New RCT3 SOAKED Information:
Jeff - Editor - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog
TeknoScorpion said:
And moosh, I'm so not your friend if Infy is ;).
Actually Clint, I'm a friend of Dorothy's.
-Jimvy!;) - missed this one ages ago lol
Impulse-ive said:
If they built a clone of Viper/SoB/RC-48 with a different paint job, are you going to assume it's going to be wonderful, smooth, exciting and the new #1 (and not just Paul Reuben's #1 ... )I explained it earlier Gonch, kickbacks ;)
Since you bring it up...To use a coaster example. After Mr. Freeze was built everyone thought that Speed would be a rough unridable coaster. It was not.
Companies can learn from their mistakes. Those that don't are doomed to fail. Which category Frontier is in, remains to be seen. But they are breaking out of the cycle that Gonch mentioned with the institution of a beta test this time around. And it sounds like they are at least TRYING to resolve the problems. And they are a heck of a lot more responsive to request they say E.A. or most any other publisher would be. So I would say progress is being made.
As for the ridiculous kickback comment - Give it a rest. You DO realize that other people can have differing opinions without being on the take right?
Mamoosh said:
Oh, and Greg...if you haven't figured it out yet Invy, Tekno, and Gonch are friends of mine, too ;)
No, I didn't. Thanks for telling me. And here I thought asprin was your only friend. ;)
TUNNELS!!!
Something much requested by most everyone. Shows that they are at least willing to listen and try. Which is more then what I can say for other companies or sadly even certain other people.
Oh...and Moosh...that's not what I've heard. ;)
The funniest part is that tunnels are one thing you will not find a single complaint from me on.
If missing tunnels were one of the major issues with the game, we'd be in good shape. :)
I'll chalk it up as another solution to a problem that doesn't exist (for me, at least), while much more glaring issues remain unresolved.
Then again, for as much as I hate the game I sure do make an awful lot of nice stuff with it. ;)
Although, your latest post does even make me start to wonder why you're so dead set on convincing the 10 or 20 hardcore fans of the series here at CB that the game is good. I know we give you a hard time with the 'kickback' jokes, but seriously, the couple of dozen people who care enough to chime in here are nothing compared to the hundreds at the Atari Forum who are quite satisfied and even anticpate Soaked. Seems weird that you care enough to keep coming back to try and convince us.
Just saying.
Lord Gonchar said:
Although, your latest post does even make me start to wonder why you're so dead set on convincing the 10 or 20 hardcore fans of the series here at CB that the game is good.
OMG. Gonch, I really like your post here and the things you say. I really do. But you are fustrating me here on this issue.
Please explain where keeping an open mind somehow = me saying that the game IS good. How would I know how it is? It's not even done yet.
The ONLY thing I'm trying to convince people of, is that they should HAVE AN OPEN MIND. Not that the game is good. I don't even know if that is true or not myself yet! So I am certainly not going to try to convince someone that it is.
But it's clear to me that Atari/Frontier has made at least SOME effort to please people. I can't fault them for that.
Also you'd have to understand my personality Gonch. I HATE pre-judging. It's a hot button issue for me on any subject. I just think the world would be a nicer place if everyone could keep an open mind on things they haven't seen that's all. I understand your points about Frontier letting you down on past releases so I know where you are coming from. Totally. But I guess it is my optimistic side that hopes that any losing streak can be broken no matter what the subject...baseball, music albums, or yes, even games.
We shall see.
Oh..and as to why I post here...I do post sometimes on the Atari site, but frankly, I rather deal with Adults. Even if they often disagree with me. And I find it equally strange that someone who hates a game bothers to make nice stuff with it. I'm just saying. :)
*** Edited 4/17/2005 3:22:37 AM UTC by Coasterbuf***
Coasterbuf said:
Please explain where keeping an open mind somehow = me saying that the game IS good. How would I know how it is? It's not even done yet.
Ahh, you're right. My apologies.
In the same vein:
Coasterbuf said:
And I find it equally strange that someone who hates a game bothers to make nice stuff with it.
I'm not sure I ever said I hated it. I'm disappointed with it. We all are. That's exactly the source of the frustration. I (we?) want to like this game, play it endlessly, create wonderful things, blah blah blah.
Between the people who can't run it, find it boring and see the flaws - you get the responses in this thread.
