Tea Parties, Glenn Beck protest Muslim Family Day at Six Flags Great America

As an "outed progressive"....I'm just forced to wonder. If a white guy came in and pushed this much of a moderate agenda (I mean, seriously, I've been disappointed on several fronts) - would they call him "communist, "socialist", and "Nazi",...or would they just see it the way I do and call him "Bill Clinton"?

Obama's administration has more than capitulated on many fronts. This "uber-liberal" Congress has not exactly delivered legislation that reflects any serious leftist bias (health care, financial reform). In terms of "tough on terrorism", just look at how much the current regime reflects the policies of the prior administration. Seriously, I cannot imagine a white guy in the White House facing this kind of vitriolic rhetoric.

I'm not saying "everyone in the Tea Party is racist". I don't think most people in the Tea Party even consciously think of Obamas race as a factor.

I do recognize that when times are tough (and this is as bad as mosst living people have seen) that people tend to turn on those seen as "others", be they illegal immigrants, people of different faiths, different sexual orientation, or even those with different skin color.

eightdotthree said (while I was posting):
There is common ground in the middle, there needs to be or else we will never advance as a country. It didn't always used to be this way.

Could NOT agree more. I think the tenor of the conversation has turned so bitter as to negate any real prospect for advancement in the short term. It really will take some true leadership on both sides to step forward and achieve subsstantial progress in the public debate. Sadly, I remember a time not THAT long ago when I thought of John McCain as being a candidate for one of those (leading) roles. *Le sigh*.

eightdotthree said: It didn't always used to be this way.

Actually that's not so. Fighting between the two dominant parties has been going on for hundreds of years. The thing is, in the days before Twitter, Facebook, the internet, cell phones, and television it wasn't broadcast as widespread.

Much like the "teens today" comment in the SCBB thread, nothing much has changed in that respect except for the medium in which it's spread.

Sam, like I said, I don't think you're a racist for watching Fox News, just an idiot ;).

(I kid, I kid. Kind of, but not really. But still kind of, but seriously, maybe... ;) )

When you see "Keep the government out of my medicare" signs, you have to feel sorry for some of the tea-partiers. Being West Indian, I do not believe most of the tea partiers are racist... Just not that bright. They are being played like a fiddle by Glen Beck, and Sarah Palin purely for financial gain. It's scary!

Actually, I'd have to disagree with Moosh (to a degree, LOL). The world of politics certainly changed with the advent of television....we did get Dick Nixon to kick around some more. The advent of the 24-hour news cycle changed things again, because now *everything* gets covered - obviously, more controversial things get more coverage.

Has there always been "spirirted political debate"? Yes. Has the nature and tenor the the debate changed? I think so...because there's just not much political mileage to be gained by "disagreeing without being disagreeable". There used to be more to be gained by reaching across the aisle to form a consensus that was in the best interests of the public. Now, I just don't see where that would get you re-elected...

El Gato Coastro said:
I do not believe most of the tea partiers are racist... Just not that bright. They are being played like a fiddle by Glen Beck, and Sarah Palin purely for financial gain. It's scary!

Well said!

rollergator said:
Obama's administration has more than capitulated on many fronts. This "uber-liberal" Congress has not exactly delivered legislation that reflects any serious leftist bias (health care, financial reform). In terms of "tough on terrorism", just look at how much the current regime reflects the policies of the prior administration. Seriously, I cannot imagine a white guy in the White House facing this kind of vitriolic rhetoric

If he was as liberal as the right says he is we would already have brought our troops home, and not just those stationed in the middle east. Even Bill Maher has been critical of Obama for not being liberal enough.

rollergator said:
The advent of the 24-hour news cycle changed things again, because now *everything* gets covered - obviously, more controversial things get more coverage.

It's all about the ratings and not about news or facts. The bul**** gets flung around so fast that even when presented with facts the public no longer cares. They are on to the next thing.

again I miss George Carlin! More fighting over the invisible man in the sky!

El Gato Coastro said:
I do not believe most of the tea partiers are racist... Just not that bright. They are being played like a fiddle by Glen Beck, and Sarah Palin purely for financial gain. It's scary!

Well said. If these people would actually look into the facts rather than just swallow what's being spoon fed to them by Palin and company. I don't have a problem that they don't agree with me, it's that their taking the word of propaganda as gospel when they're being flat out LIED to by these people.

