Six Flags Exclusive Adventure
This should be utilized to maximize profits AND preserve the guest experience. They could start with different pricing on different days...but I propose an ever-changing price based upon bodies through the gate.
In a way, parks already do it to a certain extent with things like twilight or evening rates. But that's more a way to get more people in a traditionally slow time, not shift a large part of traffic away from busy weekends.
I assume most locals know that Saturday is the worst time to hit the parks. Vacationers should be able to schedule visits during the week. I guess the question is, who is crowding the parks on Saturdays, and how difficult would it be to get them to come on other days?
The fact is that people willingly pay tiered hotel/airline price structures. It might take a bit for the typical amusement park guest to adjust to a new pricing structure, but there is no reason to suspect that guests would not eventually adjust like they have in the other mentioned business models. There would be early bitching for sure...but eventually most would bite the bullet. Much like a traveler needs a bed to sleep in or a plane to cross the country...where you going to go to get your thrill ride fix? It is a rather inelastic commodity...I think...?
RatherGoodBear said:I assume most locals know that Saturday is the worst time to hit the parks. Vacationers should be able to schedule visits during the week. I guess the question is, who is crowding the parks on Saturdays, and how difficult would it be to get them to come on other days?
I think even though people know it will be crowded, it sometimes can't be avoided. Even if parks offered $10 - $15 off for a weekday ticket, I would think many wouldn't want to take a day off from work anyway. Then then are the summer kids activities such as camp that parents aren't go to pull kids away from to go to a park after they spent all the money on the activity.
Personally, I'd rather not go to a park at all then go on a summer weekend. It's no fun standing in line when I can go on a weekday and deal with minimal lines (thanks to my non traditional work schedule)
Plus I think a lot of people go to parks on Saturdays knowing they still have Sunday to rest up before going back to work-- especially if they stay late or drive some distance. They can't do that during the week, unless they take 2 vacation days. How many people would want to do that?
The Red Sox Vs. the Yankees will cost more to see than the Yankees Vs. the Devil Rays.
I just don't want a lower weekday price to justify few open rides and attractions.
Here's To Shorter Lines & Longer Trip Reports!
Come on! Look at Medusa's station...that's the kind of day that gets you re-rides. Hell, the creator of the video claims to have gotten 25 rides that day...and I'd say that's low considering the conditions.
This kind of thing could work - but not at a time of year when the park is this dead to begin with. Nice try, Six Flags. Right idea...horrible timing.
If people are used to going to parks on Saturdays, how easy will it be to break them of that habit and nudge them toward going during the week? Just look at gas prices-- as high as prices got, people did a lot of pissing and moaning about the price, but hardly did a thing to change their driving habits or reduce their consumption.
Would the same thing happen with parks? Saturdays would be as crowded as ever with people paying even more and b****ing even more than that how the park is too crowded, they're being ripped off, etc.
It would be in the parks' interest to spread the crowds out, if only to better utilize their facilities on traditionally slow days. But if someone insists on bringing 3 busloads of people from their group on Saturday, is the park really going to turn them down?
Weekend price increase (sold as weekly deals) is the place to start. As a guest, I'm hoping a major increase will decrease the crowds for an improved experience. But...if as some of you seem to indicate...the weekends will be crowded no matter the cost...then the park should increase the prices for business reasons.
Either way...the weekend should cost a lot more than a week day. That space in an amusement park is much more Valuable on a Saturday than a Tuesday!
RGB:
I don't have a problem with the variable pricing concept, so long as the parks market it so the lower prices are a discount below the standard weekend rate. Not that the weekends are a premium rate above the standard weekday. I'm not sure sometimes that the parks can fathom that.
RGB:
If people are used to going to parks on Saturdays, how easy will it be to break them of that habit and nudge them toward going during the week? Just look at gas prices-- as high as prices got, people did a lot of pissing and moaning about the price, but hardly did a thing to change their driving habits or reduce their consumption.Would the same thing happen with parks? Saturdays would be as crowded as ever with people paying even more and b****ing even more than that how the park is too crowded, they're being ripped off, etc.
I think the daily price stays the same and the weekend price skyrockets. On top of that, the slow season rates are different than peak summer rates.
To me the point isn't just to shift the crowds, but also to maximize revenue.
Disney already kind of does this indirectly via their resort prices. We know hardly anyone goes to Disney for a signle day and we know a hell of a lot of people stay at the resorts. Vacation package prices vary (because of hotel rates) with the seasons. Of course, it's an easier sell because all hotels do this.
I dunno. If it were me and my normal gate price were $40 - that would be the price for 'normal days' and I'd go from there. Peak weekend days would be much higher and slower early and late season weekdays would be a little lower to entice the crowds. (maybe $30)
You would see a slight crowd shift, but you'd see a lot more revenue.
JRS:
But...if as some of you seem to indicate...the weekends will be crowded no matter the cost...then the park should increase the prices for business reasons....the weekend should cost a lot more than a week day. That space in an amusement park is much more Valuable on a Saturday than a Tuesday!
Bingo!
LG, and JRS, your opinion is that parks can raise their weekend rates to $80 or $100 and suffer only slight losses in attendance (from what 40K to 35K?) So far it doesn't appear the parks are as confident as you are. In fact it seems that the net result in per cap increases is an offset to attendance that keeps revenue basically flat.
Too bad we haven't had any kind of take on the exclusive adventure from SF, whether it's something they want to try again, try in other parks, try with a different price point, etc. This year so far it looks like neither $0 or $199 admission has worked too well for Six Flags. Like they say on The Price Is Right... Higher! Higher! Lower!
Some families just can not go to a park on a weekday. Daddy has to bring home the bacon.
