Complete Flops?

Sorry to revive an oldie, but this has the exact info I wanted to comment on. Moosh suggested a definition for a 'flop' to which I would like to add:

Flop: A coaster/ride that never ran reliably, wasn't embraced by the public, resulted in major financial loss, and likely became defunct years before a normal ride would.

With that in mind, there have been several 'consensus' flops suggested in this thread:

Windjammer, Drachen Fire, The Bat, Deja Vu, Son of Beast (TBD), Hypersonic XLC (new addition!)

I also think you could create a category for 'minor flops' or rides which started out as possible flops but ultimately didn't completely crash and burn. I'll call them 'lemons'. Suggested lemons:

Dragster, Kingda Ka, Mean Streak, Disaster Transport, Steel Dragon 2000, X, others?

With all that said, I would have to say that Tomb Raider: The Ride at KI is currently the lead candidate for biggest non-coaster ride flop of all time. $20 million spent on a ride which 7 years later has no theme, reduced capacity by 1/3, a bad ride cycle, and shaky reliability.

Pagoda Gift Shop said:

Windjammer, Drachen Fire, The Bat, Deja Vu, Son of Beast (TBD), Hypersonic XLC (new addition!)

Batman and Robin:The Chiller at SFGAdv can probably be added to that list.

I certainly include Mean Streak in the Complete flop, Yeah it had huge lines first year or so. It was big pretty and PAINFULL You could get some good rides if you got there early before the track swelled in the sun but after that that first turn after the drop shook your brain in you head harder than SOB ever has (The whole drop was rebuilt and then eventually brakes were added and that removed the funnest part of the ride. The airtime drop near the RR Tracks) The second half of the coaster was never really inspiring and a squeeling mess)

TTD and Kingda Ka, When the company president says "If I knew then what I know now" Thats a pretty good indication the ride never pays for itself. Yet after bashing the decisions myself and riding Ka last year. The thirll is there!!!!!!!! Kinda a cross between a pro stock drag car and a F-16 gong Vertical. Neat

Deja's alread mentioned.

SOB, yes and no. It was disaster from start to removal of the loop but the public eats it up. Before the train change and loop removal it had a higher throughput than Papa

Back aways but THE BAT was open only a quarter of the time it stood there. It certainly wasn't a flop with the public but the design flaws were never correctable. (Namely the brake fins on the bottom of swinging cars)

^^^Why do you consider TTD a "lemon"? It's one of the most exciting and popular rides at Cedar Point...

True, but it's taken years to get it to run even sort-of-reliably. For whatever reason, it's much more tempermental than Xcelerator.

Well, when the company CEO says it was a terrible decision to build it, you know something is wrong. TTD had big hype and did not deliver. It was down for the majority of its first 2 years. It would be considered a flop if they had not finally figured out how to make it run consistently. It took them years to finally break the 1 million riders mark in a single season. Overall, it was not worth the price tag, but you are correct that it is indeed an exciting and popular ride.

Sonny *still* gets long lines, and pretty much always has on my visits. It sucks terribly, but as long as the people keep waiting in long lines to ride it, then "it really is just a bunch of enthusiasts whining" to some degree. Midwesterners just have an unnaturally high tolerance for pain... ;)

^^Agreed...TTD was a flop from an ROI stand-point, but it's still VERY popular and a decent experience as well, though really quick.

Also, Xcelerator is a POS now reliability wise compared to TTD...when I'm at CP, I expect TTD to be running at least most of the day...but since I've been going to Knott's more and more over the past year (due to business travel), I just assume I won't be riding Xcelator since it's been so up and down...wanna agree on this with me, Moosh??

Hercules- when you go from record breaker to outahere in less than 15 years, I think it qualifies as a flop.

^15 years sounds like a pretty acceptable life-span to me...considering what it was.

I do agree that it was a flop, though---even the designers were unimpressed after their first rides!

Why do people keep bringing up steel dragon as being a failure? It thrue a wheel....thats all. Other than it throwing a wheel one time, it had run like clockwork.

My vote for a complete flop coaster has to go to son of beast. It has a boring layout, it's beyond ruff, the rolling stock is horrid, and I am sure it takes a ton of monies to keep it going.

How about Flying Super Saturator? Eight years from "wow!" to "won't someone take this off our hands, please?".

Not to change topics, but it's funny how you can go the other way as well, with coasters that exceeded expectations...El Toro, Maverick, The Voyage, and Behemoth all (recently) come to mind as rides (based on the initial reviews that I read) that all exceeded how good some of the enthusiasts thought they may be...case in point, check out Jeff's podcast from 06 after riding Voyage and comparing it to his expectations!

RatherGoodBear said:Hercules- when you go from record breaker to outahere in less than 15 years, I think it qualifies as a flop.

Oh lets not forget Rattler. Both these coaster orriginal designes were altered to set a record without making the necessary adustments. Longer runouts ect

tigellinus said:Not to change topics, but it's funny how you can go the other way as well, with coasters that exceeded expectations...El Toro, Maverick, The Voyage, and Behemoth all (recently) come to mind as rides (based on the initial reviews that I read) that all exceeded how good some of the enthusiasts thought they may be...case in point, check out Jeff's podcast from 06 after riding Voyage and comparing it to his expectations!

Lets expand on this
Yet Voyage is a failure (My personal favorite by far but a failure) Not by the designers, Not to the riders and not to the park its in, But in Rolling stock.

By all means this coaster should put everyone on notice that they need a TGG ride, That didn't happen, Why? Because the ride is a maintainaince headache caused only by one thing. Some areas needed modified but still the trains wear it excessivley despite being modified for more articulation. TGG knew this, The park knew it prior to building but said, DO WHAT CAN BE DONE!

TGG has agrissivley worked to design a train that won't wear and tracks better and their solution is more than anybody but them could dream up.Lets just say VOYAGE WAS LIMITED BY WHY WHAT THE TRAINS COULD DO, NOT THE DESIGNERS and The Skys the limit now.

I think you're talking out of your rear, Chuck. Every park hasn't bought a Gravity Group ride because they either aren't looking for a wood ride or they're not looking for a ride that "agrissive." If it's a "maintainaince headache," they must get Aleve in by the truck load because it sure runs pretty well every time I get on it.

And seriously dude, get Firefox, it has spell check. No caps lock warning though.

DantheCoasterman said:
^15 years sounds like a pretty acceptable life-span to me...considering what it was.

You really think so? Even though the other wooden coaster in the same park has outlived it by 70 years? Hopefully by 10-15 years, you got enough return on the coaster to pay for it, but you still want it to last much longer than that.

Rollergator-

"Midwesterners just have an unnaturally high tolerance for pain... "

So is that how they have managed to cheer for the Big Ten all of these years?

Back on subject, I think that the Mr Freezes would qualify as Lemons.

An early looping coaster, designed by Lina Beecher and opened in 1895 at Paul Boyton's Sea Lion Park in Brooklyn, NY was a lemon.

That means the Flip Flap was a Flop!

How about Vertigo at Walibi Belgium? Intended to be the first cable glider coaster from Doppelmayr (known mostly for their chairlifts), it was torn down after being open for no more than a handful of days over three operating seasons.