SFDL announces new attraction

So what if their other coasters are clones? A clone is still a coaster, which is better than nothing.

-Just to be nit-picky, S:ROS isn't technically a clone, it's a mirrored version of the one at SFA. And on another note, SFDL's was built prior to SFA's, meaning that it is actually the original. ;)

Something is better than nothing. Good thing SF Great Adventure is only 2 hours away. ;) Thats where all their money is going this year anyway. I am going to try to make it there more than my normal 1 or 2 visits a season.

Viper is an arrow headbanger and the other coasters are clones.

There are no clones of DL's SROS, although SFA's version is a mirror image. And really now who other than us enthusiasts is gonna know there is a similar Superman a couple hundred miles to the southeast? Its a non-issue.

mOOSH [who does think SFDL is deserving of a new ride of some sort]

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rentzy17 said:Now you SFDL peeps can stop b*tching! You got an Intamin hyper 6 years ago and now you are getting a pro-slide tornado! What more do you people want?!

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What more do I want? Here we go... Multiple trains on all coasters all the time (except Boomerang, obviously). Predator to be returned to the great ride it once was, with some trains that don't tear the track apart; make that plaque in the station boasting a #9 in the world (from 1991 or something) ranking believable. An S&S tower. I want something launched, hell give us the old Tidal Wave/Greased Lightning sitting in the SFMW parking lot! Or better yet, a Rocket ala StormRunner or a monster Impulse with improved supports... I want SRoS to be painted, and the springs in the wheel assemblies to be replaced to get rid of that shuffling, not to mention the lake filled back up so you dive towards water with mist instead of scum. I want Mind Eraser to either reinstall the on ride photos or get rid of the booth that looks like hell. I want FrightFest to consist of more than just a bunch of cornstalks, a tired show, and the same haunted house (although the bit where they hang someone is pretty wild). Anyone else remember the train, pre-SRoS? Why not start another train or a skyride across one of the lakes that would bring you to a whole new part of the park, only accessible by train? Could be the first Huss Land of the Giants... I know they already have a baby TopSpin, but Great Escape would love that... How about something sweet from B&M, a Floorless ala Hydra or a Flyer? I've been saying for a couple years since I rode it at SFMM, give us Flashback, paint it black with yellow ties, paint the trains black with a little theme, and call it Batmobile. Other than the 5 or 6 SFDL fans here, everyone would think it's a new coaster. Lose the Batman Stunt Show. Lets get a sweet dark ride in that building, maybe another Batman ride. Even though I'm not a fan, build the waterpark back to the size it was as Barracuda Bay (Tornado is a start), it means less people in line ahead of me for Batmobile and SRoS... And finally, finally, FINALLY, set up some sort of incentive program for their employees to do a better job. Ya know, a $.25 raise ain't a whole lot to get excited about. Maybe some sort of end of year bonus, like CP, or more employee perks would pick up the spirits of some of these kids. I know I go out of my way to praise people for a job well done, and I wish more people would do the same. Especially their employers. So you asked. Now you know what else I want... C'mon Six Flags, make me proud... *** Edited 12/5/2004 8:56:22 AM UTC by ShaneDenmark***

Just so you all know. Funnel slides are fun.

Would you rather the park to close it's doors forever.....

The park would have to start drawing more than 1.4 million people per year if you want a rocket or an impulse, or even a Floorless or Flyer, though SF isn't the most economically intelligent of parks, they do realize that 10 million dollars is 10 million dollars, and the better get a return on that money, and at Darien Lake, that return may take a loooong time. I personally had no problem whatsoever with Superman, and I think that most SF parks have weak Halloween celebrations, certainly no HHN.

25 cent raise isn't much, Im just guessing here, the park is open an average of 10 hours a day, 120 total days out of the year (Just guessing, work with me) and if it staffed with 750 people at a time, that works out to $225,000, all for a little monetary incentive. But then again, thats just with total estimates.

Oh, I agree with you, that park needs a lot of improvements, I agree with you, but I wouldn't exactly think that they are about to venture into the land of Rockets and Flyer's. Not yet.

