PKI to restrict some rides to Gold Pass Holders
Well Chris, seeing how you asked. I would plan my trip for mid to late June or probalbly July. You see I have a family and with the five hour trip to cincinnati, I would have to pull my kids from school to go. Considering how unstable the weather is in April, I wouldn't go then. Memorial day is a possibility, but unlikely. Last year, my first trip to PKI was June 16.we left on Friday, enjoyed the park on Saturday and came back Sunday. We would have stayed longer on Sunday but we knew we would be returning in two weeks.
I understand that the crowds are larger in June, but the weather is more stable, and I have more flexibility then. There's a reason why summer weekends are busier at PKI than weekends in April.
SLFAKE - Yeas I can say when I would go to PKI. My staement wasn't about anyone but me and my family. I stand by my statement that if I was only going once, it would definately not be April and the only weekend in May I would consider would be memorial day.
P.S. does anyone know who I paraphrased in my last message?
This is breaking-down fairly quickly now.
When people start telling others their point of view doesn't have any legs to stand on, because they want to end the discussion is a clue.
I read with interest how somebody's possible trip to PKI is now "shot" due to not being able to ride one ride in the park for ONE HOUR. Also looking at the information shows Son-of-Beast being the ONE ride for that approx. 1 hour early close in April. The Beast would still be available for the dusk holy grail ride.
I also keep seeing people state the full undiscounted daily price. I am wondering how many people will pay full price. Especially in April/May when there are multiple promotions/AAA pricing/coupons out the wazoo floating around. Does a 20-25% discount change the discussion? No, but there is a reason why they are giving decent discounts. The single-pay April/May crowd is small in relation to the june - august crowd.
Yes, everybody has an opinion and should indeed be able to say what they want about-it, but I also find-it interesting how several people have stated they are not even planning on going to PKI this year, but are still very negatively against this policy. You see this many many times over in life. Many of the people whom would not even be impacted by a business decision are the loudest for/against it.
It has also become rather obvious that several people have not had the experience of actually being in a business setting which these kinds of decisions are made time and time again.
Everybody posting here as well as many others with internet access are aware of the park's policies/hours/schedules and should make their plans according to how they can best find their entertainment level maximized. If they can not find that at a particular company, then find another-one which will assist you better. Kings Island does not "owe" anybody a specific ride to be ridden at a specific time. Kings Island is not an Ohio public park and recreation area. It is a company with a mission to make money. Yes they should balance the needs of the customers and convey a professional and positive attitude toward their customers. It would appear that some here would just have too horrifying memories if they were to be at the park standing by Son-of-Beast in the last hour of operations on a saturday in April , and the last 2 hours of operation on a saturday in May standing by the Beast. Maybe those people should consider alternative opportunities.
Carpediem, I can see your point, to a limited extent. I don't know what other people do when they plan their trips, but I plan my trips _FAR_ in advance and buy airfare accordingly. When I checked their website for operating hours before I bought my airfare, there was no mention of this situation on their website.
--Granted, my trip will not be until June, but others out there may do the same thing as I do - buy their tickets in advance and not get all the "scoop" until after their trip is locked in with airfares and hotel reservations. And those people have no ability to "consider alternative opportunities."
I guess an hour isn't that terrible here and there for ERT. It costs more to operate the rides before or after normal hours though, and it is kind of paid for if you have this gold situation.
Either way, I don't think the extent to which they're running this program is enough to call it quits on the park, as some of you seem to suggest.
-----------------
Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"
I believe I was one of the "not visiting PKI" people that carpediem was addressing. Way back when this thread first started and I found out that it was only for a few hours in April and May I stated... "Wait... the last post was not up there when I posted the latest rant. Only in April or May? Then forget it... no use causing social upheaval over that. Not many people (aside from the die hard "enthusiasts") travel to parks in those months. I can understand it then. During June, July and August... now that would be a different story."
