Hersheypark says transgender people free to use restrooms that correspond to gender identity

Lord Gonchar said:

That's an interesting way of putting it. Here's a legitimate question.

Why do we treat is as letting the brain determine that the sex organ is wrong rather than the presence of a specific sex organ determining the brain is wrong?

I think it's because the brain is who we are. It is us. Your brain is where you live. We've always had an obsession (at times unhealthy) with separating the health of the brain with the health of every other part of the body; hence, we have people who still don't think mental illnesses exist because we by and large don't think of the brain as an organ that can get sick.

We have health, and then we have mental health.

That said, we are a long way from being able to determine specific brain differences that exist between someone who is transgender and someone who is not.

Lord Gonchar said:
Why do we treat is as letting the brain determine that the sex organ is wrong rather than the presence of a specific sex organ determining the brain is wrong?

Because one makes people feel bad and one makes them feel less bad.

GoBucks89 said:

I am on board for respect. But that's very different from your initial answer to LG's question.

How so? I think acknowledging that someone's physical appearance doesn't necessarily define them and choosing to respect how a person chooses to present themselves are equally valid.

OhioStater said:

I think it's because the brain is who we are. It is us. Your brain is where you live.

By that definition, no mental illness should exist - it's just who we are. But I know you don't believe that based on the rest of your post...which seemed contradictory to this idea.

I've always thought it was interesting that this doesn't get treated as a mental health issue - something about disassociating with your physical reality or something or other.

I pass no judgement in any case. I'm cool with people doing whatever and I think I have the posting history to back that. I just wondered what others thought on the subject and I appreciate the couple of answers I got. As usual, I seem to have gone to the place that stops the conversation because most don't want to tread there.

To me, it's the most interesting aspect of the the whole gender identity discussion.

But is has; up until very recently a transgender individual would be diagnosed with "gender identity disorder". Today, it's known as "gender dysphoria", but that is less of a disorder and more of a classification for different reasons beyond treatment of something that is wrong with the individual.

Homosexuality was also a mental illness 30 years ago, but thankfully the psychological world in our society understood that it's something you can't change. That is more or less where we have arrived culturally with transgender.

From the therapist's perspective, when someone has an illness/disorder (or whatever you want to call it), they:

1) have something about their reality that is causing them significant discomfort

2) they want this something to be different

3) there are steps one can take to resolve this situation

It's not a mental health issue in the sense that it is a disorder, because for someone who is transgender there is nothing you can do about it. It is a mental health issue, though, in the sense of advocacy, in that people simply need to be treated with respect, acceptance, and tolerance.

Of course mental illnesses exist, but something being abnormal is only a tiny piece of the pie of what makes something an illness or disorder.

So how do you enforce these silly transgender bathroom rules? Are there perineal police posted outside the bathrooms checking out your junk before they let you go inside? And what happens to the people who have been hanging out in the waterpark all day?

I'm not sure why more folks aren't concerned with who is or is not washing their hands after using the bathroom. If policing is warranted, I would focus on that. ;-)

I'm not going to judge anyone's fear on the matter, but I also couldn't condone catering to the fear by keeping things the same. If public restrooms are too scary because of who may be in them, then I would support those afraid from either not using them or using the buddy system to support themselves through their fear. But in no way to me does it make sense to expect the world to adjust to anyone's fear.

Don't women only go in pairs anyway? </stereotype> <winky>

Thanks for your post, Ohiostater. I was worried about where the topic was headed, and you said what I would have, only with much more substance. I'd Vote up your post ten times if I could.

Lord Gonchar said:

As usual, I seem to have gone to the place that stops the conversation because most don't want to tread there.

LostKause said:

I was worried about where the topic was headed...

Only Gonch is willing to have the tough (or "interesting" as I see it) discussions. I don't think you were the only one.

But if I wouldn't have gone there, we'd have never gotten that awesome response from OhioStater for all to see.

You're all welcome. ;)

Yeah. Gonch uses his evil powers for good. Kind of like Spawn, or Dr. Strange.

By the Hoary Hosts of Hoggoth, Dr Strange's powers were not evil!

This thread just came up in the rollback and looking back at it, realizing it's from nine years ago, I'm deeply disappointed to see that the same "arguments" keep coming up now in 2025. And, as a long time member of this site and a trans woman, I really hope some of y'all have grown in your views.

It's worth mentioning that the TV show Ally McBeal had gender-neutral restrooms two decades before this story. I don't understand people who care about where others pee, so long as it's in a place connected to sewage.

I'm sorry for your struggle, Julie. If there's a silver lining, i think it does show how much trans discourse has improved over the past 10 years. I looked over some of the posts and am cringing; I hope that the original authors take the opportunity to do the same.

Honestly, threads like this one where people like me are discussed as oddities* rather than humans with real feelings are the kind of thing that kept me in my egg longer than I needed to be. It's hard to come out and be your authentic self when people are discussing whether you're mentally ill or not just because you have to pee like every other person on the planet.

*I may be odd, but that doesn't make me an oddity

How many times has anyone gone to a sporting event/concert and the line for ladies restroom was so long that women just say screw it and get in line for the men's restroom and everyone is fine with it?

It has probably happened the other way also but I've never been in that scenario.

Over the last several ears, this topic has seemed to be even more divided. The seven or eight trans women in pro sports have become the new "satanic panic" of our time.

The hate is hurtful, but not so much if we all remember that it the origins of the argument are not genuine. It is a distraction. While people argue about identity politics, among other things, the real bad guys lie to, cheat, and steal from us.

There are outdoor urinals for men in Europe, Americans would lose their minds!

We have to remember that many factions of settlers who came to this country were deeply conservative/religious and that still appears in our societal attitudes today. In my neighborhood (upscale suburbia leaning MAGA) we have someone living here who is FTM and nobody would ever know. It’s really no big deal unless you make it a big deal which one political party does for votes.

LostKause:

Over the last several ears