RamblinWreck, I agree that they aren't gonna just jump into Rockets & Impulses. But, there are a lot of other things I listed that may improve attendance ever so slightly, such as fixing up the coasters they do have, a new train, a relocated coaster (remember my Tidal Wave and Batmobile proposals?)... Start small. Maybe thats what they are doing with Tornado. Show that new attractions and improvements will bring in more people. Then, say every fourth or fifth year, so something big. A Rocket or Impulse, for example... Hey, I'm not complaining that SFDL hasn't gotten a new coaster since SRoS. The park isn't a flagship park, and probably never will be. But you have to spend money to make money. Personally I'd rather see them maintain what they have a little better, then bring in some new toys instead of watching this nice new shiny coaster become a shell of itself in 5 years, i.e. SRoS and Predator. As for Tidal Wave and Flashback, like I said in another post about Shockwave @ SFGAm being scrapped, they'd make more money being put SOMEWHERE instead of rotting in a pile (Tidal Wave) or being a huge lawn ornament (Flashback)... Hey, for that matter, here's another idea... Send us STE from SFMM... They can't afford the electricity in California. We don't need the support to make it a 400' ride, just use it at ground level. Then, they could recreate the same general ride with a Rocket (Superman The Revenge?), have the launch at the top of the mountain, go up 300' into a top hat, then down 415', twisting the opposite direction from which you came... In other words, if you were to bank to the right into the top hat, you'd crest the hill and bank 90 to the right again, and continue on... Maybe a huge Immelman or Dive Loop to return you back towards the mountain and up to the station, I dunno... I'm going off on a tangent here... But the point being, spend a little money to see if there's a market. After bringing in a few more people for a few years, hit them with something big and shiny and new... Then you'll see huge spikes in attendance.

Coasterbruh- Who said anything about them closing their doors forever? What's that all about?

RamblinWreck- To touch on another point, say your estimates are correct about the $.25 raises... Instead of a piddly raise across the board for 750 seasonals I would set up an incentive program so the top 2% would see a bonus. Customer satisfaction, safety, etc would all factor in. So now instead of everyone getting an extra $300 over the course of the season, they would all strive to be better to get a slice of that $225,000. Say the top 150 performers got an equal cut (I'd do something on a sliding scale at the end of the season, but thats just me) it would work out to $1500 each. Not a bad chunk of change for a summer's bonus, eh?

It's the chicken & the egg...

...You say SFDL can't really warrent a big-name coaster (B&M, rocket... etc) with a 1.3 or 1.4 mil attendance... yet you can't bring up the attendance without bringing in a big-name ride. The peek of Darien Lake's attendance was 1.75 million in 1999 when they added Superman & converted to Six Flags.

...to bring back that attendance & surpass that, Six Flags would have to bite the bullet & invest into this park. It would bring in a lot of revenue... more so than most parks with the same attendance figures because
1) There's a lot of up-charge attractions...
2) There's a lot of on-site accomidations.. and
3) It's the only big game in town.

Which will come first? If Six Flags doesn't put a big investment into the park, attendance will dwindle to just a little over a million in a couple years... if not less.

I agree with all of you who is unhappy with SFDL, but I hope CF is still thinking about buying more parks, and mabe my wish will come true someday and they will buy SFDL. Then I will beable to buy a CF season pass and go to CP,GL, and DL

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ShaneDenmark said:
But, there are a lot of other things I listed that may improve attendance ever so slightly...

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Prove it. I mean, whatever it is has to demonstrate significant return on investment, and for this company, it has to come quickly. Given the geography, I suspect that they're about as high as they're going to be attendance wise, and they may have research to prove it. (Hold your laughter, I know we're talking about Six Flags. :))

Besides, water parks put butts in the park.

Yes, water parks do bring people, but SFDL's has decreased in size over the last 5 years. A Tornado is a nice start, but how about replacing the other slide complexes that have been removed over the years?

I would hesitate to call it a waterpark.

To Moosh, I was commenting on why I havent been back. When I was a kid my Dad took myself and my cousin camping for a weekend. Predator was brand new and incredible, viper was great cause we didnt have anything better. We had a great time.

Since Six Flags came in, they installed two painfull coasters, one good hyper and let Predator fall apart along with a couple flats, one very poorly placed. Not to mention the operations are terrible.

If they were a better park with more unique rides I would have made the trip back from Pittsburgh this year, and brought friends with me.

With the hotel and campground I would think they would try and attract out of the area customers. Adding a funnel slide to a non existant waterpark isnt doing it for me

SFDL needs to add something major after this in a couple of years,one thing about ROI is that any park can make up the ROI on an attraction it's just that some parks may take a little longer than others.

