Shanghai Disneyland will close in effort to contain coronavirus

My son is in his high school senior year and has selected a college (FSU). Covid did not play into his decision making. It did change the experience (and likely saved me some money) as we did not take any out of state college trips. In fact, the beginning of the pandemic canceled the one trip we were going to take.

My son is going to get the vaccine so whether or not a campus has a vaccine policy is really irrelevant to him. I guess that is how I feel about this whole conversation about a vaccine passport. I consider this whole situation like smoking. If you have access to the vaccine (which most Americans will have) and you choose not to take it...then you deal with the repercussions. Maybe you get lucky. Maybe you get sick.

I think the Governor's who are passing anti-vaccine passport laws are overstepping their legal authority, at least in terms of private business. If Disney wants to require a vaccine card to allow someone into the parks I don't think the State of Florida should be able to stop that. Same with cruise ships or any other private business. If challenged I suspect those laws will be overturned.

https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2021/01/28/960901166/how-...your-state

I've shared that link before. I've been keeping an eye on the numbers.

As of yesterday, 20% of the population has been fully vaccinated. If you cut it off to 18 and older we're just over 25%. Those numbers have continued climbing at a decent clip daily...so far.

The projections put the country at 50% by mid-June with the best state (New York) hitting 50% by mid-May and the worst state (Alabama) getting there mid-August.

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As far as vaccine cards?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/1-5-10X-Vaccination-card-protective-Sleeve...3334781547

If I put it on a lanyard does that grant me front of the line access to the gravy buffet followed by dry humping ERT?

Only if you have your CoasterBuzz Club membership card, too.

I was a little worried about seeing this as they opened up eligibility, and here it is, predictably in "red states." Supply is beating demand significantly in some places despite low percentages of vaccination. Because freedom or some such ****.

1. It wasn't about the lanyard as much as it was the ability to already buy blank cards on ebay. (and other sites)

2. I wish people refusing the vaccine pissed me off more than it does...because it doesn't. Everyone has the right to suck and die. Feel free to excercise that right.

3. Canada on track to surpass U.S. in number of new COVID cases relative to population

wahoo skipper said:

I think the Governor's who are passing anti-vaccine passport laws are overstepping their legal authority, at least in terms of private business. If Disney wants to require a vaccine card to allow someone into the parks I don't think the State of Florida should be able to stop that. Same with cruise ships or any other private business. If challenged I suspect those laws will be overturned.

States not sure, however one could argue that a vaccine passport inhibits interstate commerce which federally is forbidden on numerous levels. If one argues that laws against passports protect free interstate commerce then they should be green lit across the board.

Of course YMMV, Disney World is certainly a destination resort, and thus a good portion of their business involves interstate commerce. Whereas Joe Blow's Tire Repair is probably a local joint and isn't as involved, unless they repairs someone's tire who is traveling out of state. So the whole interstate commerce thing can be very broadly applied.

How is that any different than a state not having a mask mandate, but yet businesses in that state, Disney as an example, require masks to be worn while in the park?

I guess one involves a medical procedure and the other doesn't? Putting a piece of cloth over your face is very different then putting a chemical mix developed in a year without long term testing into your body.

I fully support those who get vaccinated, and I also fully support those who are concerned and want to wait to make sure some major complication doesn't occur. How many OTC and prescription meds have been nixed or recalled because years down the road they found out that other bad things were happening?

To be fair, chances of complications are probably very low, but on the other side of the slider, we cannot predict long term until it is in use for long term. So I guess to each their own?

Lord Gonchar said:

2. I wish people refusing the vaccine pissed me off more than it does...because it doesn't. Everyone has the right to suck and die. Feel free to excercise that right.

I guess as long as the vaccine protects me from the non-vaccinated masses then I agree with you on some level. My fear is that the vaccine continues to swirl around the masses and it mutates into something which gets around my vaccine.

Lord Gonchar said:

Everyone has the right to suck and die. Feel free to excercise that right.

But in this case those people are endangering others. Sort of like drunk driving, right? I honestly couldn't care less if someone wanted to drive drunk, providing they were only endangering themselves. Of course that's not how it, or being anti-vax in this case, works.

Sort of. It feels more indirect than drunk driving to me. Far enough removed that it doesn't feel quite the same, at least.

Also, I can be vaccinated and, in turn, protected from their stupidity. That doesn't necessarily exist in a drunk driving situation. Because if there were specific roads for drunk drivers, I'd be cool with that too.

We touched on it somewhere along the way in this thread, but every action everyone takes likely affects someone else in some capacity - some are direct (I shoot you, you die), some are so indirect that they're immeasureable (My wife impatiently texts me that I'm late for an important dinner, I cut you off in traffic trying to make better time, you get pissed, start driving aggressively yourself, end up in an accident and kill someone in another vehicle).

I dunno. Wherever that line is, the risk imposed by someone not getting a COVID shot is under it for me...and I say that as someone who has gotten vaccinated, and encourages everyone to do the same. I also lick dumpsters.

Initially I was in the “I’m vaccinated; you can choose to suck and die” but it sure would be nice if variants weren’t a thing and specifically if I can avoid getting a regular booster for the variants currently mutating in the unvaccinated population. Or get infected by them. And there is also some non-zero population who can’t get the vaccine. I understand the hesitancy, but I can’t help but think some significant part of it is politics, conspiracy theories, and not at all real science.

TheMillenniumRider said:
I fully support those who get vaccinated, and I also fully support those who are concerned and want to wait to make sure some major complication doesn't occur.

