CP on the lake

I really can't give you the specifics but ICE has everything to do with it.

It's not so much that the lake freezes but that the ICE shifts. The lakes also have currents and when the ICE thaws, Imagine thousands of tons of ICE pushing/moving on anything built in the lake.

Chuck

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Charles Nungester.
Confirmed, Lesourdsville Lake opening for 2003 details soon at Lesourdsville.com

You missed my point, redman. I meant that too many people in the coaster community think thet government has nothign else to do but monitor amuesment parks by various agencies (FAA, Army Corps of Engineers, etc.)

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Is that a Q-bot in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?

Chuck, I know what you mean: Look at any dock on a thawed lake in the spring that was left throughout the winter...yuck...call in Tim Taylor. The problem with what I have with your statement is this: Raven, Serial Thriller (marsh), B: KF (marshy area), Hurler, S: ROS, Various B: TR's travel across water while in a northern climate where ice is prevelant. Why hasn't CP (besides MF)? I realize the lake is much larger and the current stronger, but the erosion process would take years....some bridges deteriorate faster.

Don't get me wrong, I know they will not build into the water, but why is ice the main reason? I think it's something else....like zoning, or water safety, or property boundries.

Btw: thanks for the info on LeSville, we're heading back this summer for a few more spins on the Eagle.
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There's nothing like a woodie...
*** This post was edited by Woody 2/5/2003 1:28:36 PM ***
*** This post was edited by Woody 2/5/2003 1:29:10 PM ***
*** This post was edited by Woody 2/5/2003 1:29:35 PM ***

Why else would the move other rides for a new one? Why would they build literally on the beach? They're running out of room.

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"...they came like a winged curse. A twin plague of demonic dragons!" - Dueling Dragons

They already did "build literally on the beach." Have you ridden Wicked Twister? It's surrounded by sand.

Cedar Point does not have a space problem™. There are still countless possibilites for ride relocation and creative planning. Cedar Point "had a space problem" in 1999 when MF was announced, "had a space problem" in 2002 when Wicked Twister opened, and "had a space problem" last season when TTD was being built. See a trend there? It doesn't really matter if you, or any other enthusiast, thinks the park has a space problem. The fact of the matter is they do not and it's time to move on from this childish and uninformed debate.

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- John
Dag, yo
Support Rob in the Great DDR Challenge!

Thanks, John. But what I want to know is does CP have a space problem?

Moosh - in smart-ass mode

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"It looks smaller than I imagined, but still looks to be a great ride." -- CPLady

No, I think C has a spaceP problem.

Don't ask...

-Vater, climbing the walls at work while anticipating the Vegas trip tomorrow...

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-Vater
Take a ride...

Okay, when I started this thread I didn't know it would turn into a space problem thing. That was not my intentions at all. Of course Cedar Point has room, but if they could it would be awesome to have a ride over the water. I mean something like a flying coaster that might PARTIALLY go over the water, but not the whole ride. And all I asked was are there any laws or regulations that would prohibit them, and that question was answered by the the gov't gencies such as Army Corps of Engineers that would prohibt it.

Michael,

You didn't answer why they are constantly moving and removing rides and shows....to make room for new attractions. Out with the old and in with the new; b/c they have no space.

EDIT: Besides that...that's why I made the point about building on the Beach. WT is literally on it. Were you not reading correctly?

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"...they came like a winged curse. A twin plague of demonic dragons!" - Dueling Dragons
*** This post was edited by CsTrFrK 2/5/2003 3:35:53 PM ***

CP is running out of trees too.

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I'm not an enthusiast, I just play one on message boards.

I live on Lake Winnipesaukee in NH, which is no where near the size of Lake Erie, but we do have ways of preventing the ice from destroying our docks. Right next to each support on the dock you place a bubbler that you can find at any marine store. This simple device keeps the water moving upward and in turn prevent sice from forming aorund the supports. Now I'm not sure this technique would work on such a large scale, I was only throwing an idea out.
*** This post was edited by lilspike333 2/5/2003 4:25:52 PM ***

Cp's running out of space? =0

Gemini's not a woodie? =0 Sorry, couldn't resist, I'll stop now. The thing about Batman:Knight Flight and Serial Thriller is that yes, it is built in a marshy area. What is a marsh? Soggy land, basically(yes I know it could be gone into more technically, but I really don't have the time). Key word is Land, when ice is formed, if by some chance there was an ice flow on Geauga Lake, which is unlikely, the land stops it from affecting the footers. Which makes it more feasible than Lake Erie.
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- GeaugaDog
Ain't Nuthin but the Dog in me..

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Mamoosh said:
Col Sanders:

You can't say "I also learned a thing or two." and follow that with "I said it was useless, and I didn't think it was to use of anyone."

A- If you learned something, so the thread *was* of use.