It's time for the flock to "refudiate" the propaganda and scratch the surface to see the truth. :)

I don't deny anybody the right to their opinion, but when undeniable facts are flat out ignored just so people can perpetuate the lies that favor their opinion I draw the line. I'm sure people on both sides are guilty of it, but some of the most absurd stuff seems to be going on with the Tea Parties/Beck/Palin, etc.

There have been studies done showing that the more you fear something, the less able you are to think rationally about it. There's a whole crapload of fear being perpetuated by these people onto the masses, which is where all this anti-blacks, anti-immigrants, anti-Muslim stuff is coming from. The scary thing is that it seems to be moving from the fringes and spreading more and more into the mainstream. I suspect because too many Americans have decided it's easier to be told what to think (by people who share their opinions) than to seek out the facts. It doesn't help when you have a "news" organization that continually presents those opinions as fact.

I find it amusing that all this talk of fear is attributed only to the right. Every time there's an opening on the Supreme Court, isn't there a panic from the left that a pro-life justice may be appointed? OMG, millions of women will die every year as a result of back alley abortions! The whole world will turn into a desert, except for the parts that the melting polar ice cap and rising oceans will cover up! That's not fear mongering?

Don't the pundits on the left constantly tell us that businesses are evil and greedy and exploitative? Haven't they told us the only reason a person could be dissatisfied with Obama and his policies is because of racism pure and simple? If you don't think the stimulus is working-- you're a racist. If you have questions or concerns about the health care reform plan-- you're a racist. I see it as an easy way to evade a frank and honest discussion about the actual costs and repercussions of these programs.

While Cropsey, CPChris, 8.3, and Gato are all entitled to their opinions, I think it's really not much of an opinion to say "I'm right, because the people who don't agree with me are stupid, not very bright, can't think for themselves, and are getting all their information spoon fed to them." Really? Are all your opinions the result of extensive research, or do you just watch MSNBC or read the NYT and nod your head with what they tell you? If your only rebuttal to someone statement that "they're all..." is "well you're all..." (fill in the blanks), you're no better than the people you're complaining about.

I think too few people in this country have a sense of empathy anymore. They are unable or unwilling to understand why someone might feel differently than they do. Anymore people say they're right, and that's the end of the discussion.

Of course there are fear-pundits on both sides. I don't think anyone is suggesting there isn't.

WOW :)

I don't see the PAY/GO Line by line thru the budget. Systems broken We'll fix it. Jobs are getting shipped over sea's, We'll fix it. Policies this guy ran on.
If that's racism for not seeing a viable solution's being made I guess Im guilty.
I see a credit card thats reached its limit and the only way to pay it off is to take as much of what they can get from you. Dem/Repub, doesn't matter.

I honestly blame congress and previous congress' ( They were warned at least five times by Greenspan and others what was coming ) much more than Obama but the old saying goes, THE BUCK STOPS HERE. And please, with the huge majority blaming someone else is a joke.

RatherGoodBear said:
I think too few people in this country have a sense of empathy anymore. They are unable or unwilling to understand why someone might feel differently than they do. Anymore people say they're right, and that's the end of the discussion.

Political fundamentalism? ;)

RatherGoodBear said:
While Cropsey, CPChris, 8.3, and Gato are all entitled to their opinions, I think it's really not much of an opinion to say "I'm right, because the people who don't agree with me are stupid, not very bright, can't think for themselves, and are getting all their information spoon fed to them." Really? Are all your opinions the result of extensive research, or do you just watch MSNBC or read the NYT and nod your head with what they tell you?

Can't speak for the others but it looks like you're just tossing what we're suggesting back which is silly. Educating one's self does not mean just choosing another news source than FOX news.

I live around and work with many Muslims and have a couple of close friends that are Muslims as well. I've done basic research on the religion since it was something very foreign to me until moving to my current city several years ago and wanted to learn about it. Since I speak with coworkers and friends the topic of their religion comes up and I ask questions about them and their lives...as all friends do with each other. The Muslims I know were just as disturbed and devastated by 9/11 as everyone else. They have the added issue of a backlash from ignorant people that assume that their entire religion is responsible and supportive of terrorism. This isn't something that's been based on a CNN piece, it's what I know, live, have researched and experienced.

The Muslims I know were just as disturbed and devastated by 9/11 as everyone else.

