SFGAM 6/23..never again. NEVER!

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It was 98 degrees at SFGAm yesterday. I don't DO water rides, but we did yesterday!!

But I digress. Before we went in, we had two extra free tickets to give away. Found nice family with two teenage boys and gave the tix to them. Got some good karma there, maybe.

Got in at 9:45 and waited at the chain for a chance to go to V2. And waited and waited. It was 10:05 when they finally dropped the chain. Got two V2 laps right away. It was slow on the launch both times. Maybe WT has spoiled me, but V2 was MUCH slower than I remembered.

Next up, Eagle. It was "on the way" to Bull. Only backwards is running. We get up to platform and realize this. Back down ALL those stairs to Midway. This place is NOT friendly to those of us who don't walk so well.

Demon is also "on the way" to Bull so we hit that in the back for a nice pop of air on the drop. I love this ride. Aging VERY well for an Arrow looper.

Off to Bull we went. A nice, SLOW, leisurely ride in the back. What is UP with this?? Heavy trims and no air. Not the Bull *I* know and love!!

Then to Viper. Back seat of train. WOW the air!! THIS is what a woodie should be!! Amazing stand-up air. Someone knew what they were doing whn they drew plans for this baby!! And the wildflower landscaping in the queue is JUST beuatiful. Like a nature walk in the park.

Check the line for DelayJaVu on our way to County Fair Market. 2 and 1/2 hours. Nope. Sorry. We'll wait til next time.

Get some fries (VERY good fries) and then hit Roaring Rapids or whatever it's called now. Great ride, got REALLY soaked, which we needed desperately. NOW starts the stuff that makes me say "Never again" to this park.

We wait an hour to get to the platform. The people in front of us were idiots. Sitting down in line, not paying attention the the line moving in front of them, etc. So we got to the platform and we are sent to the same boat as these wonders of intelligence. They all decide they want their OWN SEAT on the boat!! The ride op was just as stupid as these people were. They REFUSED to move to let us in and the ride op just stood there!! Meanwhile the platform is revolving, we are getting closer to the edge and we end up displacing others in the next boat!!

We ended up with a great group and it was a lot of fun.

Off to V2 to dry off a bit. Had a better ride, as she had warmed up a bit. Day is looking up a little.

Time to check in at home. Now comes the "NEVER AGAIN" part...go to phone by bathrooms next to Funnel Cake Foundry. Look on ground. Pile of HUMAN EXCREMENT on ground in middle of path to bathrooms!! EWWWWW does not even BEGIN to describe it. Find other phones and make call. Will report this to park later.

Back to Eagle. Get best ride in YEARS on it. Red side. Racing Blue side. Great time had by all. Day improves slightly.

On to Splashwater Falls as it is right there and we are dry by now. Hardly get wet at all, even on bridge. People are walking up the exit ramp to stand on bridge. NO EMPLOYEE stationed there to stop them. Some people have been there the whole time we were in line!! I guess that sign about being on bridge for ONE SPLASH only really does the job. Another one in the "never again" column. If you want to get wet, wait in line!!!

Back to Bull for one more lap, as I was tired and my bad leg was acting up. (All those darn STAIRS!)

10 minute wait for Bull. THANK YOU DEJAVU!! Seems everyone was in line for THAT instead. Got GREAT back seat ride on Bull. Seems Bull warmed up a bit too. Light trims and great air. Thought about another one but the line had built up a bit. So off to Viper for another one.

Notice that Bull has gone down on our trip up to the station. 5 minute wait for back seat. Another great ride. I noticed the "whoosh"ing noise Viper makes in the back. Really adds to it.

A quick spin on Whizzer. Sit right over the motor. Very cool. If they ever take this away I am REALLY never going back. Heck, I'm at that point now!!

We are DONE for the day. HOT. Tired. Frustrated. Hungry. Two spins on Columbia Carousel and out of there.

Columbia looks GREAT with the restoration work being done on it. Looks like it did when it was new.

From our seats in the upstairs, we see kids IN THE REFLECTING POOL, picking up the money people throw in there!! No employees to stop them. Another one in the "never agian" column.

A couple of highlights, tho. The water stand guy giving us free ice just because we asked for it. The "water cannon" op on RR shooting us MULTIPLE times. Bull crew trying to rival Raptor crew for efficiency. DeJaVu making shorter lines for everything else. Water rides had something to do with that too.

