Six Flags Exclusive Adventure
No playa...but they might be able to offer a no-line hassle-free day the likes of which has not been seen in the business. Disney has made itself unique through theming. Can a regional themer or two make itslef unique through multiple-major-thrill-rides without the wait?
There are two major variables at play...none of which have been seen or tried to date. They are as follows...
- Can a regional themer actually provide good customer service, short lines, tolerable food,etc...and do it consistently?
- Are there enough rich folk willing to spend a lot of money for a unique hassle-free experience?
My opinion is that in certain markets like Jersey...#2 is easy to see happening. There are enough people in the immediate area who could afford a $300/day price tag if the product is worth it. Also, if the product is worth it, I would suspect people with that kind of money would travel for such a unique experience...just as they travel to Disney now!
I'll admit that I have my doubts that #1 is obtainable no matter what the admission charge is. Regional Themers have a long history of piss poor customer service, and a history of making very poor business decisions. Nothing they have ever done would lead me to think they would actually be able to pull a 180 and turn themselves into service experts. A few parks are sitting on a rare commodity...but currently offer this commodity to the public with a service level somewhere between McDonald's and Scooter the drug dealer.
#1 is the key to everything. If the park can deliver short-to-no lines for major coasters, serve edible food with little-to-no wait, keep the park clean, etc...then I see a chance that such a model might work.
I don't even think the chance is above 50%. I've been accused of being happy to see people priced out of the market, etc...but this is really a distortion of reality. I just want short lines for rides and food provided in a clean environment, minimal break-downs...and I want this every time I go. I don't want to have to luck into a good day...hoping Scooter is in a good mood!
I'm for the cheapest means of obtaining the bolded sentence above. My hunch is the cheapest price tag for such an experience is between $200-$400 per day. If it can be done for $20...then put me in the dexter camp!
My opinion is that in certain markets like Jersey...#2 is easy to see happening. There are enough people in the immediate area who could afford a $300/day price tag if the product is worth it.
Yup. Easily.
I'll admit that I have my doubts that #1 is obtainable no matter what the admission charge is.
I wonder this myself. My faith lands in the general vicinity of "with so few people in the park, it'd be pretty hard to screw it up" - but who knows?
I'm for the cheapest means of obtaining the bolded sentence above. My hunch is the cheapest price tag for such an experience is between $200-$400 per day. If it can be done for $20...then put me in the dexter camp!
Obviously. I wasn't under the impression that this even needed to be stated. It should be understood. I think we're all on the same boat there.
Scooter the drug dealer.
You go to Scooter!? Wow, small world. I use Scooter quite often myself.
I just wish he'd raise his prices so I wouldn't have to wait in line so long. His product could certainly justify higher prices. ;)
Seriously though, good post overall. I think we're very much on the same page (some minor variations, I'm sure) - we just express it differently.
Disney has made itself unique through theming.
Here's the one place where I'd like to disagree. Well, not so much disagree as elaborate...eh, maybe disagree.
Disney has made itself unique in that it is a destination. People go to Disney like people go to Niagara Falls or Vegas or Rome. Disney is a destination. People don't go to Orlando and maybe stop by WDW, they go to Disney World and maybe see a little of Orlando while they're there.
Disney is afforded many luxuries in their business approach thanks to this fact.
- Disney is indeed a resort catering to 40,000-300,000 (low?) people on property for any given day.
- For Great Adventure we are talking about needing 3000-5000 people to possibly make it work.
We are either comparing apples to jock itch...or we are purposley distorting the debate to create an impossible standard to reach given the infastructure available at Great Adventure. Which is it? ;)
It could be argued that after parking, admission and a q-bot, you are paying a Disney price and getting a similar experience with the shorter waits with the use of your qbot.
If Six flags thinks of themselves as Disney...that is a joke. In the case at hand...they have not tried to be Disney.
Is that a realistic number to hope for? I'll leave that for the number crunchers here to decide. But I think anyone expecting to have the park to himself and 2999 other people will be disappointed. And don't expect SF to sell only 3000 tickets for this event if they're able to sell more.
Rob Ascough said:You mean to tell me there's an Orlando outside of WDW and I-Drive?
I'd say there's a fairly large percentage of guests, both International and domestic, that doesn't see much other than Orlando International Airport and Disney property for a week at a time, maybe even year after year. Then they fly home, and think they've "visited Orlando".
Lord Gonchar said:People go to Disney like people go to Niagara Falls or Vegas or Rome. Disney is a destination. People don't go to Orlando and maybe stop by WDW, they go to Disney World and maybe see a little of Orlando while they're there.Disney is afforded many luxuries in their business approach thanks to this fact.
Who in their right mind would spend all that money on swampland in Central Florida, with nothing around for miles? Walt...
Six Flags could exclusive their butts off until the cows come home (and they are starting, thanks to Gonch and his wife, LOL) - and it's paying off in a big way. They'll never be able to become a chain full of parks that people will fly out to in Anytown, USA. But chances are, more people would RATHER spend a week in Orlando than having an occasional VIP day at a local SF - but for those who HAVE that kind of resources, their TIME is just too "valuable" (in their opinion) to either fly to Orlando for a week or to spend a day at the local SF waiting in lines...and now SF is recognizing the value of the time of those customers who CAN make a difference in the chain's bottom line.
