Flashback and Psyclone Magic Mountain

Saturday, January 20, 2007 4:28 PM
Your all going to shoot me when I say this:

Maybe they stopped counting Superman as a coaster! :)

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 4:32 PM
I just found this quote by Shapiro posted on themeparkinsider.com about a year ago:

"We need to diversify. We have 17 roller coasters at Six Flags Magic Mountain--that's too many. It's become like a drug. This industry has become addicted to roller coasters. We put them up. The attendance goes up. If we don’t do something the next year, we fall behind. We can't be so reliant on roller coasters. It's about balance. The pendulum has swung so far to teenagers, that our research shows Mom and Dad are pausing when it comes to Six Flags. I need to get rid of that pause. We can--and will--add roller coasters, but we can't abandon the rest of the park."

Maybe he really does want to start eliminating coasters. But why did it take him a year to get around to it?

http://www.themeparkinsider.com/flume/200602/53/

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 5:15 PM
So his logic is: "Attendance falls when we don't add a new coaster, but it's bound to go up if we remove some." Lame.
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Saturday, January 20, 2007 5:49 PM
Lee Grant said: Maybe he really does want to start eliminating coasters. But why did it take him a year to get around to it?

Well, they were going to go with Plan A: Sell the park
Now, since they are keeping it, they initiate
Plan B... fix the problems

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 5:58 PM
^^Wel when a park becomes dependent on coasters & adds little else in the way of rides the family wants to enjoy then there's a problem.

The parks became too dependent on coasters being added every other year under Burke's reign that they neglected the other portion of their demographic...that demographic being the kids who are too young to ride big coasters & the mom's & dad's that simply don't like to ride them as much as the teenage/young adult demographic.

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 5:58 PM
Right, John. Not only were they looking to dump the park but just in general it's not like these sorts of decisions just happen at a finger snap.

Not to mention you have to find and pay a company to do the work. It takes time.

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 5:59 PM

dannerman said:
Except that SFMM *did* count SBNO coasters (Flashback) in their total when trying to claim the record...

My personal opinion was that they just kept it standing for the count. I'd theorize that the decision was made to scrap Psyclone, not Flashback. That puts them at 16, with CP at 17. Since they're now one down, there isn't a reason to keep it standing...down it comes.


That's hardly the reason why Flashback was kept, despite being unoperational. A lot of you seem to forget it requires a lot of money to do something that sounds as simple as removing a ride. Magic Mountain did not have that kind of infrastructure funding to pay for the removal nor refurbishment of Flashback.

To give you an idea of how much it costs to remove rides -- Six Flags America reportedly spent $80,000 USD to dismantle and remove their Iron Eagle ride. Now imagine how much would be needed to take down a ride the size of Flashback, by comparison of course.

With the 2007 budget already underway, Magic Mountain is finally receiving the money needed to make big and noticeable infrastructure changes, including removing Flashback (finally).

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 6:42 PM
Ok I dont think it would cost all that much to take out Psyclone, just get all the scrapable pieces and then set up an area for Psyclone to burn and make people pay to watch Psyclone burn and save yourself some money.

Also I thought MM was ok, but I was most impressed with Marine World(Discovery Kingdom) when i went on my trip to California last summer. I think the rides are all great except for Kong and Boomerang Coast to Coaster(take it or leave it) are all awsome. The park is at its best when there is nobody there and all rides are pretty much walk on. Medusa was awsome, ROAR my one ride on it was great and V2 was fun in the back going backwards up the backside was fun. That park was a great park went to it 4 days and rode Medusa and V2 around 10-20 times each. That is a park that I think is great.

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 7:19 PM
Lee Grant said:
Maybe he really does want to start eliminating coasters. But why did it take him a year to get around to it?

You've also got to remember that Shapiro got a huge year-end bonus. I'm sure he had to spend alot of time on E-bay figuring out how to spend all of his new money while the parks suffered. :)

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 7:58 PM

kRaXLeRidAh said:

Magic Mountain did not have that kind of infrastructure funding to pay for the removal nor refurbishment of Flashback.


Well, let's be fair. I find it very hard to believe Flashback wasn't removed because SFMM couldn't come up with the cash - it's more than likely that it just wasn't a priority. Which is reasonable, with so much else screwed up with the park, why should it be? I'd guess the only reason we're seeing it now is because Flashback, while probably not high up on the list, is just one step in a long list of house keeping.

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 9:18 PM
I said honest to God. I guess people don't believe in God anymore. That's sad. These are the two emails. The first is by me, and the second one is by her.