Coasterbuf said:
But it's clear to me that Atari/Frontier has made at least SOME effort to please people. I can't fault them for that......I do post sometimes on the Atari site, but frankly, I rather deal with Adults.
I think those two lines tie together much closer than your post touches on. Frontier is listening...to the kiddies on their forums. That's the problem.
Sure, they're catering to what probably represents a good chunk of their audience and I can't fault them for that, but the style and focus of gameplay from official forum users is exactly the things the people here tend not to focus on. I see people get excited over a screenshot looking up from underwater at a squid.
WTF!?
That does absolutely nothing for me and is merely a demonstration of 'pretty' - if RCT3 is anything, it's certainly pretty. That's not enough to impress me. You'll see people around here still playing (and even uploading) RCT2 stuff. Further proof that the 'pretty' doesn't matter. Make the game work and make it fun and easy to use. The pretty should be the icing, not the cake.
So why don't we go over there and make some noise? Well, we did. When the game first came out. I think you were even in on a few of those threads where Jeff and I were adding our two cents about the issues with the game. (there were a handful of others as well, I'm not making us into the lone Martyrs of the cause or anything, but I think we were the only Buzzers)
The official response from the higher ups?
We didn't know how to play the game. We were doing it wrong. However you choose to word it, they waved a hand and dismissed some of their most loyal, longest using, hardcore fans.
The game had changed and they made it quite clear. The new focus was on pretty pictures and sharp graphics that pleased the kiddies who frequent their forums at the cost of a well running, simple, fun to play sim.
I'm repeating myself at this point. I still see very little reason for myself personally to get to optimistic over Soaked. I never thought waterparks would be a good addition to the game, I don't miss tunnels, I don't want to see peeps pee, laser shows (as dumb as fireworks, IMO) and more flats (nice, but again, not something I find necessary as in terms of gameplay the 'click and drop' flats are little more than park filler between the coasters)
All the game offers for me personally is more (sorely needed) scenery items & styles and my lone hypocritical weakness...those purty waterfalls. I have to admit those look like fun to play with for a little while, but they offer nother in terms of gameplay beyond the 'pretty'.
I'll probably end up with the expansion regardless, but I don't expect much out of it. I'll snag it more to feed my 6+ year habit of RCT being my main free time waster, than out of desire or the feeling of need to have it.
Which would you rather play?
A game with little to no fancy graphics that challenged the brain and good keep you thinking for hours, or a game that looked all fancy and shiny and made you go ooh to look at but had no gameplay whatsoever.
This is the biggest divide in the gaming community.
Personally I still play RCT2 and RCT3 has long since gone from my PC.
But heh, I only got Married yesterday, everything is rose tinted for me at the moment!
*** Edited 4/17/2005 11:32:55 AM UTC by Ross McColl***
First, as some of our Coasterbuzz friends have pointed out in the bug posts, scenery stacking doesn't even work correctly; by removing the option to pick which side of a grid marking we can construct a wall or fence, we lose the ability to make decent scenery structures that actually look right (as opposed to having doors not line up with walls, etc).
Second, the Frontier designers put so much time and energy into re-designing the scenery console that they made it a pain in the *** to use. When I build my scenery objects, I use a ton of different pieces and styles, and as a result I lose interest before even putting up a couple of walls because of all the scrolling, clicking, and searching required just to find a decent piece of scenery.
Third, because the designers spent so much time making "themed" scenery items, they paid no attention to perhaps the most important type: the generic scenery. The vast majority of my buildings in RCT2 were created using the generic walls, supports, and blocks. In the second version of the game I put a ton of detail in my parks, as the scenery allowed me to build catwalks, stadiums, lighting trusses, special supports, and just about everything else that I can think of. That ability is gone in RCT3, both as a result of the lack of necessary scenery pieces, and the complexity and problems with the current construction engine.
Second issue. I totally agree. The UI sucks on RCT3. I doubt it will be changed much with Soaked. But I had issue with RCT2 as well. The limits on what you could have at the same time was a pain in the ass to deal with. I would have liked to see something different in BOTH games.
Third issue - Perhaps the generic could be beefed up, but I think a bigger problem lies in half done themes. The western is pretty complete, but that's about it. Some of the Sci-fi walls don't line up right. That's a really big goof. And I guess I will have to wait for a later expansion for a complete medieval theme. They should hammer out one theme completely before moving on to others though.
But as they say, Rome wasn't built in a day. Hopefully as time goes on and expansions are released the game will just keep getting more complete.
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