Actually, I could really care less what PKI does. In the whole grand scheme of things, this doesn't really matter. I suppose the main thing I was ranting against were some of the arguments presented here... some suggesting "buy a Gold Pass" (even if you live hours away), "No one travels to a park in April or May", people thinking Pass holders deserving special perks over and above getting in for an unlimited number of visits, certain people granstanding for their home park's decision (and I assume they are pass holders too), etc etc etc.
All I want to say is this, to all of those who have defended this policy. All business logic aside, what if a park decided that, since pass holders can return at any time, they close off certain rides two hours ahead of time to pass holders to let those people who are there for their one and only visit have a chance to have some night time ERT on certain days?
Amazing how many people defend a policy that they are on the "winning side of".
-----------------
"I wasn't always this cynical, but then I started kindergarden..."
I, for one, never stated that I'd call it quits on the park since I will not be there for the dates in question. But if I was there and would be negatively impacted by this situation, you could be darned sure that I would be at the park's Guest Relations office voicing (politely) my displeasure.
--SFLAKE, I can just imagine the uproar that your last statement would cause if it was real. LMAO.
*** This post was edited by redman822 on 3/26/2002. ***
Sure there are limited situations which fall outside the norms. Those people have different avenues of potential to attempt to enjoy life.
1. "Go with the flow". One hour for one ride out of a full day of entertainment. Two hours for one ride on a few other nights potential. There are those that adapt and can still find fun, and others that let things eat them up.
2. Heck, why not drop PKI a professional note/fax to the appropriate people stating your concerns and wants. I have no idea if anything would be accomplished. I have sent letters to parks in the past letting them know good as well as poor aspects my family and/or myself witnessed/experienced. I have almost always gotten replies back from management. Some of those included discounts/free tickets/etc. which more often than not I did not even use, but I did reply back thanking them for the time they took to read and respond to my letter.
3. If it is going to affect them in a negative manner and eat at them, then try and find somebody to buy your plane ticket/etc. and move-on.
4. Look for possible discounts and special offers to get a special "deal" which may take the edge off of that one ride for an hour or so.
*** This post was edited by carpediem on 3/26/2002. ***
Just to follow up with another one of your points, I do understand how businesses work. If I, the customer, dish out my hard earned cash for a service (not a "privilege"), the provider of that service does *owe* it to me. I don't know when we as consumers started to feel that a corporation is providing us with a "privilige" by taking our cash, but it's an entirely backwards notion. I pay for x and y, I expect to get x and y. By advertising the early ride closures, PKI is putting themselves off the hook legally, but it's still a weak move. I gar-aun-tee that there will be plenty of PO'd folks at the park wondering why there are people enjoying a "closed" ride while they're not.
Just relating how PKI's business decision will affect me, one of their customers.
I'm not "horrified" by any of this, I just find it annoying.
-------------
"He's blazin' away like the stars in the universe.." A. Vega + M. Rev "Ghostrider"
*** This post was edited by chris on 3/26/2002. ***
Chris:
If night rides on SOB and Beast are at the top of your priority list, a visit in April will not find much darkness.
If the Beast is not finished with brake rehab, that is part of the possibility of any ride at any park on any given day. What if there were signs at the front of the park stating the Beast would be down for maintenance and repair several hours each saturday?
Are you going to complain to McDonalds when you go to order a hamburger and you love mustard, and there are signs posted telling you they are out of mustard that day, but you order a hamburger anyway and then proceed to find the manager to complain that your hamburger doesn't have mustard, and don't they know that McDonalds is required to offer me mustard because I bought a hamburger from them?
When there is an exchange of service for money, and those services are known before the exchange, then the person offering the money should not be expecting other services.
But Carpediem, your (bad) analogy in regards to mustard (or lack thereof) at McDonalds is way off.
For your analogy to be comparable to the situation with PKI they would have to have a frequent burger buyer card that you had to buy for a large additional cost. And that if you did not have the card, you could not get mustard on your burger - while those who do have the card CAN get mustard.