B - you don't speak for me, and I found it useful.

If you didn't want to discuss the topic, don't participate.

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"The movies are weird--you actually have to think about
them when you watch them."
--Britney Spears at the Sundance Film Festival

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No it wasn't because I can't use the knowledge I learned. Secondly, It would only be of true use if you were about to build a coaster or ride of any type over lake erie.

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"I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters."
- Frank Lloyd Wright

General Public i think you missed the point. It is exaclty the US Army Corps of Engineers job to look after what anyone is doing on water ways. When CP announced that they wanted to fill in the lagoons a few years back they had to contact the Corps to come in and approve the move. If anyone wanted to build anything out into the lake the Corps of Engineers would be fast at your door as to way you didn't ask their permission first. And certainly the actions of a rather large entity such as CP would garner their attention

This might be a solution, but I don't know if it's very economical. If Cedar Point built footers out in the lake, they could encase hot water pipes or heater coils amongst the rebar in the concrete, and when the lake froze, they could fire them up, keeping the ice around the concrete footer columns melted. I'm not sure if this would combat any ice shifting; however, because I'm not sure how much it can shift at once.

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It's still me, here from the beginning back in 1999. Add 1500+ posts to the number I have in the info section if you care about such things.

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CsTrFrK said:

You didn't answer why they are constantly moving and removing rides and shows....to make room for new attractions. Out with the old and in with the new; b/c they have no space

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Based soley upon that reasoning countless parks have a space problem: SFoG removed Viper for S:UF, Knott's removed Windjammer for Xcelerator, PKI removed Phantom Theatre for the Scooby Doo ride, EPCOT removed Horizons and World of Motion for Mission: Space and Test Track. Do all of these parks have a space problem? No.

If you're wondering why Dodgem left, it's not because there is a space problem, but because there is an identical ride across the park and another park really could have used it. Why did Schwaby leave? When was the last time you saw people riding it? Mill race was deterriorating and White Water Landing was right across the park.

As for Cedar Point removing shows... what are you talking about? The only "show" that has left in recent history was the Imax movie, and it's a good thing. I haven't seen a packed theatre in years. An attraction isn't worth a damned thing if nobody is riding/seeing it. It becomes a waste of space.

Any park you go to removes old rides for new ones. Just because they do doesn't mean they don't have the space for other attractions. I don't even know why I'm wasting my time and keystrokes to even contribute to this semi-irrational argument.

Moosh-

Yes, Cedar Point really does have some space issues. I'm just pretending that they don't to spite you. Just wanted to clear that up. ;)

[edit: fixed some quote problems]

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- John, who is also in smart ass mode
Dag, yo
Support Rob in the Great DDR Challenge!
*** This post was edited by Michael Darling 2/5/2003 6:18:54 PM ***

Thanks, Michael. Next time can you make it Diet Spite?

Moosh ;)

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"It looks smaller than I imagined, but still looks to be a great ride." -- CPLady

Moosh, that's the greatest sig. ever!

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"I'm all in favor of keeping dangerous weapons out of the hands of fools. Let's start with typewriters."
- Frank Lloyd Wright

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meangene said:
General Public i think you missed the point. It is exaclty the US Army Corps of Engineers job to look after what anyone is doing on water ways. When CP announced that they wanted to fill in the lagoons a few years back they had to contact the Corps to come in and approve the move. If anyone wanted to build anything out into the lake the Corps of Engineers would be fast at your door as to way you didn't ask their permission first. And certainly the actions of a rather large entity such as CP would garner their attention

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No, you missed it again. Let me put it more simply. Too many people feel various governmental agencies have nothing better to than stonewall anything amuesment parks try to do. Especially the FAA. Too many enthusiasts think these people sit around with binoculars around parks waiting for them to build something so they can bother the park about it.

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Is that a Q-bot in your pocket or are you just happy to see me?

no they sit around and wait for anyone to do anything that is within their jurisdiction and then look into it. I'm not saying that they are all out to get the park or any park. They are not focusing on stonewalling this park or any other park. I'm not saying that they sit around and watch eagerly for something to happen so they can step in and tell CP "no, no you can''t do that here". I am saying that if CP decided to build something over, or under or through the lake they WILL have to get the proper permission and fill out the proper paper work just to get it considered. It's not a matter of having "these people sit around with binoculars around parks waiting for them to build something so they can bother the park about it", it's about "these people" sitting around with binoculars watching EVERYONE so they can bother them about what they are trying to do. It is my understanding that if you add or take away land or construct over a body of water (not sure what size but i'm sure that Lake Erie is large enough) the government will get involved. I think it's like saying "What? Doesn't the fire fighter have anything better to do than to go out and fight fires?"

But i digress, are you complaining about these people or not? Because to me, and evidentally to redman, your tone and intent are somewhat in question.