SFGAm has a lot of work to do. They need MORE employees at certain places to keep things under control. We saw LOTS of line-jumping, lots of LOUD swearing, LOTS of gang-bangers and lots of inappropriate clothing.

Seems as though it just attracts a lower class of clientele than CP or WDW. Is it the close proximity to Chicago?? I love Chicago, don't get me wrong, but why the excessive amount of gang-bangers, hoochies with "Honey Buns" printed on the back of their short-shorts and people yelling profanities in front of children?

We noticed the "park ranger" type guards around. Why can't they put one of them at the exit ramp to SWF and keep the encroachers at bay? Why not put one of them at the reflection pool and keep people out of there?

It's the LITTLE things that help make a park great. It's not just the rides. It's the whole experience. If it wasnt for the fact that our tickets were FREE, I'd be even MORE upset than I am.

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Just call me MPG...

I agree that SFGAm needs more employees to handle some of the issues you mentioned. It's definitely not perfect. But, IMHO, the issues you point out are minor in the grand scheme of things.

It seems to me that you had a great time riding but are bashing the park because of the clientele. Heck, if I stopped going to parks because of unruly clientele, I'd eliminate virtually ever park I've been to. Even the almighty CP.

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Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former." - Albert Einstein
Favorite Wood: Viper(SFGAm), Legend (HW)
Favorite Steel: MF (CP), Mamba (WoF)

I grew up going to SFGAm and have gone every year since then. (since 1976..that's 25 years) I have seen it go downhill every year.

I'm sorry, but any park that has clientele that would remove their own excrement from the facitilies and put it on the ground outside the bathrooms is NOT for me. This is BEYOND unruly. It is NASTY and NOT a place I wish to patronize. I will drive to CP or MIA. At least they are clean and safe.

I have a choice not to go to SFGAm and I am choosing to exercise it, just as you would if you hit that "last straw" point. I continually give SFGAm another chance every year. This was my second trip this year. Two chances and this one really blew it. A 50% is an "F" in my book.

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Just call me MPG...

*** This post was edited by MagnificentPaganGoddess on 6/24/2002. ***

I agree with you 100% about the excrement issue. That's extremely disgusting. But what would you have the park do? Follow everyone into the restrooms? Hire additional employees to stand at every restroom? I guess that would be possible.

But then what? It sounds to me like you want employees in every que line. By every fountain and tree. By every bank of phones, ATMs, etc. You want "gang-bangers" to be restricted from entering the park. But that would be discrimation and won't happen. Basically we'd be looking at a concentration camp. Security everywhere. I'm betting that won't happen.

Of course you have every right to not go again. And I would be the last to try and convince you otherwise and the first to defend your right not to go. I just don't think you can police any park the way it sounds like you believe they should be. And, as I mentioned earlier, I've seen the exact same things (minus the excrement) happen at every park I've been to including CP, PKI, MIA, etc., etc., etc.

Here's a fun game you can play with your friends...the next time you go to a park, count the number of non-minivan vehicles in the parking lot that retail for over $35K. You won't find many, I guarantee it. Now, go into the park and count the number of patrons wearing offensive clothing and/or smoking in line. The second number will be about 10 times the second number.

Now the point of this exercise, other than giving Buzzers a chance to label me as a classist again, is that your average parkgoer is not of the upper crust of society. There's nothing wrong with that, as long as you understand that going in. If you have the right attitude about your day, you can have a great time despite the rudeness of the other parkgoers.

Many people that go to a park think that they have a god-given right to break the rules, annoy other guests, and be rude to employees because they paid their $42 to get in. I can't count the number of times I've heard parkgoers screaming at the top of their lungs, "Do you know how much I paid to get in?" like they were the only ones who paid admission that day.

My advice is to enjoy the rides and forget about the rude guests.

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Proud CB club member

MagnificentPaganGoddess said:Seems as though it just attracts a lower class of clientele than CP or WDW. Is it the close proximity to Chicago??

Ok...and I've seen some at CP. It's so weird, I had no problem with SFGAm. And I still stand by the fact, it's the more quality Six Flags park.

Well...Sorry, you didnt have a good time

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Dayuum, Your HOT!

When it is the rude guests that ruin the experience for everyone else, it is hard to just ignore it. When others in line with you, total strangers, are complaining of the same thing, it is hard to ignore it.

I am not saying that SFGAm should do the things that DEK so sarcastically suggested, but I AM saying that maybe they need to up the security and the employee presence just a little bit.

