New RCT3 SOAKED Information:
...as far as I know, and I played (and conquered) every senario & spent countless hours on the sandboxmode... I have not found ANY problems with the gameplay at all...
...it's performance issues. If they can beef up the performance, I don't find any issues with forking another 20 or 30 bucks for this expansion. Only MINOR tweeks need to be made to the gameplay, and I really don't even know what they'd be because from what I played... I couldn't find any major probs after the patches.
For me, performance just makes it that much worse.
RCT was fun.
RCT2 was a blast.
RCT3 is tedious.
Lines don't fill up, some ride stats are WAY off and coaster stats are next to impossible to mess up (only the most ridiculous coasters fall outside of rideable stats), it still doesn't count inversions right, you can't save rides and scenery as one, the scenarios were no challenge and some could be beat on all three levels with as little as two non-working coasters, the CTRL button thing to build on equivalent horizontal levels isn't present, scenery is very limited and the building style (nothing on path edges, etc) is a step back from RCT2, block brakes can actually boost a train's speed, some trees are labeled wrong as to size and/or type...
...should I take a breath and continue?
Then on top of this performance blows.
A game that's a step back from it's predecessor and it runs like hell? Whoopee! What a blast.
The thing I seem to notice is that in general the more you played and knew about the first two games, the more unsatisfied you seem to be with the third.
I think that generalization speaks volumes. I'm sure the series picked up more than enough new fans to call it a 'hit', but in the process it seems to me to have alienated the most hardcore of it's followers.
It's been dumbed down for the masses, plain and simple.
Coasterbuf said:
Might it turn out the same? Maybe. But maybe not. So many people seem to be so close minded here. I guess I just don't understand that. A wait and see approach is always better I think.
How many times in a row would I have to lift my arm and smack you upside the head before you started ducking when I lifted my arm?
We're ducking. Feel free to stand there and see if the arm hands you a hundred dollar bill this time.
(not insinuating violence or anything personal, just making a rhetoric example :) )
*** Edited 3/27/2005 7:43:43 AM UTC by Lord Gonchar***
Coasterbuf said:
In addition to all the pretty new things and new rides that I mentioned above, they have also stated that the expansion will also have performance improvements.
So Atari expect me to fork out more cash for performance that should have been there from the start? Uh no, I don't think so.
Maybe they should call it RCT3 SHAFTED cos that is what Atari are doing to us.
-Jimvy!
And this is only an expansion pack, so it's not like you can skip buying the buggy game and just buy soaked that runs.
Look at this one - is that a parking area in the upper right in the background? Wonder if it's scenery you drop or a working feature?
At any rate, it IS admittedly visually impressive. You know the rest of the story though...
Coasterbuf said:
- Hersheypark rides (Perhaps a scenario?)
Just caught that line. Where'd you get this from?
That should have been there from the start, or at the very least as a downloadable patch. Nothing has worked yet.
If they were to do this and get the game working decently performance-wise, I'd consider buying the expansion. Until then, there is no chance I will spend another dollar (or pound!) on this product.
Lord Gonchar said:Lines don't fill up,
some ride stats are WAY off and coaster stats are next to impossible to mess up
it still doesn't count inversions right, you can't save rides and scenery as one, the scenarios were no challenge and some could be beat on all three levels with as little as two non-working coasters, the CTRL button thing to build on equivalent horizontal levels isn't present, scenery is very limited and the building style (nothing on path edges, etc) is a step back from RCT2, block brakes can actually boost a train's speed, some trees are labeled wrong as to size and/or type......should I take a breath and continue?
Then on top of this performance blows.
Wow. You sure base enjoyment or lack there of on some weak things. The performance and lack of challange in scenarios I can see. And the CTRL button is annoying I agree. But the others? Minor.
Lines don't fill up? Simply reduce your capacity on your ride. The flats can have longer cycles. Should you have to do this? No. I agree you should not. But there is a way to deal with it.
Stats and inversions way off? While I agree they should be accurate, this is something that can be easily fixed and may even already be so in the Soaked expansion. So hardly worth chucking out a game over as far as I am concerned.
Can't save rides and scenery as one? Already addressed and taken care of in Soaked Expansion.
Nothing on path edges? Judging from some screenshots the groupthink is that this has also been addressed in Soaked. If not, there is a workaround to the issue that someone found.
Block brakes boosting speed? Not if you set them lower they won't. What is the issue here? I don't see it.
