Zforce at SFoG - CoasterBuzz

I am not trying to start something but boblogone you said yourself that dueling coasters should count as one but yet you count both Twisted Sister Lola and Stella. Also most dueling coasters if not all have completley diferent layouts, like Dueling Dragons. If two coasters are inter twined but not dueling they are on the same ground, should these be counted as one coaster?

Ignore the man behind the curtains. I have no control over that track record.
*** This post was edited by boblogone 2/4/2003 1:35:00 PM ***

chris, Boblo--

Re: the clone counting debate. Here's my take. I count how many coasters I have *physically* ridden. If I ride B:TR at SFMM it does not mean I have ridden any of the other Batman clones. It does, however, mean that I know what kind of experience to expect.

Analogy [the clean version]: If I married someone who has an identical twin it does not mean I married both.

That being said I don't care how anyone counts. I'm comfortable with how I count. What I am not comfortable with is when others say their method is the right and only way. I should have made that more clear in my first post to this thread.

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

But...Couldn't it also just as easily be said that moving Z-Force to SFoG or SFMM changes the experience by placing it in a different location, and thus should be a *new* credit for a given rider?

Isn't that *really* the only difference between the clones?Same model, different location.

This is all speculation, of course, as I count everything I can. ;)

*** This post was edited by chris 2/4/2003 1:50:10 PM ***

Moosh, do you count woodies more than once since after several years of rehab(the ride, not you) you have a different ride? Granted you could count some woodies a lot more than others. What about Turn-of-the-Century/Demon?

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Is there a disturbance in the air?
*** This post was edited by boblogone 2/4/2003 1:53:22 PM ***

Boblo - again, I count physical coasters ridden. As for Turn of the Century / Demon [or other similar scenarios] I take it on a case-by-case basis.

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

I'm with Chris on this one. When a ride is moved, the experience is changed. The whole ride experience is diffrent, even if the ride is exactly the same. No park would have the exact same surroundings. Think about it this way.. If SFGAm's Whizzer was moved to SFAW, it wouldn't be as good (IMO) because the ride wouldn't be hidden away in the bush.

Whatever works though! I like my extra credits :)

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Corey
"his rod and staff comforts me" - and catholics say that gays are bad! :)

Define 'physical' for the jury Mr. Moosh. Would you deny that a retracked woodie can be a 'more' different ride than two clones? Do you find morning wood any less deserving of being counted than after-hours wood?

Corey - if you count "experiences" then why not count Ghostrider 28 times, once for each possible seat on the train? Each seat will give a slightly different experience.

Not arguing, just curious.

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

Boblo - your not talking about physicality, you're talking about experiences. If I see "Gangs of New York" in the theatre and then again on DVD I've only seen one movie regardless of the fact that both experiences are different.

Likewise if I ride Ghostrider in the morning and then at night [or before and after rehab] I'm riding the same coaster even though the experiences are different.

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

*** This post was edited by Mamoosh 2/4/2003 2:44:10 PM ***

That twin analogy works to a point, Moosh, but it doesn't really have anything to do with what I'm getting at. I'm not arguing that one should count all clones of a model because one has ridden one installation. I'm asking why people think there is a difference between counting each B:TR installation they *have* ridden and each installation of a certain coaster they *have* ridden.

I've ridden B:TR at SFMM, SFGAm, and SFog, and count them all. Why shouldn't I count Z-Force and Flashback?

Are you really just 'curious?' I thought you already took care of that... ;)

chris - if Six Flags removed the B&M inverted from SFGAm and and installed it at SFMM than you'd have a point. They did not. Each of the B&M Inverteds themed to Batman at Six Flags parks are different installations, they happen to have the same [or mirrored] layout.

ZForce was moved from park to park. Exact same steel, different location. Yes, the experience may be slightly different but it is not phyically a different coaster.

Analogy #3 - if my company transfers me to Chicago and I take my desk chair with me, I'm not sitting in a new chair. Comprende?

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

*** This post was edited by Mamoosh 2/4/2003 2:47:29 PM ***

I agree with Moosh to a point. I will be riding Greased Lightnin' at SFKK this year, yet I've already ridden it as Viper at SFoG. I'm torn, however, since nowhere on my track record will it reflect my ride on it at SFKK, unless I add it as an entirely different coaster.

I suppose it's pretty ridiculous to concern oneself with something this trivial, but hey...so be it. ;)

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-Vater
Take a ride...

I agree, Vater...it *is* trivial. I don't mind explaining my methods and I admit I do have an odd way of counting. But its *my* way.

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

Where was ZForce located while at SFOG?

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Shaggy

R.I.P. Maestro
Phantom Theater 1992-2002

Mamoosh said:
But its *my* way.

Cue the music.

You win this round, but I know I'll find a way to get you next time... ;)

Although Ghostrider does have totally diffrent experiences in pratically every seat, I would count it as one simply because the overal "experience" would not have changed that much, from seat to seat.

If Ghostrider was moved to another park, the experience would be diffrent. The views would be completely diffrent... (would there be a shed? how bout the view around the turn before the block brake?). Would the queue be as themed at another park?

Now that I think of it, what about Avalanch Run/Disaster Transport? That ride has changed dramatically, and yet is still the same exact track and trains as before.

I'm glad this has come up. I've been thinking about this alittle bit lately :)

Edit - Movies actually DO change from theatre to home. Unless you've got the freshmade theatre popcorn, the theatre seating, and the screen and surround sound system, the "experience" of watching the movie would be diffrent! Plus, look at Lord of the Rings. They offer an extended version, so technically I've got 2 diffrent LOTR's movies ;)

Oh and yes I happen to think that Ghostrider is two diffrent coasters! Night and day are completely diffrent.. but if I counted every coaster that was that tempermental, I'd have well over 600coasters in my track record! ;)
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Corey
"his rod and staff comforts me" - and catholics say that gay's are bad! :)
*** This post was edited by rOLLocOASt 2/4/2003 3:06:52 PM ***

This post has turned totally from what I had ment. I have no problems with people counting coasters in their own way, I just wanted to count it as Z-Force since that was when I had gotten to ride it. I think it strange to count a coaster in a park I have not ever been even though I have been on it in another park.

Back to the 'physically' different coaster line Mr. Moosh, what percentage of material is necessary to justify a 'different' coaster in your book. Running rails don't seem to matter to you, how about different footers? Is your minimum percentage determined by mass or volume? Do trains matter?

That chair in Chicago is probably a different chair on the org-chart. There will probably be different people maintaining that chair at night in Chicago. If they give you a new title in Chicago are you not then sitting in a different *chair*.

You admit your way is odd, you do know what *good* people do to the odd? BURN HIM! Trials over, get out the torches and pitchforks!
*** This post was edited by boblogone 2/4/2003 3:04:27 PM ***

I agree, Vater...it *is* trivial. I don't mind explaining my methods and I admit I do have an odd way of counting. But its *my* way.

Exactly. Therefore, my method will probably show one coaster listed twice come this summer...and if anyone thinks that I'm 'padding' my count because of that, well, lemme tell ya....maybe I am! SO?? ;)

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-Vater
Take a ride...
*** This post was edited by Vater 2/4/2003 3:01:32 PM ***