Is that too much to ask for the $42 dollars that people pay for the "privilege" of going there?? I think not. I mean, where does that $42 dollars go anyway??

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Just call me MPG...

MagnificentPaganGoddess said:

I am not saying that SFGAm should do the things that DEK so sarcastically suggested, but I AM saying that maybe they need to up the security and the employee presence just a little bit.
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Just call me MPG...

I'm sorry if my comments came off as sarcastic. I honestly wasn't trying to be. I actually was putting those questions out there for anyone to comment on.. I should have used some smileys to lighten the mood. :)

I really would be interested in hearing what you and others would have the parks (not just SF) do to help with these problems.

And I'm not so sure these people feel the need to be rude, obnoxious, and disgusting just because they've paid to get in. I've seen the same behavior at free venues like parks, beaches, and even walking down the street. I believe it's more a problem of our society as a whole not just in paid venues.

Having been to both WDW/Universal FLA and SFGAM numerous times and even BGW several times and comparing the guests IMHO SFGAM does attract a lower class visiter which does detract from the experience and one reason why i never go on weekdends, too many teenagers running around un supervised and not enough employee's too clamp down on them. The problems the person who started the thread saw i have never seen at WDW or BGW. I think this happens at SFGAM and is due to the lower ticket prices and probably season pass sales. But the problems you have mentioned i dont find happen that much on week days and i havent experienced those problems this year yet, so maybe you went on a bad day. But whenever i do go i hear way too much swearing and i see attire often that i dont think belongs in a theme park, but i am older that alot on this board(41yoa) so im certain that will make people's opinion differ on this subject. But i woudlnt blame Chicago for this, i think SFGAM markets in a way that attracts a lower clientele than the earlier parks i mentioned.

were people shooting at each other in the park? if not, please tell me how you determined that they were gang bangers? or did you simply stereotype a group of guests based upon some other factor?

i encounter similar problems this weekend at PKD and noticed misbehavior from a number of people across all racial and gender lines and probably socio-economical status as well. i could certainly understand your frustration and of course you're entitled to your own opinions, but your reference to gang-bangers and hoochies gives me a better idea of what your real problem was with the park.

I gotta relate this story. Last Friday my wife and I were standing in line for Thunderbolt at Kennywood. It was not a long line, didn't even extend to the bottom of the ramp that leads into the station. Anyway, we were waiting there and this group of kids (all between 8 and 14 I would say), come past "excuse us... excuse us... excuse us..." They went into the station and "rejoined" a group of older kids there. Then another group came by... "excuse us... excuse us... excuse us...". My wife pointed them out to the employee at the top of the ramp (who was not there when they came up) The employee went over to them and informed them that they had to exit and go to the back of the line. This made their older friend mad and she was getting loud in the station and wanted to know "who snitched!?!" (Funny... by saying "who snitched" she admitted she knew they line jumped... but was upset because someone "snitched") The employee went over to her and explained the rules to her and also informed her that if she did not settle down she was going to call security.

Also, at Six Flags Darien Lake, we noticed that the ride ops were very persistant on warning people via the loudspeakers in the stations not to line jump and not to sit on the railings.

Why do I mention this... simply to say that I have a feeling that it will vary in different parks. Location may have something to do with it... (SFGrAm is near Chicago... but then again, Kennywood is in a suburb of Pittsburgh)... but I believe that it is more dependent on the park. Some chose to enforce the rules... some chose to be a little lax... some practically don't care.

Concerning the price of tickets: Comparing three parks here... Six Flags Darien Lake, Six Flags America and BGW.

For around $60, you can get a season pass for each of these parks (the regular season pass for the SF parks and the Summer Sizzler for BGW). Each of the three parks have a different clientel... SFA has a bit more of a rough and tumble clientel... BGW has an older and more family crowd... and we found in our recent visit that SFDL has a good mix... some kids, some families (of course, we were also there on a day when every school in the western NY area seemed to have a bus at the park). The main difference... location. SFA in a DC suburb and not far from Baltimore (urban / suburban setting)... SFDL, 20 miles from Buffalo NY (rather rural)... BGW, 40 miles from Norfolk area and 20 or so from Richmond, but a vacation destination.

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"I wasn't always this cynical, but then I started kindergarden..."