Trees are labled wrong? TREES? Come on Gonch. You are really saying that if an elm is identified as a maple your enjoyment of a COASTER game takes a nosedive? That's really reaching. If you are going to be that petty then you should also hate RCT1, RCT2 and every game ever made in the history of mankind as there are always little bugs and imperfections in them.
I think some of you are going out of your way to hate the game. And going even further out of your way to complain about something that hasn't been released yet! A thing which addresses a lot of the issues you use to hate the game in the first place! (sigh)
As for the arugement that you shouldn't have to buy an expansion to get some things fixed... on one hand I agree with that. But on the other hand, what coaster or ride enthusiast wouldn't want more coaster types and flat rides. Most people would want the expansion anyway, so I don't see the issue here. And who wouldn't want those great waterfalls shown added to their game? Further, it has never been said that there will not be a fix of some sort for those who don't buy Soaked. Many times game companies work on a new build and then once that is stable roll back the changes to the unexpanded game too. I'm not saying that Atari will do this, and after seeing how major the expansion is I don't even think they need to. But it is a possibilty.
So I guess you people keep complaining. I have a feeling that is how some of you "enjoy" life anyway. Meanwhile I will be playing Soaked and having a darn good time with it.
Coasterbuf said:
Trees are labled wrong? TREES? Come on Gonch. You are really saying that if an elm is identified as a maple your enjoyment of a COASTER game takes a nosedive? That's really reaching. If you are going to be that petty then you should also hate RCT1, RCT2 and every game ever made in the history of mankind as there are always little bugs and imperfections in them.
Honestly, it's one of my biggest peeves with the game. And no, not mislabled as you describe.
An example off the top of my head. Drop the medium Oak. Drop a small oak next to it. Which one is bigger?
There's plenty of this if you start really looking. Those aren't 'bugs', that's carelessness.
The first 2 RCT's in the series had nothing like this. Those actually seemed to have someone playing them before release to find bugs, errors and make sure the game was even fun in the first place. Perhaps Chris Sawyer created a level of playability, fun and simplicity that Forntier/Atari can't possibly live up to? Who knows?
That was the beauty of RCT2 (and to a lesser degree the first) - you could play however you wanted and be satisfied because it all worked.
Like to make big fantasy parks that look great but can't be run? You were covered. Like to play for 'realism' and play to the peeps? Worked great. Like to really play the game in the sense of meeting goals sticking to rules and such? Gotcha! Like to create prethemed one-off custom coasters for others to use in their parks and such? Did it well.
That's just 4 examples of the versatility of the previous games. The only thing RCT3 does as well as or better than the previous two games is build big pretty parks. And even then, I can't fill them with peeps because of performance issues. Wow, I made a big empty park for other idiots to stare at. They can't play it, run it or even use it beyond an interactive picture.
Ironically, that one thing RCT3 does well is the exact thing I never enjoyed in the first two RCT's.
The same way you can't understand how someone could dislike the game, I can't understand how someone could actually enjoy this game.
I'll stand by my original assessment.
It's a buggy, flawed game that isn't as enjoyable as the previous games in the series and if used beyond a 'make a pretty park to look at tool' shows it's weaknesses clearly.
So I guess you people keep complaining. I have a feeling that is how some of you "enjoy" life anyway. Meanwhile I will be playing Soaked and having a darn good time with it.
I do believe the old saying is "Ignorance is bliss" - I think it applies here. Accept mediocrity, turn a blind eye to flaws, and enjoy what you have.
I guess I'm just not the type that rolls over that easily. :)
Seriously though, go back 6 months to the pre-release time frame on these forums. You'll see nothing but excitement and anticipation from all the same people unhappy with the game now. Follow the posts in chronological order and watch the disappointment and frustration build. This isn't just "happy fun bash the game time" - it's a group of people with a deep rooted appreciation for the series who hate that the latest installment is a disgrace to the RCT name.
It's not 'complaining just to complain' whether you think it is or not. I like to think I know this series as well as anyone. I've spent WAY too much time with it over the last 6 years. I have mousepads, posters and a big ol' pinball machine dating back to the original RCT contests that basically say the folks behind the game think I know what I'm doing and do it well (is there really any more of an official 'seal of approval') to back my dedication and skill level with the game(s). I bought the original as an import because it came out a few weeks earlier in the UK than the US. I've purchased every add-on and expansion the day it was released. I even stuck up for the Wacky Worlds expansion! That's dedication.
I write none of that out of conceit, but rather to try to convey how much this silly little roller coaster game has been a part of my life over the past six years. I want nothing more than to enjoy this game for years to come.
