Six Flags Announces Nation's Best Theme Park VIP Program
If...
- the extra service brings in more revenues than it costs to run
- a proper percentage of people who don't buy the service come back
...then yes that is good business decision.
- Jeff
Charles Nungester said:
But redman, Didn't I state at restaurants that have no reservations?I think almost everyones tryed to bribe to get a perk at one time or another. Doormen at sold out concerts used to make a killing.
Chuck
Details detals, you like splitting hairs, don't you?
Ok, yes, so I didn't specifically also mention other restaurants where I have also done the same thing. I will give the details of one of those so you can relax.
At a local Cheesecake Factory where no reservations are taken (OK...you happy now?) where the wait is usually well over an hour, I have taken the "pager" wait a couple minutes until noone is waiting at the host podium and go back with the pager and a $20 bill tucked alongside and ask them how much longer for my table. Usually my wait is only a couple more minutes and voila, my pager goes off....
--George H
Gonch, it's not the first time SFGADV has had record years. Any new installations usually provide a temporary rise.
Like So and So said, How many come back when the operations stink?
Chuck
I'm *staunchly* with Gonch on this. I wish *more* places would offer these services. I *love* the freedom to do things on *my* terms, and not just "the luck of the draw". I dont necessarily know, going into a park that I could ride Magnum in the morning with no wait or Raptor in the early evening as a virtual walk-on. Moreover, I'd prefer not to have to criss-cross the park several dozens times just to get reasonable wait times. If by plunking down an extra hundred I get to bypass all that, it's a hundred well spent.
Listen, if you think that visiting on "off days" is the proper way to reduce waits, then those should be the days *you* visit. Personally, I cant always do that. So I'll use what I have an excess of (money) to maximize what I have little of (time). I'll buy Q-bots, round up Fast Passes, and stay in Universal hotels for FoL. These things are GREAT!
Actually, I grow more and more tired of this "debate" (disagreement is probably more appropriate) each time it surfaces. It seems readily apparent to me that it is "haves" v. "have nots" and, quite frankly, as one of the "haves" I say "TOUGH". Life sucks; buy a helmet! This is not, nor has it ever been, an issue of "fair" v. "unfair. It's all about "Profitable" v. "Not Profitable". And as many here who so vehemently oppose the trend, yet still visit the parks, I am led to lean towards "profitable".(***)
As Rob A. has eloquently stated, this type of 'preferred' treatment is showing up everywhere. And as Gonch has alluded to, it is only going to become more pervasive. The only thing that I *will* give you all is the capacity issue. I oo believe that SFI should make better effort at running their rides efficiently. However, even if the rides had moderate waits (20-30min), I'd *STILL* opt to buy the Qbot. That's 20mins I can be people watching or picture taking catching those little moments that we so often miss because we are rushing from A to B in fear that we wont have time for C.
Laugh if you will at me "wasting money", but as much as you think I dont get y'alls point, you dont see mine either. I want every possible "unit of fun" I can get from a park. And, IMHO, the "fun units" I get from leisurely park days are worth *far* more than the price they are charging.
(begin Rumsfeldian) So in the end, do I feel 'bad' about buying time "stolen" from another patron? Not in the least. Does this make me an accomplice to the 'theft'. Far worse, I'm an enabler! Do I have no morals? Irrelavent, this isn't a moral issue. Poverty, is a moral issue. Hunger, is a moral issue. The Environment is a moral issue. Who gets to go first on an ammusement park ride is so low on my list of things to be morally outraged about that you'd see me as a card carrying member of PETA before I decry virtual queues (and I think they're mostly scum).
Sorry for the rant (though it seems the "in" thing this offseason). Have a great day!
lata, jeremy
(***) who understands that there are some who dont visit 'virtual queue' parks. Kudos to y'all!
I've always agreed that if needed, I'd probably fork it over just to get what I wanted.
My argument has always been. SHOULD I HAVE TOO? and have pointed examples like saturdays at almost any park. But if operations demand it. I think it's ripping the customer off.
Chuck
I could afford the Q-bots at Six Flags too. But, I've never purchased one because I have major issues with them. Plus, I do enough research to be able to ride all the coasters at GAdv at least twice on a Saturday in the middle of the summer. I'm a firm believer that the Six Flags and Universal systems have a completely different purpose. That's why I don't support them. While their two systems clearly are all about making money, Disney's is all about enhancing the guest experience (which they realize equates to making more money in the long run). Six Flags and Universal would rather take the "quick" and "easy" way out rather than come up with a creative solution that benefits everyone. That's why I refuse to give them any of my money by supporting such systems.
However, I'll gladly fork over money for Cedar Point's VIP program because, again, its more about the guest experience than making money. They've already maximized the guest experience for everyone by offering the most rides, the highest capacity, and an overall great park. They realized a small portion of their guests wanted a unique experience, so that's the reason behind the VIP experience. They advertise this on their website, but by no means market it like Six Flags is doing. Again, its easy to see the underlying goal of these two chains. For me, I'll give more money to the one I feel better represents my own ideals. *** Edited 3/17/2007 2:45:25 AM UTC by halltd***
Since even "old" stuff benefits from (or suffers from) *evolution*....front row costs extra...LOL! :)
Arthur Bahl
dannerman said:
Some places do charge extra for reservations. To me, it's the same
I wasn't talking about fancy restaurants where you tip the Maitre D, I'm talking about your garden-variety Outback/Red Lobster/Bahama Breeze/Carabbas/Longhorn.
What about places that don't charge for reservations? It's the same as those parks that don't charge for the fastpass.
We're not talking about Disney. We're talking about Six Flags- a company that charges for virtual queing.
This whole thread seems like a big b****fest from people who are jealous because they either can't/don't-want-to participate and spend the money, but as a result it may negatively affect them (which from my experience at parks like Dorney and CP, you won't notice it much, if at all.
