B&M Inverts: Cobra rolls or Batwings?

Thursday, October 18, 2001 11:45 AM
I know that "versus" topics aren't favored here, but since I haven't seen any topic like this, I figured I would post it and see what everyone has to say.

For those who have experienced both, which do you prefer?  The Cobra roll element, like the one on CP's Raptor and IOA's Dueling Dragons, or the Batwing like the ones on Top Gun: JTC and Montu.  I know they are rather rare as many B&M inverts do not feature these elements (I have not yet had the chance to experience either), so I was curious to see what people have to say about them.

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Thursday, October 18, 2001 11:56 AM
I've ridden both, and I think batwings are the best. Cobra rolls are a little too rough.
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 12:01 PM
unfortunatly i havent been on one with a batwing, but i have ridden Alpengeist, which has a cobra roll....i really like it but i have heard that the batwing is much much smoother....so im not totally sure
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 12:25 PM
I agree with LNM_Fanatic, Cobra Rolls are preety bumpy.
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 1:00 PM
Cobra rolls are a bit jerky to me, while Top Gun's batwing is smooth as glass with some great G forces :)
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 1:05 PM
I can't really tell the difference.
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 1:09 PM
Cobra Roills stink. It totally ruined Alpie for me. Other than that it would have been great. I thought you wern't s'posed to get headaches from B&M's...
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 1:46 PM

. <<<----that's the person who posts as "."
. said it best. I was really excited to ride Raptor, and the cobra roll was so jerky that it kinda ruined the ride for me. I still rode it about 6 more times, but that cobra roll isnt too good. I havent ridden an invert with a batwing so i cant compare. I think if the cobra roll was larger, or deeper in the turnaround, that it would flow better. It is the sudden change in direction that becomes jerky. If you familiarize yourself with the course you can brace for it, but even after 4-5 times on Raptor I still couldnt gauge where the cobra roll was untill we hit it (while on the ride).

*** This post was edited by LoadedG on 10/18/2001. ***

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Thursday, October 18, 2001 2:16 PM
Well, I dont think that either one is more or less jerky than the other. I've been on 2 batwings (Montu and TG:TJC) and 3 cobra rolls (Raptor, Ice, Alpie) (is that all of them?) I must say by far I prefer the batwings. 2 out of 3 of the cobra rolls just had no forces to speak of (save Alpie) but the batwings were intense through and through. They gave me that "my brains are going into my feet" sensations that the cobra rolls didnt. Now Alpie also gave me that feeling, but Alpie is so freaking huge....

Oh one thing though, the cobra roll on Ice has the best "Oh Crap!" moment of all time (in the front seat :))
jeremy

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"Nobody writes about the planes that land." Steve Salerno Washington Times 7-10-01

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Thursday, October 18, 2001 4:39 PM
2Hostyl. too words: True that!!!! I love the cobra roll on Ice, it is just so perfectly set up and executed. Yet the bat wing on montu is more intense and fluid.
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 5:03 PM
2Hostyl,
While I agree that for the most part that Raptor's cobra roll is forceless, the pullout from the roll (just before the mid-course) is quite intense.  I definitely get that "my brains are going into my feet" sensation...

*** This post was edited by Logan B. on 10/18/2001. ***

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Thursday, October 18, 2001 5:13 PM
I have only experienced Ice's cobra roll and Montu's batwing.  Out of the two of them I prefered the batwing because of the g-forces plus you go into the trench.  Although Ice's footchopper on the castle wall really added to the cobra roll.
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 5:43 PM
I don't know what you guys are talking about, I have been on Ice and Raptor and their cobra rolls didn't seem jerky or rough at all. They were smooth and fun. Unfortunately, I haven't been on a batwing on an invert.
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Thursday, October 18, 2001 6:51 PM
The batwing on Montu is the best, but the Cobra roll on Raptor is also very good.  I also liked the cobra roll on Alpie but if you ride it in the last row it is a little rough.
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Friday, October 19, 2001 6:22 AM
Batwings are by far more comfortable because you have a longer time to adjust to the second loop. The Cobra Roll is disorienting to me because the turn to the second loop is so short. I wish this part of the track could be extended to have a extra second or two to adjust to the shift in direction.
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Friday, October 19, 2001 6:26 AM

Excalibur said:
I have only experienced Ice's cobra roll and Montu's batwing.  Out of the two of them I prefered the batwing because of the g-forces plus you go into the trench.  Although Ice's footchopper on the castle wall really added to the cobra roll.
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Well not quite...  you've also hit Incredible Hulk's cobra roll.  I like the Hulk's roll because it's soo big..  It sweeps through the cobra roll, not jerks.

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I rode "X" and never went upside down.

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Friday, October 19, 2001 6:48 AM
The batwing on Montu is probably my favorite inversion elemant.

While I agree that cobra rolls on B&M inverts are rough, I find the vekoma ones (FaceOff) to be very smooth. Isnt that ironic?

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Friday, October 19, 2001 7:23 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't a cobra roll almost identical to the one on Vekoma Boomerangs?
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Friday, October 19, 2001 9:24 AM
I'd probably say cobra rolls. It'd be batwings for me, but Alpengeist's cobra roll is great.

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-Defender of Shockwave

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Friday, October 19, 2001 10:34 AM
Cobra rolls vary greatly from one ride to the next. I think Raptor's is quite intense, especially in the back seat (had to say that because I think Jeremy just wants to be grumpy toward anything Cedar Point ;)). On the other hand, Alpengeist is a real yawn. Ditto for Batman at SFWoA. On the other hand, Medusa at SFGAm seems to be a good middle ground.

I guess the only batwing element on the B&M's is Montu, and I'll have to get back to you on that in a month.

The funny thing is that the portion of the rolls that consists of half-corkscrews is what can make them smooth or head bangers. Raptor's is a little tough on the ears at the ends of the train, but it's fine in the middle of the train. Alpengeist is blah anywhere on the train.

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