Clementon Park's new owners hope to improve experience

maXairMike said:
Nevermind, I misread the ticketing page. Something I read made it sound like the water park was included with the theme park admission at first glance. As usual, I was wrong.

Yeah, if you spend the extra money for a two or three park ticket, it's included. I don't. I've never been in the waterpark. Hell, I've never been through the Safari and I've been going to the park since its opening in 1974!

billb7581 said:
Because the people are obviously traveling further to get to KI...

Wrong. KI's ticket mix is very heavily season pass oriented, not day-ticket.

NJ alone has 8 million people within 90 minutes of GA.

So by that logic, SFGAdv should have higher attendance? Is that what you're arguing?

I can't even figure out what Billb is arguing anymore.

He's arguing that if there was ever going to be a hotel built it would already have been done but there's not. And his fact is the lack if a hotel.

Yes. That's his argument and fact. I'd laugh too but I'm all out of humor for the nite.

Oh, he's still arguing that? It seems that some of the points he is now making supports the opposite. I need to go reread the entire thread again. :)

(and I suspect also nothing about how things really are ouside of the Philly/NYC corridor.)

I suspect you don't know how things are inside the I95 Corridor, along with several other people around these parts.

maXairMike said:

billb7581 said:

maXairMike said:
Or maybe they're, ya know, great parks? Ohio actually has a rather full history when it comes to amusement parks. People all over the state grew up going to them, and many companies have had company picnics at them for years. Now that all the local parks are pretty much gone, they all go to the two big parks.

That is the other possibility I came up with, that KI is a better run park.

The perception here is that GA is overrun with kids, because of the heavy discounting they do, and not somewhere you want to take a family. My nieces and nephews and their friends who just got their licenses have season passes, but noone else I know even bothers going there.

You completely missed my point...

And Gonch is right, you're out of your territory. As I stated earlier, they have already created the need (to make your visit a multi-day trip), but they haven't figured out how best to fulfill that need, and as a result are leaving a lot of money on the table. There are various reasons, but none of them are even close to what you have tried to say is the reason(s).

They've created the need how?

A waterpark does not a summer destination make, when you can drive another hour, have waterparks and everything else the beach towns offer. Go back and look at those tourism numbers by county. The County that includes Six Flags doesnt even come in second, it's a distant 3rd.

Hell, where I live in Burlington County does half the tourism business of Ocean County (county that includes Great Adventure) and there is nothing terribly interesting to do here.

Tekwardo said:
So Carrowinds [sic] is close to other things (uh, Charlotte) but GADv isn't, but GADv is apparently close to a million sports teams and huge cities, bi KI isn't. Therefore KI and Carrowinds [sic] can support hotels whereas GADv can't because it's 15 miles from the heaviest traveled highway in the US (kinda like like KD) and On billb's planet nobody has ever stayed in a hotel an hour from home. I think I understand now. Or something. Or not, whatever.

And you say no one you know bothers going there yet the park is notorious for being busy. I've apparently been more than you have in the last 20 years and I can tell you that on none of those visits was the park dead. And it wasn't overrun with just teens either.

PS Jimvid, I was referring to the new GADv coaster. The park flourished for 36 years whiteout it so why build it? That's the argument billb was trying to make for no hotel. Also re: supposedly 1% of visitors aren't daytrippers, what is the park's yearly attendance? That one percent could possibly be enough families to support a hotel depending on how much make up one percent.

Anyone know the Park's attendance for the last year or three? I googled but didn't find it.

[/sic][/sic]

You're just being annoying now.

Carowinds is IN friggin Charlotte.

Great Adventure is BETWEEN Philly and NYC but not terribly convienient to either.

Kings Island has to cast a wider net for visitors because fewer people live there. These people would be needing lodging.

Coasters are Great Adventure's core business. Lodging is not.

You're anecdotal evidence of visiting there twice is relevant how versus my living here and interacting with hundreds of people (families) who don't go there. I know tons of people (myself included) who truck to Knoebels and Hershey annually, or go to Wildwood for the week, but I never hear of anyone, or see on one of mine or my kid's facebook accounts about going to Great Adventure. The perception around here, correctly or incorrectly,is that it is overrun with "gangsta" kids dropping the f bomb every word and not really a good "family" spot. Older kids with licenses go but families, not so much. And it's not ust here on the Jersey side. I work in NE Philly and the typically Philly guy hates Great adventure because they hate New York, and anything 7A or above may as well be New York. Philly people tolerate South Jersey for our Corn and Tomatoes, and Wildwood... Philly people love Wildwood.. kinda like those Staten Island Guidos and Seaside Heights.

Mike Gallagher said:

Yeah, if you spend the extra money for a two or three park ticket, it's included. I don't. I've never been in the waterpark. Hell, I've never been through the Safari and I've been going to the park since its opening in 1974!

Yea those 3 seperate gates are really reeling them in !

So by that logic, SFGAdv should have higher attendance? Is that what you're arguing?

No, I am arguing there is more stuff to do here.

Great Adventure's relative lack of attendance demonstrates this.

The tourist spending by county also demonstrates this

Ocean County ranked behind Atlantic County (Casinos) and Cape May County (Morey's Pier's).

13 professional sports teams also demonstrate the magnitudes of order greater there are things to do here vs Mason Ohio.

Kings Island is probably a swell park, but you also have the big fish small pond deal. GA is a smaller fish in a bigger pond.

