Why Geauga Lake Cannot Survive as Part of Cedar Fair

Wednesday, May 30, 2007 1:52 PM
A bit off topic, but WHAT exactly are the prices being charged in 2007 for food and beverages at Geauga Lake, since there is alot of talk about the increase in prices?

I have a few kids to feed when we goto GL in a few weeks, and we usually eat at least once in the park, preferably WWK's Big Daddy's BBQ...

What are the new food/drink & drink refill prices?

*** Edited 5/30/2007 5:53:15 PM UTC by MidwavePC***

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 1:56 PM
What I do not understand is why the old water park is still there just rotting, off the main road and near the entrance??? Why not bulldoze it and just plant grass until future plans start taking place. I'm sure it's fenced off in the park, but what an eyesore. Jeff: can you explain?

Also, from Kinzel's interview, it sounds like more rides could be on the way out, but I think it could be suicide on the rides side if Dominator is taken out. I will visit for this ride alone, but have zero desire to go if it's not there..unless they want to make parking free and drop ticket prices to $15 (or something silly). A successful park has got to have a signature ride. Plus, I truly feel parking prices need to be cut way back...$9-$10 is enough to make a lot of people do something else on their day off.

Lastly, I think the marketing aspect should follow on the success of Holiday World. Add a dynamic water slide every year and hype it up like you would a coaster. Then every maybe 4 years or so, they can add a cost-effective ride that will appeal to the masses, such as a spinning coaster, a mid-size wooden coaster, or a large, unique flat ride. Holiday World does not spend a fortune on new attractions, but always seem to add quality.


*** Edited 5/30/2007 6:06:34 PM UTC by Martling***

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 2:03 PM

MidwavePC said:
A bit off topic, but WHAT exactly are the prices being charged in 2007 for food and beverages at Geauga Lake, since there is alot of talk about the increase in prices?

I have a few kids to feed when we goto GL in a few weeks, and we usually eat at least once in the park, preferably WWK's Big Daddy's BBQ...

What are the new food/drink & drink refill prices?

*** Edited 5/30/2007 5:53:15 PM UTC by MidwavePC***



http://www.coasterbuzz.com/forum.aspx?mode=thread&TopicID=47069

There's a pic in this post with a menu listing the prices.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 2:13 PM

MidwavePC said:
What are the new food/drink & drink refill prices?

Some of what we saw around the park (prices don't include tax):

Drinks:
LG - 3.99
REG - 3.19
LG Souvenir Cup - 8.49
REG Souvenir Cup - 7.99
Refills - 1.99
Kids Souvenir Cup - 2.39
Kids Refill - .99
Bottled Water - 2.82

Food:
Pizza - 20.99
Slice - 4.29
Chicken Fingers & Fries - $7.99
Cotton Candy - 2.25
Cheese on a Stick - 4.19 (or was that CP? not sure.)
Parfait thingy (pudding and whipped cream with sprinkles) - 3.25

*** Edited 5/30/2007 6:14:40 PM UTC by Lord Gonchar***

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 2:53 PM
I saw an ice cream float for seven bucks, which I found particularly offensive.

I don't know why the old water park components are still there, except to say that demolition isn't exactly cheap. I do agree that it looks bad from 43, if you happen to come from that direction (locals obviously might).

I always come from Solon, and going in the front gate, it's barely on the radar for me.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 3:21 PM
Move the old slides to the new park, or are they un treatable.
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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 3:25 PM
I think they moved all the good slides to the new park, the stuff that is still there I would assume is the really old stuff that GL had before Six Flags took over which is pretty old.
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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 3:28 PM
^most of those slides were less than two years old when CF acquired the park.
Sounds like a job for Norton or Ital could deal with.
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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 3:36 PM

CoasterDad64 said:
Red Lobster and Olive Garden (for example) are owned by the same company. Stick them side by side, throw in a Smokey Bones

If I liked GL a lot less I would totally go the

"Olive Garden and Red Lobster - the only two outfits that make my stomach turn more than Geauga Lake"

joke or some such thing but I really like the place so I won't.

But yeah, I just had lunch and typing "Olive Garden" makes my insides churn a bit. *** Edited 5/30/2007 7:37:22 PM UTC by matt.*** *** Edited 5/30/2007 7:37:39 PM UTC by matt.***

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 3:49 PM
I do want to clarify one thing. They didn't buy Geauga Lake to keep the competition out. They bought Geauga Lake to make money. That is the only reason Dick does anything.

If there is no potential ROI then Dick is going to pass it by. When he gets to heaven the first thing God is going to ask him is, "did you give me a good Return on my Investment?"

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 4:03 PM
^While not the sole reason, buying the competition is a Business 101 way to make money.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 4:11 PM
Unless you're Microsoft. Then you just do it because you can.
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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 4:32 PM

Jeff said:
I saw an ice cream float for seven bucks, which I found particularly offensive.

.


Man, And I thought Honey Hut was high.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 5:40 PM

Lord Gonchar said:
Some of what we saw around the park (prices don't include tax):

Drinks:
LG - 3.99
REG - 3.19

Food:
Chicken Fingers & Fries - $7.99



That's $3 more than chicken fingers and fries at KW and you get fresh cut fries there.