Dear Six Flags, (From me)

I believe that you can save this park. This park has over a 100 million dollars in rides, and it is open all year. In fact, it's the only park that is open all year in the entire chain. Yes, there are some problems, but can't you see it can be a family atmosphere along with having teens go to the park too. Just remember that admission is way too high, and season passes are way too low if you want to gain profit. Anyway, to get more people into the park just do the following. I have expenses topping at $6,000,000 at most. You should give the most amount of money to this park with expenses during the year for operations. This is obvious because you should be getting the most revenue. The problem is that you are cutting back on the expenses because it's costly, and people aren't going to the park as much as you would want them to.

Remove Spin Out, Freefall, one flume water ride (Jet Stream or Log), Psyclone, and Flashback.
Baveryn Kurve needs paint job
Make sure the park is safe
Make sure roller coasters are open, and maximum capacity

You can see broken parts on the roller coaster trains when you are going on the ride. Hide those trains if they are broken. It says on the back of it that you can't have this in operation. People just don't want to see that. They might think that this place is a piece of junk or somthing. If trains have broken pieces, put them somewhere off the track. I saw this on Colossus, Gold Rusher, and Ninja. There are were messed harnesses, and wheels.

You just can't let people show them the trains like that. They are in plain sight. I have a feeling that the mechanics are using other trains to move harnesses to the train that "works", but don't do that in public site. It just looks bad!!

Add 7 more flats (3,329,000)
Orbiter 400,000
Scooby Doo 1 million
Cliffhanger 129,000
Flying Bobs 200,000
Century Wheel 400,000
Gee Whiz 600,000
Swing Around 600,000

Add 5 kids rides ($750,000)
1 Hampton Umbrella Ride
Zamperla Speedway
Fun House
Beetle ride
Fun Slide

Advertise that we are a new SFMM. Our roller coasters are Open for
business!!!!


She sent me this back!!
____________________________________________________________
Thank you for your recent e-mail and kind words regarding Six Flags Magic Mountain. We appreciate you taking the time to write.

Your recommendations for the park have been forwarded to the appropriate management for review, but I can tell you that we are currently dismantling Psyclone and Flashback to make room for future park expansion.

Thanks again and spread the word that Six Flags Magic Mountain is open for business!
Sue


Sue Carpenter
Public Relations Manager
Six Flags California
661-255-4819 - direct
661-255-4815 - fax
smcarpen@sftp.com

Six Flags - The World Leader in Thrilling

_________________________________________

End of Emails

Who cares if Six Flags Magic Mountain has the most coasters if two of them a day aren't operational because of maintenance, or some other reason. Get rid of them. Couldn't you still say you have 17? Superman is a twin, and Colossus is also. They use the trick on American Eagle, and is basically the same thing except for one inky dinky part. SFGAm has 13. Give me a break.

I think the GP care about that the park has a lot of roller coasters, and not really that they have the most. The spending on roller coasters over there has to stop for sometime. People say it has deterioted all the times they go there. I don't agree. I just understand that they have too many to take care of. Cedar Point obviously gets more spending, and they charge more for season pass people to get in there park. I believe it's a smart decision. Maybe, now you will see all the roller coasters open the next time you go there because they have less to maintain.

Also, for Flashback, I have heard (rumor I think, not news) that reason why it's not open is because of the waterpark, and because it's not safe. California wants the park to get new trains for the ride. People say the ride stinks anyway (Most people I hear that have ridden it.), and new trains would cost too much money. So, forget the ride altogether. So, tearing it down is a good idea in my opinion. Also, most people seem to hate Psyclone. It's not surprise that they would want to take those down.

In the call, they said they were going to add a train ride around the park. That's all they said. It will have (I believe) three stops. I'm guessing Thomas the Train orientated.

Entertainment! *** Edited 1/21/2007 2:18:56 AM UTC by Ilovthevu'*** *** Edited 1/21/2007 2:30:00 AM UTC by Ilovthevu'***

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Saturday, January 20, 2007 10:19 PM
Your suggestions for things to add are pretty interesting, but don't you think they need more exciting and popular flat rides like a Rip Tide type or a smaller version of maXair (or is that what you refered to as swing around ride?) I know they want to do that "family oriented" thing, but there's already a whole section full of little rides. What Magic Mountian needs are bigger and better flat rides. It worked for Cedar Fair, didn't it? I definitely disagree with the Scooby Doo idea though because the park already houses two themes: Looney Toons and Superheros. They need to work with that instead of opening another theme. *** Edited 1/21/2007 3:23:25 AM UTC by Lee Grant***
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Saturday, January 20, 2007 10:59 PM

SFoGswim said:
So his logic is: "Attendance falls when we don't add a new coaster, but it's bound to go up if we remove some." Lame.