It has nothing to do with being out of mustard, it has to do with them only giving the mustard to their frequent burger buyers club.
I gotta answer the McDonald's one:
No... no problem with that. MickeyD's is out of Mustard and they have signs, no big deal. But if I see that I don't get any mustard, but the guy in front of me does, I will be a bit upset. If I ask why and the manager tells me, "well, in order to get mustard, you need to order a Hamburger Gold... and it costs twice the price of a regular hamburger + 50 cents," I'm going to be really upset. Another comparrison... when you buy Pizza, sometimes extra topings cost extra... but they do not cost twice the price of a regular pizza.
The part about rides being down for whole days or parts of days. That is fine. I may not like it (like when we found Kumba closed last year at BGT for most of the day), but hey, "Them's the breaks". However, AS STATED SO MANY TIMES BEFORE, to see a ride down for maintenance is one thing... to see other people enjoying a ride but yet being kept away because we did not theoretically pay enough to ride it AT A PAY ONE PRICE PARK is entirely another.
The exchange of services for money. That is fine.. this is a capitalistic society (and thank goodness, 'cause the other oportunity is not good), and I have no problem with that. IF a park would offer a special "ERT" upgrade where you could pay $5 extra to be given a special pass for ERT on a certain ride for a certain amount of time, I would not be crazy about it, but it would be better. That would mean if you are a 1 time visitor, it would be available to you. True, if you are 1 day visitor, you could get a Gold Pass, but that would be very cost prohibitive. I mean, $42 (the regular price, with NO DISCOUNT, cause not everyone uses discounts) + $5 is $47 for a one day visit which is reasonable... $84 (to get a gold pass) is not a reasonable expectation.
-----------------
"I wasn't always this cynical, but then I started kindergarden..."
*** This post was edited by SLFAKE on 3/26/2002. ***
1. I've been to PKI in April, and enjoyed night rides on both The Beast and SOB. Maybe I live in some parllell universe, but it was dark.
2. A ride being down for rehab, and a ride being down because the park made a "business decision" to deny me the right to enjoy it are two different things. I fully understand the rehab, and look forward to enjoying The Beast more than ever.
3. If McDonald's is simply out of mustard, then I guess I wouldn't have much of an argument. If they decided to tell me that mustard wasn't available when I was watching others dump it on their burgers, it would be a different case.
4. Yes, I know of this situation because I am a lunatic that participates in an internet community revolving around amusement parks. I think it would be safe to assume that most of PKI's customers aren't as obsessed as me. I also conceded that PKI was technically off the hook, but I don't agree that it's cool.
-------------
"He's blazin' away like the stars in the universe.." A. Vega + M. Rev "Ghostrider"
*** This post was edited by chris on 3/26/2002. ***
No. A private entity is telling you upfront what they have to offer you before you make a purchase from them. The potential patron is not buying a ticket from them without the knowledge that one ride for one hour will not be available to them.
My analogy was not meant as an exact parallel. Merely a guide. If you wanted it to be closer linked to the PKI situation. Merely add that McDonalds has posted that mustard is available from the hours of 10:30 a.m till 9:00 pm, with them having a closing hour of 10:00 pm.
Carpediem,
change the time of 9:00 to 7:30 and note that the frequent burger buyer cardholders still get mustard for the last two plus hours while those who do not have the card just have to sit there and watch the cardholders enjoy their mustard - then you'd have an exact parallel.
--Never mind also having to admit that one of the main reasons for going to that particular McDonalds is that they have that special mustard which brings people to their location from three states away.
*** This post was edited by redman822 on 3/26/2002. ***
-----------------
Have you ever considered that maybe it's not the park that's the problem, but YOU?