Regular drink at KW is $1.60 and a large is $1.90

This is really out of hand.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 5:54 PM
Hey Jeff...

Was that $7 float sold inside ben and jerrys?

It's the same thing at cedarpoint as well. I think it was somewhere in the range of $7-8 for a sunday. I don't really care much for ben and jerrys anyway. At cp, if you want a good rootbeer float, go to the ice cream shop in the rear of the park. They are only a couple of bucks back there and they are really good as well. I believe it is "Tofts" ice cream.

There is no sunday/ float worth $7.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 6:32 PM
Yes, the float is sold in the Ben and Jerry's. The prices they are selling for just a couple of scoops in a cup you can buy a whole pint in the supermarket.

They want to be a family park yet they are out pricing the family. They have a lot of competition in the area now - McDonald's, KFC, Ruby Tuesday's, a new Steak and Shake, and another restaurant is being built next to Steak.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 6:33 PM

wahoo skipper said:
I do want to clarify one thing. They didn't buy Geauga Lake to keep the competition out. They bought Geauga Lake to make money. That is the only reason Dick does anything.

If there is no potential ROI then Dick is going to pass it by. When he gets to heaven the first thing God is going to ask him is, "did you give me a good Return on my Investment?"


Just because Cedar Fair is making a good investment doesn't necessarily mean Geauga Lake is in good shape either. If the gains at Cedar Point outweigh the losses at Geauga Lake then Cedar Fair has made a positive return on investment. Is this good for the company? Yes. Is it good for Geauga Lake? No. Even if Geauga Lake is in the red; if the amount of additional business Cedar Point gets is greater then the company has made a good investment. The land Geauga Lake is sitting on has to be hot - just look at all the growth right around the place. Cedar Fair could theoretically run the park for years, sell it for the same price (or slightly less) than they paid for it to a real estate speculator who wants to tear the place down and build condos. Would this be a good investment for Cedar Fair? Definitely. They eliminate the competition forever and don't't lose a dime doing it. Would this be good for Geauga Lake? Obviously not.


Jeff said:
So tell us, Paul, what is the answer? If the answer is obvious, and the agencies and park don't get it, what is the solution?

Perhaps I was not clear enough in my original post...


Paul Blackstone said:
The best hope for Geauga Lake is for the park to be spun off and taken private. The private owner of the park has to focus on long-term results instead of annual or quarterly results. The private owner needs to pay competitive wages (which I understand from some of the park sweepers is bare minimum wage) to get better employees, improve the park’s marketing (which is extremely poor this year), correct the removal of live shows, and generally do whatever it takes to get people in the door. If that means lowering in-park prices, getting rid of the parking fee, or adding a new ride (I don’t think Cedar Fair has added a single one), the private owner needs to accept lower per-cap numbers in the short term.

I am concerned about Geauga Lake because it is the park I loved growing up; and honestly, I don't have the same feelings for the park now as I did in the 70s and 80s. Everyone invested in Cedar Fair should rightfully be concerned with financial results; I am not an investor. My argument is that for Geauga Lake to be great family parks like Kennywood or Holiday World it needs to be taken private and it needs to be owned by someone with a passion and love for Geauga Lake. Maybe this is realistically impossible; maybe there isn't anyone willing to take Geauga Lake private; I wish there was someone willing to make this happen because I believe a lot of the previously mentioned problems (prices, family friendliness, and marketing) could be corrected.


Martling said:
Lastly, I think the marketing aspect should follow on the success of Holiday World. Add a dynamic water slide every year and hype it up like you would a coaster. Then every maybe 4 years or so, they can add a cost-effective ride that will appeal to the masses, such as a spinning coaster, a mid-size wooden coaster, or a large, unique flat ride. Holiday World does not spend a fortune on new attractions, but always seem to add quality.

Sounds good to me. Quality is important but you have to sell the product too.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 6:58 PM
I think water-slides should count as "rides" myself but maybe that's just me.
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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 8:40 PM
^Private is subjective. Even family parks, like Holiday World, are still a business.

Who has a passion for amusement parks and has pockets deep enough to buy Geauga Lake (if it were for sale)? Not many, if any people.

Because such places are privately owned, we know little about their financial stability. I am confident that Holiday World is just fine, but it grew into what it is. The family started out small and grew.

Buying Geagua Lake now would take $150+ million at least then add in operating capital. Individuals with that kind of money are not in the amusement park business.

I also find it interesting that you suggest a private owner look to correct things in the short term. Isn't this what CF is doing? Plus, as a 2 billion dollar company, they have an advantage that private (and passionate) owner would not - deep pockets and the ability to sustain long periods of little or no return.

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Wednesday, May 30, 2007 8:58 PM

jwhoogs said:
I think if Maverick opened when it was supposed to you would had a better turn out at GL. Gl's opening and Maverick's opening in the same day is the reason for the low turn out.

Consipracy theory...

IIRC... CP didn't meet attendance goals last season (welp! Guess CP is going to be demolished!!!! omg)... *** Edited 5/31/2007 1:23:54 AM UTC by crombiedude11***

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