SFoGswim, if your going to call someone's logic lame, at least attribute the correct logic. What you interpreted to Shapiro has nothing to do with what he meant. Please re-read it.

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Sunday, January 21, 2007 12:39 AM

Ilovthevu' said:
I said honest to God. I guess people don't believe in God anymore. That's sad. These are the two emails. The first is by me, and the second one is by her.

Dear Six Flags,

BLAH BLAH BLAH REMOVED.

***


I never said I didn't believe you, all I said was I'll believe it when I see the email. You copied and posted the emails in question and point is proven and taken. I'm a believer now :) Could've all been avoided by posting the emails in your first post tho ;)

In a slight transition, who here thinks that Flashback, if indeed it is going for sure, will be sent to another locale or will it go to the scrap heap? I know I've heard a bazillion times that it's a crappy ride so noone need explain that. Just wondering if anyone holds out any hope (for lack of a better word) for a future with Flashback in it.

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Sunday, January 21, 2007 1:17 AM

Joey Stewart said:

Ilovthevu' said:
I said honest to God. I guess people don't believe in God anymore. That's sad. These are the two emails. The first is by me, and the second one is by her.

Dear Six Flags,

BLAH BLAH BLAH REMOVED.

***


In a slight transition, who here thinks that Flashback, if indeed it is going for sure, will be sent to another locale or will it go to the scrap heap? I know I've heard a bazillion times that it's a crappy ride so noone need explain that. Just wondering if anyone holds out any hope (for lack of a better word) for a future with Flashback in it.


Hmm. Let's see now...

When it was operating, it almost never had a line due to its low popularity.

Then its hardware and mechanical parts were left out in the open without having gone through proper storage procedures for approximately 3 years. Certain track and support structures have rusted through completely...multiple parts on the vehicles need to be replaced and refurbished because they have worn out having been left sitting in the sun, rain, dew, sleet, etc for years. The ride's computer operating system? Ha. That's dusted too.

I doubt there's any kind of hope for Flashback (and not like any of us are crossing fingers about it either). ;)

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Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:30 AM

DWeaver said:
SFoGswim [...] Please re-read it.
K.

This industry has become addicted to roller coasters. We put them up. The attendance goes up. If we don’t do something the next year, we fall behind.
New coaster: attendance up.
No new coaster: attendance down.
His solution: remove coasters. Since he is obviously opposed to the idea of attendance dropping, his only possible hope could be for a rise in attendance. Hence: lame.
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Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:32 AM
Wow!

Read beyond those 4 sentences. You're taking it out of context.

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Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:33 AM
kRaXLeRidAh said:

"Then its hardware and mechanical parts were left out in the open without having gone through proper storage procedures for approximately 3 years. Certain track and support structures have rusted through completely...multiple parts on the vehicles need to be replaced and refurbished because they have worn out having been left sitting in the sun, rain, dew, sleet, etc for years. The ride's computer operating system? Ha. That's dusted too."

Why did Magic Mountain let Flashback just rot like that? I have a hard time believing for 3 years they didn't have the money to store it properly, and if they didn't, what the crud were they doing with their funds? *** Edited 1/21/2007 7:39:49 AM UTC by Lee Grant***

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Sunday, January 21, 2007 2:41 AM
The old Six Flags used the logic that if a ride was not popular, the might as well not put any money into it. That includes removing it if not necessary.

The new Six Flags uses the logic if a ride is not popular and not worth putting money in to run then it should be removed. This way people don't come to the park and see rides that are not running.

At least that is what I gather. I don't think there will be any tears over Psyclone and Flashback, although I do hope they keep a couple Psyclone trains to run on Colossus backward. :)

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Sunday, January 21, 2007 3:05 AM
Screamscape opened a forum on the Magic Mountain issue. I think I might continue this discussion over there. These are the truest words I have ever heard about the topic:

"Add in the fact that the new management team led by Mark Shapiro quickly decided that Magic Mountain was the bastard step-child that they wanted to be rid of so badly that they put it up for sale after only a few months time. Talk about creating a bad atmosphere in your park… not only amongst the employees but also throughout the whole Southern California community." - Screamcape.com

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