Unfortunately, I can't in it's current state and from what I've seen of the Soaked expansion, I'm not exactly happy. I approach it with a reserved pessimism and it will officialy be the first RCT titled product that I don't buy the day of release.
But hey, if I do fall to temptation and get a copy - I can rest assured that no matter how bad or good it is, I'll be able to watch the little peeps pee in the pool...
...and that's clearly what Roller Coaster Tycoon is all about.
*** Edited 3/31/2005 8:52:13 AM UTC by Lord Gonchar***
I don't see how anyone could not agree with what you said, true words about the RCT series have never spoken.
Fact is, I played RCT 2 nearly everyday, sometimes up to 3 to 4 hours. I pulled out RCT3 a coupel days ago, since I'm getting that Springtime opening day fever for the parks, and I hoped I might find that spark that was missing fro mthe game the first couple times. I played RCT3 for about an hour, and shut it off, it was getting so terribly boring. I went right back to RCT2, and have been playing it constantly as usual. RCT3 definitely lacks the gameplay of the Chris Sawyer versions, whic his very sad, indeed. *** Edited 3/31/2005 2:02:07 AM UTC by Dan D McD***
Coasterbuf said:
So I guess you people keep complaining. I have a feeling that is how some of you "enjoy" life anyway. Meanwhile I will be playing Soaked and having a darn good time with it.
How delightfully patronising of you.
Take a look at the atari support forum - still plenty of active threads a good six months down the line - fact.
Atari put out a bug filled version of game because profit was more important than customer satisfaction and credibilty - fact.
Even after two major patches the game still doesn't perform consistently for a huge number of players, fregardless of hardware - fact.
I do complain - mainly because there aren't enough pieces of bug ridden crap out there to keep me occupied but I guess that's just me.
Thank you for your opinion and enjoy playing Soaked - you have been.
-Jimvy! *firing up NoLimits*
And Gonch...that comment was never directed at you. I don't consider you a complainer at all actually. But also, realize that I am not one to settle for mediocrity either. If you look at the Knott's Solace thread you will see me rallying for the event that once was while everyone else seems to accept mediocrity of an ERT only event that it has become.
But, I am also willing to not nitpick and willing to keep an open mind. It's interesting that you bring up RCT3 and how you can make big empty parks that can't be run when in your own example you describe people doing the same with RCT2. Other then the prethemed coasters, (which will be changed in Soaked) all the things you listed can be done.
I'm especially willing to keep an open mind for a product that has not been released yet. Rest assured, if it turns out to be crappy I will holler probably louder then you. :)
But that time to judge is not here yet. Not till it's released. It would be like saying Star Wars episode 3 will be crap cause you didn't like the cinematography of episode 2. Perhaps it will, perhaps it wouldn't be. Don't know till you see the movie for yourself. That's all I'm saying. Does that make sense?
'buf, if you look back to the RCT2 discussions, you'll see the exact things you're saying coming out of Gonch's mouth in support of the RCT2 expansion packs. He believed in that product, it didn't let him down, so he supported it. Now he got shafted by a new product, and you're passing him off as closed-minded? I don't understand your blind defense of the thing, are you getting some sort of kickback from Atari?
And drop the "Coasterbuzz isn't nice", you've tried to rile people up with that one three times in the thread and it didn't work, give it up already. You want happy, go to happytherapist.com or something. Life ain't all peachy keen and neither is this site ... and neither is RCT3 from what I've heard
--Brett, who never bought RCT3 based on reviews, will never buy it even if it makes it to the $5 rack, and who thinks that Star Wars 2 sucked, but that 3 looks like it could be an amazing movie, even if it wasn't Star Wars - basically the anti-RCT.
RCT3 doesn't work on my home computer but does on my mom's. However the "fun factor" just isn't there for me. I've probably play it 3 times since i bought it. Truthfully all I've done was download some of my Rct2 tracks from CBGames to see how they looked in 3-d. I just haven't got the desire to build a full park with rct3.
The new expansion does look good but the caution expressed here is warranted due to all the problems people who actually got it to work are having. Also as far as I'm concerned there is no justifiable reason to remove older features like saving rides with scenery from the new game. To me that's equal to removing the B&M style coasters and thinking people wouldn't be upset.
Lastly you read more negative comments here because C Buzz has more "celebrity" or respected players and Gonch is one of the top tier players. Believe me people here respect his opinion. That respect is well earned.
I will wait to buy the expansion till after I get a computer at home that it will preform well on
I see Pax-coasters, inversions on the Booster Bike and re-themed corkscrew cars (again).
I don´t see any new track elements, tunnels and yellow pool water.
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