I take offense to that. This isn't a b*tch-fest, it's people having a legitimate beef with a system that, in their eyes, is unfair. Not all people with genuine complaints are crybabies, you know?
I'm not trying to brag but I have enough money to pay for virtual queing. As I've said hundreds of times before, I don't approach a day at an amusement park with a budget in mind- I spend what I have to in order to completely enjoy the day. That said, there are some things- line jumping, for one- that I refuse to pay for. There are some things I do because of principle. I refuse to shop at Wal-Mart because of principle.
And that's what this comes down to. Principle. A ride, operated efficiently, has a set capacity. Parks like Disney claim that lines are reduced because of systems like FastPass but it's all smoke-and-mirrors. There is no way that even a company like Disney that has operations down to a science can turn sh*t into gold... water into wine... a 1000pph ride into a 1500pph ride. By providing people a way to line jump (no matter how "legal" it is), they are reducing the capacity of a ride by allowing some to ride without waiting as long as others. Take four seats out of a 32-passenger train and you may not notice that much more of a difference, but for every 9 trains that leave the station, that means a whole trainload of riders who waited missed out, adding a few more minutes to their wait. Maybe it sounds trivial, but the fact of the matter is what I have been saying all along. IT'S NOT FAIR. It's not fair that companies like Six Flags and Universal get rich not by incurring an additional expense when offering people upgraded packages, but rather take something away from other paying guests. And no matter how you choose to spin that, no matter how insignificant those extra ways may be, you can't get around the plain and simple truth in the preceding sentence.
At *those noted SF parks (they know who they are, LOL) I've seen WAY too many rides often aren't staffed well enough for NORMAL operations, merge points are generally poorly done, and multiple queues for VQing (exit ramps for FPs, etc.) *help* to cause capacity to generally "nosedive". Other than handicapped people (for instance, unable to get thru the queue, navigate stairs, etc.) exit ramps should be used for EXITING. They're too narrow as is, and having hordes of people waiting around the exit delays the next cycle significantly.
All views expressed are those of the poster and are not necessarily endorsed by anyone of note... ;)
*** Edited 3/18/2007 5:37:56 AM UTC by rollergator***
In the case of CP, the right time to have introduced a pay queue system was when they cut the admission price a year or so ago. That way, those who did not use the system would not feel ripped off because in return for slightly longer waits, they would be paying less. The ones using the system would be paying slightly more than before but would be free to do something else while waiting for MF or TTD.
Will CP do this? I don't know. All that I do know is that Cedar Fair is NOT Six Flags and seems to be more committed to making sure their guests get good value. Also, Six Flags Qbot prices are so high!. DW shiws that it doesn't have to be like that.
Arthur Bahl
I'll agree that it's not implemented as well in Six Flags parks as in others, but that's not the overall issue here.
Oh, and as bad as Six Flags may be in capacity, I think it's just blatant mismanagement from a corporate level, not a plot to force you to pay for QBot. Here's why:
- Since Shapiro has taken over, I've noticed lines/capacity get better at the Six Flags parks I've been to: SFGAdv and SFMM (I've also been to SFKK, SFA, and SFNE, but I never visited under the Burke regime to have a reference.. but those parks didn't seem that bad)
- I've seen signs at GAdv even under the Burke regime stating that the park isn't that busy so QBots would not be sold, and then proceeded to wait 30-40 minutes for some coasters running 1 train. (If they were forcing you to buy Qbot, they would have had them for sale. The fact they weren't with 40 minute waits leave me to believe they were just incompetent)
- When parks are "understaffed" sometimes it's because they weren't allowed to be staffed properly. I know that sounds crazy, but if you need 6 people to run efficiently, but minimum operations are 3, and corporate only gives you enough money for 4 workers, the guests suffer. They don't make the decision in corporate to remove a train, but sometimes it has to be done in order to keep the ride running because of lack of staffing.
Rob Ascough said:Maybe it's just my aversion to this whole "privilege" thing, which is getting way out of hand. Some people can board airplanes before others. Some people don't have to wait in line at the rental car counter. Some people can check into hotels without waiting. Some people can ride roller coasters by bypassing everyone and being seated in the next available seat. It's ridiculous. What happened to everyone being on the same level- no resentment because everyone had to wait in the same line for the same level of service? I'm all for capitalism but the fact that people with more money, more airline miles or more hotel points can do things quicker and better than other paying customers is getting to the point where it's beyond absurd.
Money is a reward for working hard and earning these sorts of privledges. Someone paid that cost, whether its the man who made an invention or maybe his father who worked his butt off rewarding his son.
Charles Nungester said:
On the contrary, I feel Im not missing a thing being treated VERY WELL by several parks that aren't trying to pad their stockholders pockets by creating such amenities to begin with and being treated the same as everyone else at them for a far reduced price.And when and if I visit such parks, It's on my terms, Not theirs.
Isn't the goal of business to pad stockholders pockets? I mean considering they gave capital initially shouldn't they be rewarded? God forbid people make money...
We still live in a world that offers choices and a multitude of options. I swear, enthusiasts get so pigeon holed into a couple of cliches, and so much over thinking, that an outsider must think this is the most non-progressive, boring hobby ever.
Six Flags is never going to do anything right for some of you, especially as they come up with aggressive, anti-mom and pop ways of attempting to climb out of the hole. Let's see you do a better job.
If the park is running less than capacity. It might as well be a gun to your head to get what you want out of the park. YOU WANNA ENJOY OUR PARK???????? FORK OVER ANOTHER $50 bucks. THE POP is the walk or stand around price.
:)
Chuck
YMMV, but so what? There are *millions* of people who share *completely* different values than you.
You must be logged in to post
