UPDATED: Walt Disney Company facing internal pressure over Florida's "don't say gay" bill

The idea that schools indoctrinate children is ludicrous. As an educator, if I had that much sway over my high schoolers they would actually do their homework. Spoiler alert: they don’t.

bjames said:

As a gay man and an independent voter...

Cool, but I don't think you speak for either group. I have read the bill, and your assumption that its opponents have not is presumptuous and arrogant. As Brandon correctly points out, to suggest that this is anything other than an anti-LGBTQ measure is fantasy. This is no different than the whitewashing intent ("straightwashing?") of the white fragility bill. Like the Abbott order in Texas, this is a thinly veiled attempt at pretending that if you don't talk about it, people won't be gay or trans or whatever people are afraid of. Like the Texas abortion law, it pulls the dangerous trick of deferring enforcement to vigilante individuals filing lawsuits, which is a gross abuse of the civil legal system and not good for anyone but lawyers.

This may not be everyone's take, but I'm 100% for teaching human sexuality K-3 and basically as soon as possible. My kids (8,10,12) are very aware of the birds and bees, sex, gender fluidity, homosexuality, etc. I categorically reject the notion that teaching kids about it will make them want to do it/be it.

bjames said:

Who here that opposes it has actually read the content of the final bill, as passed?

Okay, so do tell. If it's all just "media boogeymen," what is the actual text of the bill is different than what's being discussed?

> I'm 100% for teaching human sexuality K-3 and basically as soon as possible.

Strongly agreed. We bought both of our kids copies of "It's So Amazing" right around first grade or so, and used that as the basis of plenty of conversation. We though it was an excellent introduction to much of the range of human sexuality--it is not focused solely on reproduction or on heterosexual partnerships. I can't take any credit for this, as it was M's idea.

This also made it much easier to have conversations with them when they were adolescents and struggling with the things teens struggle with, because it wasn't the first time we'd touched on the topics.

https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/816473.It_s_So_Amazing_

Fun fact: it's also on the list of the 50 most commonly challenged/banned books of the '00s, so you know it's good.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/arts/books-and-media/top-50-banned-...cle560478/

We decided early on not to really protect our kid from anything. I swear in front of him, and he knows he's not supposed to use those words. We explained reproduction to him early on ("Eeeew, gross!"). He's been around gay married couples since birth. He's been in a wedding with a trans woman, when he was 6, and we explained that to him. You know what? None of that knowledge is problematic.

Brian Noble said:

> I'm 100% for teaching human sexuality K-3 and basically as soon as possible.

Strongly agreed. We bought both of our kids copies of "It's So Amazing" right around first grade or so, and used that as the basis of plenty of conversation.

We started with "It's Not the Stork" which I think is in the same series by the same author. Excellent resources.

That one looks great! When I saw your post, I wondered why we didn't start there, but it looks like it's because my youngest was 8 when it was published, and already had the "sequel."

bjames said:

As a gay man and an independent voter, I have no issues with this bill and I view the "don't say gay" framing of it as disingenuous, put forth by the overwhelmingly liberal LGBT lobby (which I don't support and which doesn't speak for me), and parroted by their partners in the media. Who here that opposes it has actually read the content of the final bill, as passed?

I have… Through several revisions. I’ve sat in committee rooms, House and Senate chambers in Tallahassee over the last month listening to arguments being made and voicing my own. I’ve watched hours of live streams with the legislation getting debated.

So here’s the reality of the situation that isn’t being clearly communicated: Every. Single. Attempt to temper the language and make amendments that keep the positive educational aspects of HB 1557 but lessen the stigmatization against LGBTQ+ individuals have been overwhelmingly rejected by Republicans. Every attempt to clarify the overwhelming vagueness found in the language has been quashed (what does “age-appropriate” mean exactly?). Even an amendment posed by Sen. Brandes (R) to change

“classroom instruction by school personnel or third parties on sexual orientation or gender identity may not occur in kindergarten through grade 3…”

to a broader:

“instruction on human sexuality may not occur…”

— that was flatly rejected by his party’s colleagues.

“Don’t Say Gay” and other bills like HB7/SB148 (which I believe will have even greater chilling effects down the road) are all part of a well-crafted and well-funded national effort to use anti-LGBTQ+ and particularly anti-Trans legislation as a wedge issue to appeal to their base. They’ll almost surely get demolished by the courts but by that point considerable damage will have been done — especially with regards to our youth.

Hope that clears things up.

Reminds me of a few years ago when Last Week Tonight with John Oliver created the children's book, A Day in the Life of Marlon Bundo, about Mike Pence's pet rabbit falling in love with another boy bunny. Though obviously fictional and mostly meant for adults to buy for the novelty and to support The Trevor Project, I wish there were more books like that for children to read. Books and media that more consistently include the LGBTQ+ community. I think when they're exposed to characters or people in the community earlier, the easier and more likely they are to accept and understand that it's normal. Hiding it from them or pretending it doesn't exist just introduces friction later and clashes with their accepted norms, making it harder to understand.