Indeed. One of my Ph.D. students is a practicing Muslim, as are several others in the department. The people behind 9/11 represent mainstream Muslims much as, say, the Hutaree is representative of Evangelical Christianity.

RatherGoodBear said:
I find it amusing that all this talk of fear is attributed only to the right.

It is? Where was that decided? This particular story is attributed to the right, but in no way does it mean that it's the only source. But as far as public opinion goes, according to the linked research, the toxic nonsense coming from Fox News is clearly the worse and of it, and the most insane.

But that gets to the point I made earlier... because you can prove the opposite extreme or give examples of it doesn't make it any more acceptable.

RatherGoodBear said:
I find it amusing that all this talk of fear is attributed only to the right. Every time there's an opening on the Supreme Court, isn't there a panic from the left that a pro-life justice may be appointed? OMG, millions of women will die every year as a result of back alley abortions! The whole world will turn into a desert, except for the parts that the melting polar ice cap and rising oceans will cover up! That's not fear mongering?

It's worth noting the Republicans are threatening a filibuster of Elena Kagan's nomination. But that's the point of the hearings isn't it, to make sure no extreme is nominated.

The current make up of the court consists six Republican appointed justices and three Democratic appointments, with Obama's second appointment it will be four.

RatherGoodBear said:
Don't the pundits on the left constantly tell us that businesses are evil and greedy and exploitative?

Corporations aren't greedy and exploitative? This is where I have to agree to disagree. I don't trust corporations one bit.

RatherGoodBear said:
While Cropsey, CPChris, 8.3, and Gato are all entitled to their opinions, I think it's really not much of an opinion to say "I'm right, because the people who don't agree with me are stupid, not very bright, can't think for themselves, and are getting all their information spoon fed to them." Really? Are all your opinions the result of extensive research, or do you just watch MSNBC or read the NYT and nod your head with what they tell you? If your only rebuttal to someone statement that "they're all..." is "well you're all..." (fill in the blanks), you're no better than the people you're complaining about.

I never called anyone racist, nor did I claim I was right.

I honestly don't know many liberals who watch any cable news network let alone MSNBC. Most liberals I know get their news from the Internet from more than one source and perhaps listen to the <sarcasm>extreme leftist media outlet known as NPR.</sarcasm>

I have been known to watch clips from Rachel Maddow, I suggest the one where she dubunks the ACORN pimp scandal or the one where she scathes Fox New's treatment of Shirley Sherrod and also criticizes, imagine this, CRITICIZES, Barack Obama.

eightdotthree
If you're getting your news from one source, you're doing it wrong.

Cropsey, do you really think the sampling of your coworkers is indicative of the population as a whole? Do your co-workers who identify as Christian or caucasian represent the entirety of those groups too? The criteria for ranking coasters on this site is more stringent than that. Maybe the people you work with are the nicest people in the whole world, but I don't know of anyone who could say they spoke to 10-20 people and can unequivocally state that they know about the entire population.

Jeff, I was referring to the comments previous to mine. But I think it also represents a view found more widely on the net and in the media. That being that conservatives resort to fear-mongering and racist attacks because there is no way to refute the liberals' arguments otherwise. I would say there are valid questions and concerns out there, but instead the msm decides to report instead on an uproar over Muslim Day at Six Flags.

8.3, in an earlier post you said you thought the whole tea party thing was bizarre. I don't know where anyone has argued that we should eliminate public parks, public roads, etc. And I don't see where using a public park is inconsistent with a belief that our governments at all levels can't continue to spend money that we don't have and push off the repercussions of that spending to future generations. Or that legislators are voting on bills that will cost hundreds of billions of dollars without even reading them. Instead they vote according to what the lobbyists are telling them or gauging whether a yay or nay is more likely to get them re-elected.

And as far as corporations. You can say with certainty that every single entity in the world that is incorporated is greedy and evil? Well good for you. Hope that means you're boycotting Cedar Fair, Six Flags, Hershey, Kennywood, and Herschend. Despicable bastards, every one of them. And doesn't NPR rely heavily on donations from those greedy corporations? Hmmmm, shouldn't they be refusing that blood money?

I believe I already mentioned Maddow as a commentator with her own biases and agenda. I'd hardly consider her a strict "news" source. I thought you'd at least mention the Huffington Post. Try again, and thanks for playing.

Wow.