Sure SFDL may not be able to draw many new customers by adding something as large as say a coaster but they can still see a continuing profit from repeat guests.....these are the guests that the park will lose entirely in the future if they don't get their act together soon & add that new coaster or ground breaking flat ride.

Adding a tornado slide may very well be a good move for the park at the present time,same thing for SFKK...SFA on the other hand is doing a minor rennovation to it's waterpark which will also feature a proslide tornado & in addition to that a proslide mammoth(whatever that is) along with minor upgrades to the kids cove area but that's about it,these new additions will help bring guests into all three of the above mentioned parks but soon a new coaster will need to be added,especially at SFA after HP added SR.

As is I would've taken a new coaster over waterpark improvements first & I'm suprised they didn't lose a majority of their potential guests this year by not trying to combat HP's recent additions,adding a couple of new waterslides isn't going to draw anywhere near as many guests as a new coaster would've.

ShaneDenmark, the one thing that makes me more skeptical than anything about the plan is that you say that attendance will really spike. From what I gained in my trip, the Buffalo area isn't doing to well economically, so can they really expect to draw even 2 million? I agree, small improvements all around the park are nice, and very important, but I'm still a little cautious to say that the park will have a dramatic turnaround. Also, the location kinda sucked, at least it seemed like that to me. It is pretty far out of the way of Buffalo, and the area that it is in isn't all that populated. It is a pretty good trip to get there... that's what Im saying. Now, Im also mixed on that, because it is about halfway (Just estimating, I haven't been there but once) to Rochester, which seemed to be a mid-sized city (from my one trip there), but its still a long haul IMO. I know that parks like Great America, and even Magic Mountain are quite a bit outside of the cities that they cover, but they have a lot more to offer, and the second and third largest metro areas in the nation, behind NYC.

As much as I'd like to see that park improve, because it had the potential, it will probably be in the same boat as SFA, SFEG, SFAW, and even SFStl... parks that haven't gotten anything in a while and are going down hill :(

Let's just get off the whole SFA thing, no one knows what they are getting except that it will be in the waterpark. Everything is just rumors right now. And SFA isn't going downhill, 2003 was the first time since the park was converted that the attendance went down, and the reason legitimatly was the weather...it was ALL rain and cold all that summer as anyone who lives in the Balt/Wash area can attest to.

As for SFDL, I find it funny that they prepare to make an announcement for a new attraction and so many people complain. I mean, honestly, the park has Superman, one of the best steel coasters in the country.

Then again the fact that they have a hotel AND a campground should tell you something...the park can't survive on local attendance alone. They NEED the hotel and campground to pull people in from further away...maybe that's it, maybe they're not building anything at the park to make up for the amount they spent on the hotel... *** Edited 12/5/2004 6:19:15 PM UTC by Coaster Lover***

Superman was very good, but probably could have been better. Then again, I went on it a few days after my first experience with Millennium Force, so that may have killed my experience right there.

Also, I know the campground was there pre-SF, and I think the hotel might have been as well.

The park needs a lot of sprucing up, in every area, and with only one above average coaster, it really stands out as a key to improvement.

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Jeff said:
Prove it. I mean, whatever it is has to demonstrate significant return on investment, and for this company, it has to come quickly. Given the geography, I suspect that they're about as high as they're going to be attendance wise, and they may have research to prove it. (Hold your laughter, I know we're talking about Six Flags. )

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Unfortunately, I can't "prove it" until something is tried... But again, here's a small investment that could have a huge return, move that shuttle loop from SFMW's parking lot and set it up at SFDL... Paint it, theme it a little. Ya know what people's biggest gripe in western NY is about SFDL? They don't ever expand, they don't get anything new. Anyone know what it would cost to move a small, already disassembled coaster across the country and set it up? I'm guessing not much...

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DawgByte II said:
It's the chicken & the egg...

...You say SFDL can't really warrent a big-name coaster (B&M, rocket... etc) with a 1.3 or 1.4 mil attendance... yet you can't bring up the attendance without bringing in a big-name ride. The peek of Darien Lake's attendance was 1.75 million in 1999 when they added Superman & converted to Six Flags.

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See, I didn't say that though. What I said was make small improvements to show that improvements will increase attendance, revenue, etc. Small investments would likely equal small increases... Then, after a few of these small additions, go for the home run. I still say ya gotta spend money to make money.