Wow, a septupal post. I think that must be close to an all time record. And not necessarily in a good way...

Tekwardo said:
He's arguing that if there was ever going to be a hotel built it would already have been done but there's not. And his fact is the lack if a hotel.

Yes. That's his argument and fact. I'd laugh too but I'm all out of humor for the nite.

Does GA own the entire town of Jackson, or all of Ocean County for that matter? What was ever stopping a hotel chain from building a hotel anywhere in the vicinity? They've only had 36 years now. Let's invoke Ockham's Razor here.

billb7581 said:
How many professional sports teams are within 1-2 hours of Mason Ohio?

From Jackson NJ you could go to a Phillies, Flyers, Eagles, Sixers, Mets, Yankees, Nets, Knicks, Giants, Jets, Rangers, Devils, or Islanders game in that span. The location right at 195 puts you on the cusp of both markets but not entirely in one.

NJ alone has 8 million people within 90 minutes of GA.

Philly has 1.5 million

NYC has 18 million.

billb7581 said:
I am arguing there is more stuff to do here.

13 professional sports teams also demonstrate the magnitudes of order greater there are things to do here vs Mason Ohio.

Kings Island is probably a swell park, but you also have the big fish small pond deal. GA is a smaller fish in a bigger pond.

I'm still not sure what this means. You're somehow trying to compare populations and sports teams to demonstrate the reason that SFGAdv doesn't need a hotel?

So those 27.5 million people have 13 pro sports teams within 2 hours and that somehow means something?

Well, Mason, OH has 5 professional sports teams within 2 hours (Reds, Bengals, Colts, Pacers, Blue Jackets) and with a mere fraction of the 27.5 million people. (the actual metro areas of Cincy, Columbus and Indy total somewhere between 5 and 6 million)

Which, if I'm following your line of thought correctly, means the population available per sports franchise is actually spread thinner in the KI market than in the SFGAdv market - meaning more competition for those entertainment dollars, not less.

The pond may be smaller, but that makes the competition between the big fish even more fierce.

billb7581 said:
You're just being annoying now

And you're not?

Great Adventure is BETWEEN Philly and NYC but not terribly convienient to either.

I couldn't make this up if I wanted to. REALLY?!??!!

Gonch: Don't forget the ridiculous number of people who come to town each year for the tennis tournaments across I-71 from KI. You know, the nationally televised thing that has gotten so big that they're adding a bunch of courts this year.

Lord Gonchar said:

billb7581 said:
How many professional sports teams are within 1-2 hours of Mason Ohio?

From Jackson NJ you could go to a Phillies, Flyers, Eagles, Sixers, Mets, Yankees, Nets, Knicks, Giants, Jets, Rangers, Devils, or Islanders game in that span. The location right at 195 puts you on the cusp of both markets but not entirely in one.

NJ alone has 8 million people within 90 minutes of GA.

Philly has 1.5 million

NYC has 18 million.

billb7581 said:
I am arguing there is more stuff to do here.

13 professional sports teams also demonstrate the magnitudes of order greater there are things to do here vs Mason Ohio.

Kings Island is probably a swell park, but you also have the big fish small pond deal. GA is a smaller fish in a bigger pond.

I'm still not sure what this means. You're somehow trying to compare populations and sports teams to demonstrate the reason that SFGAdv doesn't need a hotel?

So those 27.5 million people have 13 pro sports teams within 2 hours and that somehow means something?

Well, Mason, OH has 5 professional sports teams within 2 hours (Reds, Bengals, Colts, Pacers, Blue Jackets) and with a mere fraction of the 27.5 million people. (the actual metro areas of Cincy, Columbus and Indy total somewhere between 5 and 6 million)

Which, if I'm following your line of thought correctly, means the population available per sports franchise is actually spread thinner in the KI market than in the SFGAdv market - meaning more competition for those entertainment dollars, not less.

The pond may be smaller, but that makes the competition between the big fish even more fierce.

Im saying it is thinner, and spread out over a larger area. Kings Island doesnt have 17 million people living near it. You also dont have 13 billion dollars in tourism being done an hour away from Kings Island. And another 3 or 4 billion being done a half hour away from that 13 billion.

Great Adventure's relative lack of attendance to KI (despite drawing from this huge population) demonstrates that there is just more stuff to do here

Lets just simplify and say you only have 2 choices for recreation.. go to the amusement park or go to a baseball game. Here you could potentially go to 3 major league games and 5 or 6 minor league games just from where I am sitting.

Tekwardo said:

billb7581 said:
You're just being annoying now

And you're not?

Great Adventure is BETWEEN Philly and NYC but not terribly convienient to either.

I couldn't make this up if I wanted to. REALLY?!??!!

Make what up? If you were visiting NYC or Philly, or the Jersey Shore, why would you stay an 30 minutes or more away from any of them? Heck if you like looking at animals that much, the Cape May county Zoo is free and convienient to the Cape May/Wildwood/Sea Isle area.

Is it to late to agree to disagree? I don't want to get booted from the site. I was oblivious to the fact I was arguing with the site owner.

Bahahahahahahaha!!!

He's not the type to boot someone for disagreeing with him. We have healthy debates all of the time.

But I will take this opportunity to let you know that multiple back-to-back posting is frowned upon in the terms of service. It's generally better to try to consolidate your quotes and responses into a single post. I understand that's harder to do when you are debating with just about everyone else in the forum, but making the effort would be appreciated. :)