*** This post was edited by SLFAKE on 6/24/2002. ***

R U kidding me!!! This is an awesome park.I know it may have some issues,but that's not always is only sometimes .The times i've been there Everything was fine.Don't give people the wrong idea of the park. :)

The prominently dipslayed gang tattoos were a real giveaway. I used to live in a gang-infested area of Chicago. I know what they are.

The hoochies were determined by the braless, butt-cheeks hanging out, sleazy attire. When your clothing is too small to cover what should be covered (and this is coming from a former lingerie model), it is inapropriate for a "family" park. I used the word "hoochies" because I lacked a better term.

My suggestion for SFGAm to improve on the problems they have, not just withthe customers, but the park in general is to take some of that $42 that people pay to get in and invest in more and better employees, rather than in rides that only work SOME of the time. A good, VIGILANT staff can do wonders for crowd control.

I firmly believe that CP and WDW have so little of this problem becuase you see so many SWEEPS there. Yes, sweeps!! Sometimes just the sight of an employee can deter some unruly behavior. Yesterday I saw ONE sweep. ONE. And he was underneath the Whizzer. Yeah, that grass under there really needed sweeping. I feel that if the sweeps are vigilant, and the other employees are too, than problems are fewer.

This is just my opinion, but it's also something I've noticed.

And yes, I think that SFGAm is one of those parks that just doesn't care.

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Just call me MPG...

*** This post was edited by MagnificentPaganGoddess on 6/24/2002. ***

Wow, I was there on the 19th and 20th, last week, and I saw nothing like you described as seeing. I was a little ticked off that I stood in line for Deja Vu for an hour and then they closed it the rest of the night on Thursday, ( we were right at the air gates) due to malfunctions. I saw maybe a couple of line jumpers, but that was it. This is my favorite park right along with Indiana Beach! Last year when we went to Fright Fest, I saw alot of Hispanics and chinese people, but noone that looked like they wanted to blow someone's head off BTW, Every ride in the park was in operation except for that great standy-by, Deja Vu, which is really really making me mad by always breaking down when I'm in line to ride.

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Beer, my soon to be wife, coasters, and the FREEDOM OF SPEECH. Is this a great country or what!!
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stoogemanmoe and places to get discount Six Flags Great America tickets!

*** This post was edited by stoogemanmoe on 6/24/2002. ***

Raging Bull is one of my favorite coasters, but even I'll admit that the people who say the coaster has *LOADS* of airtime might have amenisa and are talking about a different coaster, Nice air on the first drop, and the second dip after the brake run. That's pretty much it.

Mark W. Baruth said:

Here's a fun game you can play with your friends...the next time you go to a park, count the number of non-minivan vehicles in the parking lot that retail for over $35K. You won't find many, I guarantee it. -----------------

What the hell does the cost of vehicles have to do with any thing?Are you trying to imply that people that can afford more expensve cars wont act uncivilized in a park.Is that how you measure the way people will behave

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I just want to ride as many coasters as posible

sfmm15 said:

Mark W. Baruth said:

Here's a fun game you can play with your friends...the next time you go to a park, count the number of non-minivan vehicles in the parking lot that retail for over $35K. You won't find many, I guarantee it. -----------------

What the hell does the cost of vehicles have to do with any thing?Are you trying to imply that people that can afford more expensve cars wont act uncivilized in a park.Is that how you measure the way people will behave
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I just want to ride as many coasters as posible

I took this reference to mean that people that can afford expensive (relative) cars don't go to an amusement park at all. They'll opt for more expensive vacations or venues.

But then again, I could be wrong about what was meant. :)

I have to agree here. SFGAm HAS gone downhill over the years while CP and other parks have done nothing but improve. Also, on the cleanliness issue, I feel that if a park is really clean, people are less likely to mess it up.

There is no excuse for human waste being outside the bathrooms like that.

*** This post was edited by illinoiscpfan on 6/24/2002. ***

DEK, you got it right. sfmm15, lighten up.

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Proud CB club member

sfmm15 is right. High cost cars doesn't mean civilized people. Last year, a mother and friend/sister/something like that were cutting. They were obviously "soccer mom" type people. Sorry for stereotyping, but it just makes it easier. They were the most rude, ignorant, stupid, and *****y people I saw that whole day... I'd say it's safe to say they probably had a nice Caravan sitting in the parking lot. I just hope it was being vandalized. Thats a good way to keep line jumpers down... lol. Find a way to track everyone and what car they have. If they line jump, a security guard vandalizes it. lol... Too bad there'd be some big law suits...

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