Call it "Six Flags Adventure to Profitability" ;)
You still have Zoidberg.... You ALL have Zoidberg! (V) (;,,;) (V)
What do you think the "tipping point" will be?
At what number do guests figure they're getting the shaft and this adventure isn't so exclusive after all? And more importantly decide to not come back to the next one?
Another question I asked before that I didn't see a response to is, what incentive do the workers have to hand out that free popcorn and cotton candy at a pace even slightly faster than a garden slug? (Bonus pay? Double time?-- might have to let a few hundred more in the park to cover the extra wages.)
Most of your takes have already been debated...dare I say we are reaching dead equine status...? I'll give this a gentleman's whirl...and just point to either #1 or #2 as needed.
Let's say there is an enormous amount of interest in this. Say 15,000 people decide they want in on this exclusive adventure.
Man you really think they will have no problem with #2. :) If they get this many people...safe to say that the undercharging theory would have a lot more weight...and I need to quickly buy some SIX stock!
Does SF say "sorry, you can't come in" to 5 or 10 thousand people waving 300 dollars under their noses?
Probably should limit it if they want to meet #1. Nobody knows what will happen. Exciting times for amusement park buffs...to see how the experiment plays out.
Should they?
Yep for this time... they should jack the price up to $400 next time if demand is that high! ;) As stated many a time...#1 is key to making this work.
Do they hope people don't notice an extra 5 or 10 thousand people in the park?
Nobody knows what they are thinking. I would hope they would be smart enough to abide by #1. But as stated countless times...this is not a chain with a history of making smart decisions...and even when a smart decision is made (as this appears to be on the surface)...the follow through is typically weak. We will have to wait and see how it plays out!
What do you think the "tipping point" will be?
After $300...I'm guessing they won't expect a tip too. But if the service is "that good" then tipping is always a nice gesture! :)
I've not done the math...but I think 3000-5000 is reasonable...off the top of my head!
At what number do guests figure they're getting the shaft and this adventure isn't so exclusive after all?
You keep arguing #1. This presumtuous question wreaks of anticipitory failure. Again...we'll have to wait and see...
And more importantly decide to not come back to the next one?
More #1 stuff...
Another question I asked before that I didn't see a response to is, what incentive do the workers have to hand out that free popcorn and cotton candy at a pace even slightly faster than a garden slug?
Another #1 discussion...
This has been answered quite a bit. A garden slug can serve 5000 exponentially faster than 20,000. With no change in effort or staffing...efficiency improves.
Long term...improving revenues and decreased operational expenses inherent to the plan at hand...lead to an ability to pay more for help (if needed)...out with the slugs and in with the bees.
#1 is key to all of this happening. They must show the guest who use this service on the first trial...whether 25 or 2500...a good time with short waits and a fun environment unlike a typical random day at a regional themer. If the service is there...it seems nobody believes #2 will be a barrier.
Half the battle is won if our assumptions about #2 are correct. The rest is just wondering if they can pull off #1!
I too have my doubts...but hope to see this work...as I would love nothing more than a stress free day at a large amusement park with multiple thrill ride offerings. These days I have to go small or not at all...
Man you really think they will have no problem with #2.
You can get something over the counter to help if you're having problems with #2. ;)
(christ, I can't believe I went for that)
Of course, they screw a lot of people all of the time, and they still come back for more...
SF has proved time and time again, once they have your money, they don't care about providing a decent experience. Short term rip-offs vs. long term profits; which would I choose as a customer?
I hope someone here provides a TR from this event. Remember the hoopla about the free admission event in GA? Not handled well. I want to believe in SF.
I agree with you. I too think #1 will be tough for a park, with this well-earned reputation to deliver. I am willing to give them a chance though. Maybe $300/head will force management to take things a bit more serious than status quo.
What is interesting to me is that those who do not seem to like the idea proposed freely admit that Six Flags provides a rather lackluster experience. Why all the worries that the "little guy" will be forced out of an opportunity to go into the park for this...
SF has proved time and time again, once they have your money, they don't care about providing a decent experience
You just nailed it dexter. We all seem to agree on the problem. It is the solution that has us seeing things differently.
I say give something like $300/head a chance to see if it too can fail as exponentially more rides, more tweety birds, clean restrooms, parades, etc have failed before it.
How can this experiment be any worse than what has come before? The fact is...people are not coming back for more. The chain is struggling to reduce costs and increase revenues because attendance has not kept pace with expenses.
I certainly agree that this park chain deserves no benifit of the doubt. But at this point in time their reputation is so soiled...there is no place to go but bankruptcy or...a major change in the way they do business!
I too want to belive in SF. I also want to believe that water can fuel cars, terrorists don't mean us harm, etc. Life experience has taught me to observe the results and put all the fruitless hoping in the back of the mind...or out of the brain all together!
My girlfriend and I are going to be down the road from Magic Mountain on my vacation, a place I have always wanted to go, but don't want to risk a day of our vacation with a bad trip to an amusement park. Thats how much faith I have in Six Flags right now.
Did SF put out a press release on how it went? I haven't seen one here, and we all know how much SF loves press releases. I'm just curious to know how successful this adventure was.
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