What is technically wrong with Mean Streak and Pre

tricktrack said:
When Stengel did a tv inteview at Cedar Point for german tv (around the opening of MF) he was as well shown in front of Mean Streak. He shook his head while pointing at the structure of MS. He was basically saying that a ride like that would never pass the DIN regulations, and would never be allowed to operate in Germany. I found this quite arrogant of him to diss a ride which was for once not designed by him, and who would give a d*mn wether it would be allowed in über safety crazy Germany or not.
But that was not the point. He referred to the chaotic and (shown in the above link) patchwork frames that seemed to be hammered in no particular order into the structure. And obviously he knew what he was talking about. The problem with these coasters seems to be the insufficient support structure. Maybe they were just ahead of their time and they didn´t have the appropriate CAD aid to design proper wooden coasters of this size and speed.

Stengel may have known how to critique a wooden coaster structure, but he sure couldn't build one himself. Compare SoB's structure w/ that of a GCI or a CCI, and you'll find that SoB is an ugly, patchwork-looking design with the same flaws as any wooden coaster its size.

To be faor, though, Dinn coasters tend to be underbuilt.

When I rode the Mean Streak in 1992, it was my favorite wooden coaster, period. Of course, I had far fewer coasters to my track record back then, but it was still a good ride. Not at all like what I rode last year.

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-Rob
A.C.E. member since 1990
Posting @ Coasterbuzz since 2000
E.C.C. member since 2002

Mamoosh said:
LG - you did, and what's ironic is that the similarity in the initials never crossed my mind until your post. Trust me, the similarity stops there ;)
mOOSH

Heck Moosh, not only are you a S&D, you're an MS!

Wow Wolf.....that was "below the belt"....;)
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(SF)Great American said:
The American Eagle isn't over 130 ft., but it does have a 147 ft. drop, therefore making it the equvilant of one, as far as forces are concerned. It does not have a trim on the first drop.

Indeed. AE has a 147' drop and is a bad coaster. However, that's not the fault of the drop, which actually is pretty good. It's just that the rest of the coaster sucks. Honestly, both of SFGAm's woodies are pretty smooth and track pretty well. AE is undergreased, but the track seems mostly sound.

I was one of the first to ride Mean Streak when it opened to the general public. The ride was smooth as glass. I'm certain structural issues, aggravated by poor train design for the layout, made it tear itself apart. In just a couple of months it developed a terrible jack hammer effect, plus a lot of shuffling. All the vertical supports that look tacked on, were tacked on to get rid of the jack hammer effect.

I don't think Mean Streak is a rough ride, it is smooth enough for my tastes. CP DOES maintain this ride very well. The structure and track seems to be in pretty good condition. If they changed the trains, maybe to Millennium Flyers, or maybe to something custom designed to track well on Mean Streak, it could be a very nice ride. And it would probably cut maintenance costs significantly.

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I'd rather be in my boat with a drink on the rocks,
than in the drink with a boat on the rocks.

I remember reading in a rollercoaster book (sorry, can't remember which) that Dinn-Summers specialised in woodies with minimal structures (or something to that idea) to make their coasters more affordable... Could that be one of the reason why their coasters aged so bad? That and the fact that many of their woodies opened with the PTC trailered trains, as Rideman mentions on his website. Could that be for part of the blame?

But would the cost of three brand new custom trains really out weight the cost of the maintainance for a ride that really was never that amazing and whose modifications would not really increase ridership be worth it?

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If I was part of a coaster, I would be an upstop pad on an Arrow Mine Train.
MAGNUM HAD MY BABY!

Wait a second Brent...are we still talking Herc here, or the S-D *crop* in general...;)

bill, who swears that Thunder Run and Ga Cyclone don't belong with the rest of the bad apples....(and I have yet to ride TX Giant, so I can't speak for that one)....
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How about Timber Wolf? I have heard that one is pretty respectable as well...

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-Rob
A.C.E. member since 1990
Posting @ Coasterbuzz since 2000
E.C.C. member since 2002

I am referring to Mean Streak.

Now wasn't Georgia Cyclone designed by Cobb? I know thunder Run was designed by John Fetterman whose Knoebel's Twister is an absolute masterpiece.

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If I was part of a coaster, I would be an upstop pad on an Arrow Mine Train.
MAGNUM HAD MY BABY!

....not based on MY rides...;)

edit: referring to T-Wolf....not to the good wood in Ky or Ga....;)
*** This post was edited by rollergator 9/18/2003 4:00:35 PM ***

Timberwolf is a bit different as it is a different type of coaster then teh Herc, T Giant, MS type Dinn's. I have heard mixed reviews of the ride myself.

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If I was part of a coaster, I would be an upstop pad on an Arrow Mine Train.
MAGNUM HAD MY BABY!

gator- Are you referring to deficient rides on Knoebels' Twister?

I wouldn't say that the Georgia Cyclone was designed by Cobb, I would say Keenan, as the GC, like the Texas Cyclone, is based on Vernon Keenan's Coney Island original. It has always been said that the Texas GIANT was originally drawn by Cobb, but I'm not sure how much truth is in that one. Thunder Run is indeed the work of John Fetterman. Seems that most of Summers coasters were either partially or entirely designed by other people.

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-Rob
A.C.E. member since 1990
Posting @ Coasterbuzz since 2000
E.C.C. member since 2002

Rob, I was saying my rides on Timber Wolf were lacking....in every aspect but the bounciness...;)

That being said, my *knowledge* (such as it is) as to who designed what is mostly limited to what it says on rcdb....

edit: Thunder Run, Ga Cyclone, and KG's Twister have all been wonderful rides, leaving me with bruises in all the right places...:)
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*** This post was edited by rollergator 9/18/2003 4:13:53 PM ***

I've never been on Thunder Run, but I can vouch for the Ga Cyclone and Knoebels Twister being great rides!

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-Rob
A.C.E. member since 1990
Posting @ Coasterbuzz since 2000
E.C.C. member since 2002

ApolloAndy..

I'll tell you how it's ridiculous....CP has put just as much work and maintenance into MS, if not more, since the trims have been added. Plus now they have the added bonus and pleasure of dealing with roll backs all the time. If you're trying to save the structure, you sure as hell better come up with a better plan than slowing a train down 5 m.p.h. on the first hill.

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Just when you think you have all the answers, I change the questions
*** This post was edited by Superstew 9/18/2003 5:20:30 PM ***

Um, no, actually, that would kind of be the best idea for saving a stucture that's being torn apart...

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I hear America screaming...

Um...Ummm ..Err ..Uhh .. Actually the kind of "best" idea for saving a structure that's being torn apart is to reinforce the structure itself... Yes.. I'm almost certain I read that some where.

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Just when you think you have all the answers, I change the questions

Well, here's the way I see it: Either you can spend a load of money putting in a mountain of wood that probably won't be capable of fixing the problem anyway, or you can just slap in a brake (or two) that'll reduce the forces so that what's there is more than capable of handling things.

If the forces can't be reduced, then, yes, re-inforcing the structure is the thing to do. But if the forces can be reduced, then it's a much more practical way to go.

Of course, that's just the underlying logic. Mean Streak appears to be designed so that even with the brake on as hard as it can be, the structure needs reinforcement. That, my friends, is truly a no-win scennario.

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I hear America screaming...