I had brought-up the Beast being down for rehab, because you had brought that into the equation. Please see my follow-up for the mustard. If you felt uncomfortable about McDonalds being out of mustard for an hour during the day, you could always go to Burker King, White Castle/aluminum room, or cook at home. I don't consider people lunatics for following their interests on the internet. You don't have to consider PKI being cool about their policies/procedures. That is one of the great things living in America. One has at their disposal an almost unlimited number of choices to enjoy each day. Do what will enhance each day for you, and work on the next day.
I think people are forgetting it is a choice to go to an Amusement Park. I had stated in an earlier reply there are a few possibilities for a few to take which may feel negatively impacted on this particular situation.
Why am I holding-on to this with a fervor? I have consulted with small businesses in the past as well as hold management positions with companies. I have seen this before many times. Companies are in the business to make money. They offer services and products. There is nothing implied that those services or products should be differently superior once a transaction takes place. Of course a few companies have a built-in expectation factor which requires a certain level of satisfaction be derived which is above the transactions stated cost, but that is not the norm.
This particular decision by a private enterprise will stand or sink. The company will evalute-it and enhance their revenue stream, cut their losses, or call it a wash. They will move-on.
But McDonalds put signs-up in their parking lot letting others know they would be out of mustard for an hour at the end of day. I realize dealing with a physical asset vs. the PKI situation was not a good analogy, but was just attempting to show a basic thought process vs. an exact analogy.
I have no problem with us agreeing to disagree. There is nothing wrong with that. I do however have a problem with the people who aren't even going to PKI this year, or somehow feel this will ruin their day IF they go to the park. I had thought I had highlighted a few potential avenues for some to take if they are headed to PKI and are aware of the situation.
So here's a question (which nobody will really have an answer for...)
What hapens on a day when the park is not crowded? If there aren't enough Gold passholders to fill the trains will they run them empty, or let the GP on?
(My guess is run them empty...)
-----------------
Off with the trims!
My fellow Americans; Let's Roll!
Woodencoaster.com
chris said:
4. Yes, I know of this situation because I am a lunatic that participates in an internet community revolving around amusement parks.
... as are we all.
Now I saw the mention about these "special days and times" for ERT in the PKI site before, but I was specifically looking for that info.
Taking it from the point of view of your "average park go'er", I just revisited that site and went looking for their operating calendar. I found it. In doing so, I found nothing about any special times that rides would close early for any ERT for Gold Pass holders. Seeing that the park is open on the days I would like to visit, I decided to check on the price of one day admission. I found that under "General Admission." Nothing was mentioned there about the ERT for Gold Pass holders. There was however a statement stating "Unlimited Access" to rides and attractions with a General Admission "Good Any Day" ticket.
Bottom line... this ERT stuff is published on their site... but unless you are looking speficially for it, you probably will not find it. As a matter of fact, only place I could find it was to look under "season passes" and then click on for a "complete list of gold pass perks". Hardly the course of action that a person interested simply in going to the park for one day would take... even if they do check ahead for information.
- The question on "will they put non Gold Pass riders on trains that are not filled with Gold Pass Riders during this ERT": It is like that last night on the TITANIC... on one side of the ship the rule was "Women and Children ONLY" in the life boats, on the other side it was "Women and Children first, Men when no Women and Children were near by". My guess would be no... no non pass holders in line at all. I mean, if there were no Gold Pass holders waiting and they would let non pass holders in line, then when a Gold Pass member would arrive, they would find a full line. IF they would handle this like Fast Pass instead of ERT, then it would make sense... a Gold Pass holder comes up, goes in as a Fast Pass guest, ahead of the others waiting. However, if that would be the case... giving Fast Pass priviliges to Gold Pass holders for the last two hours of the day, I don't think we would be having this argument... because no one would be "denied" a ride... they just may have to wait longer and may be denied a ride because of closing time. (I still do not think this is a good idea, but it is one that I think is a much better solution).
-----------------
"I wasn't always this cynical, but then I started kindergarden..."
*** This post was edited by SLFAKE on 3/26/2002. ***
*** This post was edited by SLFAKE on 3/26/2002. ***
You must be logged in to post