Just once example, but I bought the Marlon Bundo book a few years ago and after reading it I offered it to a friend who had a 6 year old (with her permission and being upfront with the context.) She let her daughter read it and it was no big deal.

I tend to agree that exposure is half the battle. I'm grateful for the fact that my kid has been growing up in diverse environments from the start.

But what I struggle with is that grown-ass adults who should be able to make rational decisions should realize how stupid any kind of discrimination toward people who are not like them really is. All of this nonsense fundamentally says, "You are less than me."

Apparently, the Human Rights Campaign is refusing Disney's $5 million donation.

Also Pixar employees sent a letter to Disney leadership expressing their disappointment with their inaction. As well as point out that Chapek's statement about their content being the best way Disney can support the community is at odds with a lot of creative decisions by executives. They are claiming that many diverse stories and characters they work on continuously get cut or dramatically reduced.

In a related note, if you haven't seen any of the short films in Pixar's SparkShorts program, I highly recommend them. There are many examples of diverse stories and characters. I think the problem is they remain sort of hidden and niche. They're available on Disney+ but the level of inclusion in these shorts seems to be reserved only for this program. While the mainstream productions don't stray too far from the norm.

In this last week, I've been astonished at the amount of internal cast I know both personally and otherwise speaking out and expressing their disappointment and frustration with leadership. They really seem to have hurt and disappointed a large amount of their own cast members. And Disney's statements and responses through all of this, to me at least, have been shockingly poor.

The HRC's statement is, essentially: Don't launder your reputation through us. Fix it or find someone else.

Good for them. MIT got slammed for taking Epstein's money while I had an administrative role at UM. That role included non-trivial fundraising activity. I asked our fundraising people if we (a) had a set of criteria by which we would not accept a donor's money and (b) had we ever used them to say no to anyone, ever. I was told that the answers were yes and yes, but I did not ever find out what those criteria were.

Nothing substantive to add but I did want to recognize skydivingjeff's post. Extremely well stated and I applaud you for seeking the facts...and sharing them.

From The Verge: Disney’s queer characters won’t hide its funding of real villains

Reading some of what Chapek said internally, about there being "sides," is that problem I've been saying for years about how dangerous it is to draw moral equivalence. Marginalizing or discriminating against people is almost always bad. It's one of those things where there is not another legitimate "side." It's not a debate about free healthcare or taxes.

RideOn said:

Also Pixar employees sent a letter to Disney leadership expressing their disappointment with their inaction. As well as point out that Chapek's statement about their content being the best way Disney can support the community is at odds with a lot of creative decisions by executives. They are claiming that many diverse stories and characters they work on continuously get cut or dramatically reduced.

In this last week, I've been astonished at the amount of internal cast I know both personally and otherwise speaking out and expressing their disappointment and frustration with leadership. They really seem to have hurt and disappointed a large amount of their own cast members. And Disney's statements and responses through all of this, to me at least, have been shockingly poor.

Disney's poor response to this can largely be attributed to the change in CEO position from Iger to Chapek but I think Zenia Mucha - the former Chief Communications Officer - retiring along with Iger is a big part of the misstep here that's overlooked. She was a fierce protector of the Disney brand (and Iger) internally and externally.

skydivingjeff said:

“Don’t Say Gay” and other bills like HB7/SB148 (which I believe will have even greater chilling effects down the road) are all part of a well-crafted and well-funded national effort to use anti-LGBTQ+ and particularly anti-Trans legislation as a wedge issue to appeal to their base. They’ll almost surely get demolished by the courts but by that point considerable damage will have been done — especially with regards to our youth.

Schools have become a battleground in the culture wars. Parents are terrified that kids are being taught CRT and that they should be a member of the LGBTQ+ community. Again, this is NOT happening in public schools. In response bills in several states want teachers to post their lesson plans for the entire year, or even have cameras placed in every classroom for parents to watch a teacher's lesson. Teachers who violate these proposals could be fined, fired, lose their teaching license, or even lose their pension.

Part of me wants to thank the red states for solving the teacher shortage in blue states. But the bigger part of me recognizes this is a well-funded and well-organized attempt to overthrow public education and roll out school vouchers under the guise of "choice" to subsidize private education for the rich.

This is yet another thing chasing teachers out of the profession. Two of my neighbors bailed. All of this micromanagement by non-experts coupled with long hours and low pay is not a great incentive to stay.

This is year 20 for me. I consider myself fortunate to teach in a state that supports education and a community that generally trusts teachers to do their jobs. Our administration is supportive and usually stays out of the way. Even so, there are times where I have seriously considered walking away. That feeling usually goes away once that bell rings and it's time to shine.

I'm glad you stick with it, but I can't blame those who don't.