of clothing. It'd be loud against those plastic seats. Do you think it would trip the E-breaks?
:)
Great Lakes Brewery Patron...
-Mark
Wow... you really find putting on a shirt to be a pain in the a$$, huh?
"I'm sorry honey, I'd really love to watch TV with you tonight but I'm way too tired. I had a rough day of taking off my shirt and putting it back on. Do you have any idea what that's like?"
They do but it helps them to have people who are comfortable with the rules or who agree with them enough to be willing to enforce them and less likely to slip on them.
Anyone who has ever held a job knows that's not true. Employers couldn't care less whether their employees agree with the rules or not; they only care whether their employees enforce them or not. When is the last time you had a job interviewer run through the work place rules to see if you agree with them or not? I'm guessing never.
No, I just meant that if an employee says or acts a certain way people will beleive that is what the management thinks as well.
But now you've changed your story. You said that when people told you to put your shirt on it's because they have some hatred or prejudice for shirtless people. But now you've flat-out admitted that's not true, because you've admitted it's only the attitudes of the lower-level park employees that you can perceive. Thanks for playing.
Nudity and shirtlessness are two entirely different things
Yes and no. There are enough similarities that you can use one as an example for the other. I wasn't suggesting you were a nudist, just that your attitudes toward the human body and intentions were similar. The difference, however, is that nudists seem to be able to respect the fact that sometimes and some places, it just isn't appropriate to be nude (or shirtless). You, on the other hand, are unable to do this.
-Nate
Rob Ascough said:
Without pants... does that mean without boxers too?
Yes, Rob, without boxers. It's the new coaster from B&M called "Commando."
Closed topic.