And not everyone who visits Disney stays for more than one day. Just look at the people who already live in Orlando.
I'm enjoying the read, but I don't have much more to say on the topic.
I think Dorney did, or does, the weekend price thing...or maybe it was just an off season discount.
Yeah, Dex. I do believe Dorney adjust pricing based on the season, but I always assumed it was because the waterpark is such a big part of the draw and the prices were lower when it was closed.
And not everyone who visits Disney stays for more than one day. Just look at the people who already live in Orlando.
Wouldn't locals be more inclined to visit multiple times throughout the year? You know - that whole season pass thing. Of which, you're not touching one at WDW for less than $434 (the premium pass is $559) and that doesn't include the waterparks ($100 more). Admittedly, I do know there used to be FL resident discounts...I imagine that still applies.
Perhaps a better example than my hotel one is the ticket prices themselves - you get a discount for buying into more days. It's in the vein of (but not the same as) the fluctuating pricing thing. One day at WDW is $71 ($71 a day). Ten days is $225 ($22.50 a day).
They're influencing their customers visiting habits with a specific pricing structure.
I think all JRS is suggesting is doing a similar thing on a regional park level - influencing the customer visiting habits through specific pricing structures.
Same kind of idea. One just attempts to influence how long you visit while the other would attempt to influence when you visit.
That is because it is their money on the line. :) It is easy for me to sit back and tell them what to do with their money.
In all seriousness, they may know there is a weakness in our/my argument, or they may not have the luxury to find out since they are carrying so much debt and cannot afford to alienate status quo.
Available evidence from past regional park performance and decisions leads me to believe they are not as competent as the average enthusiast seems to think though. Many regional decisions are shotgun approaches with ever-changing long-term goals (see tweety “or is it twiddy” :) bird, 25 cent cotton candy, etc). I think fear of change may be their (regional themers) silver bullet. Something has got us to the point in which two companies own most the major fair weather parks…and both are in debt/market hell.
In fact it seems that the net result in per cap increases is an offset to attendance that keeps revenue basically flat.
This seems accurate on the surface. The question I do not understand/have an answer for is how the decreased attendance/increased per capita figures affect operational expenses…?
I’ve long argued that operational expenses should decrease and/or guest experience should improve. There are a lot of variables at play here…but the bottom line is increased long term profitability…and how to get there…?
*** Edited 9/18/2007 8:03:57 PM UTC by Jeffrey R Smith***
"DK bought, I'm buying FUN...Shapiro sold, I'm getting out of SIX"...What's Britney up to, and where's Paris? ;)
You can't reduce maintenance.
You won't save that much on labor. Even if you have several thousand fewer guests paying much more money to get in, you can't turn around and close too many rides, food stands, games or souvenir shops. Too many closed attractions and shuttered buildings gives the impression of a depressed city downtown, not a vibrant park.
You might save some utility costs (water and sewage) with fewer customers. Negligible electric savings, I'd think. It's not like you can turn fryers and freezers off if you have 20 percent fewer customers throughout the day. They'll spend less on food and drink, but those are the highest markup items as it is. TP and hand soap seem to be where they'll score the biggest savings.
I'm sure there are expenses I haven't thought of, but those seem to be the main ones for me.
dexter said:
I think Dorney did, or does, the weekend price thing...or maybe it was just an off season discount. I can't remember exactly, but I liked it because it gave me a cheaper price to go when the park wasn't as busy.
What Dorney does is with certain group tickets. They are "weekday only" tickets. If you use them on a weekend (I guess if you couldn't make it the day the group went), there is I think a $10 upcharge.
Otherwise, prices change depending on what is offered, in May before WWK opened it was $24.95 gate price and would have been $24.95 in September before Halloweekends if WWK was closed and there were no buyouts. When WWK is opened, it's $37.95 gate price and for Halloweekends it's $29.95 gate price. The difference is that at the $37.95 gate price, you can use coupons to bring it in the $30 - $32 range but at the cheaper rates, there are no discounts available so price change is not that much. *** Edited 9/19/2007 2:32:34 AM UTC by YoshiFan*** *** Edited 9/19/2007 2:33:01 AM UTC by YoshiFan***
lata, jeremy
You are indeed correct!
Bear:
I was waiting for Gonch to answer the operational expense question...mostly out of laziness and time constraints. :)
Anyhow, maintenance theoretically should be less. Less bodies on rides means less wear and tear. Less bodies means less gum on trees, walls, rides, etc. Less restroom activity means less clean-up. Decreased paper/ticket costs, decreased toilet paper/napkins, decreased plastic silver wear, decreased paper cups, decreased litter and trash removal...so and and so forth. I'm guessing these operational expenses are not a drop in the bucket...?
Staffing could theoretically be decreased...but at the risk of maintaining the current lousy guest experience. Safe to say that your typical regional themer would probably go the reduced staff route. They've not a long history suggesting they care too much about how the average guest is treated once inside the gate.
Anyhow...operational expenses includes all this stuff that is not directly connected to the exchange of money (profit), but is needed for the exchange to happen. When you have less people to serve, operational expenses should decrease absent a change in the level of service provided before/after. There are huge consulting businesses who specialize in helping companies reduce operational expenses (often referred to as inefficiencies, wastes, redundancy, etc).
The Gonch theory banks on the idea that higher per capita's and the related operational expense decreases will more than off-set decreased attendance.
You have reasonable doubt that this could work...? You might be correct. I say it has never been tried full-scale...and certainly not under the ideal conditions (i.e. 4th of July weekend would be the place to start)! ;)
The Gonch theory banks on the idea that higher per capita's and the related operational expense decreases will more than off-set decreased attendance.
That pretty much sums it up.
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