Then they can choose to visit businesses that do not require they be vaccinated. It's a choice.

TheMillenniumRider said:
How many OTC and prescription meds have been nixed or recalled because years down the road they found out that other bad things were happening?

OTC drugs are not regulated in the same manner as vaccines and prescription medicines are not vaccines.

It's not as simple as "you can suck and die," for the same reason it wasn't OK to blow off mitigation protocols. We're going to be getting boosters for the rest of our lives when we actually have the technology to beat this, and it's stupid to endure that because some people are selfish.

The fake flag-waving freedom fighters are the same people who say, "Freedom isn't free," and insist that patriotism is mostly your willingness to pick up a gun and fight overseas, that now can't do the simple basic things to respect their own communities by getting vaccinated and wearing masks. Funny how they're less motivated when you're at war with a deadly pathogen and not brown people on the other side of the world who will not in fact ever have the opportunity to harm you.

Jeff said:

We're going to be getting boosters for the rest of our lives when we actually have the technology to beat this, and it's stupid to endure that because some people are selfish.

I guess the silver lining is that eventually the non-vaxxers will die out while (hopefully) the boosters will keep us safe.

That would take generations. Even with polio it took a hundred years, and that's still hanging out in a few places.

Lord Gonchar said:

Also, I can be vaccinated and, in turn, protected from their stupidity. That doesn't necessarily exist in a drunk driving situation. Because if there were specific roads for drunk drivers, I'd be cool with that too.

...

I dunno. Wherever that line is, the risk imposed by someone not getting a COVID shot is under it for me...and I say that as someone who has gotten vaccinated, and encourages everyone to do the same. I also lick dumpsters.

There are, of course, some folks who can't be vaccinated because of allergies or other health reasons, and anti-vaxxers are endangering them / forcing them to stay in quarantine conditions. Cuz not everybody can lick dumpsters.

I'm not sure whether it's the stupidity / bad-faith fearmongering that pisses me off, the public health ramifications, or the freeloading: "you all get vaccinated and (possibly, not likely) endanger yourselves, and I'll just ride on your herd immunity over here."

And more importantly in my opinion, my (and many others) kids cannot get vaccinated in the near future. And critically, not before kids should be back to in school this fall.

Anti-vaxxers are endangering these kids pretty directly, via exposure and mutation opportunities. Telling them "it's on you" lets them off the hook for their behavior.

Thinking the virus was going to go away is the first mistake. So far we've eliminated a grand total of two infectious diseases in the history of mankind, science and modern medicine - smallpox and rinderpest. COVID isn't going anywhere. It never was.

Here's an article about the Spanish Flu and the 1918 pandemic. It says in part:

Over time, those who contracted the virus developed an immunity to the novel strand of influenza, and life returned to normal by the early 1920s, according to historians and medical experts. Reports at the time suggest the virus became less lethal as the pandemic carried on in waves.

But the strand of the flu didn’t just disappear. The influenza virus continuously mutated, passing through humans, pigs and other mammals. The pandemic-level virus morphed into just another seasonal flu. Descendants of the 1918 H1N1 virus make up the influenza viruses we’re fighting today.

“The 1918 flu is still with us, in that sense,” said Ann Reid, the executive director of the National Center for Science Education who successfully sequenced the genetic makeup of the 1918 influenza virus in the 1990s. “It never went away.”

Why would COVID be any different?

I've read a lot about how this is likely the 5th coronavirus that will be a part of our lives and will eventually become endemic, like they all do.

Here's one such example, that reads near the middle:

This is one scenario that scientists foresee for SARS-CoV-2. The virus sticks around, but once people develop some immunity to it — either through natural infection or vaccination — they won’t come down with severe symptoms. The virus would become a foe first encountered in early childhood, when it typically causes mild infection or none at all, says Jennie Lavine, an infectious-disease researcher at Emory University in Atlanta, Georgia.

Scientists consider this possible because that’s how the four endemic coronaviruses, called OC43, 229E, NL63 and HKU1, behave. At least three of these viruses have probably been circulating in human populations for hundreds of years; two of them are responsible for roughly 15% of respiratory infections. Using data from previous studies, Lavine and her colleagues developed a model that shows how most children first come down with these viruses before the age of 6 and develop immunity to them1. That defence wanes pretty quickly so it is not sufficient to block reinfection entirely, but it seems to protect adults from getting sick, says Lavine. Even in children, the first infection is relatively mild.

So yeah, I totally buy it.

If you thought this would go away. You were wrong. If you think the threat will remain as it was in 2020, you're still wrong.

Do you guys get flu shots every year? Then guess what? Nothing will change except what's in it - which will also include protection against COVID-19 (and variants, presumably). And the risk will continue to be what it always has been prior to COVID-19.

We're just lucky enough to have been here for the debut of something new - which is gonna hit hard initially and then settle in with time. That's what happens.

eightdotthree said:

OTC drugs are not regulated in the same manner as vaccines and prescription medicines are not vaccines.

Truth, however this vaccine is still labeled experimental and was fasttracked to get it into people. So the process here is most certainly a bit different. Typically vaccines are put under more scrutiny than other medications, however that may not be fully what happened here.

ApolloAndy said:

Initially I was in the “I’m vaccinated; you can choose to suck and die” but it sure would be nice if variants weren’t a thing and specifically if I can avoid getting a regular booster for the variants currently mutating in the unvaccinated population.

Current vaccines are expected to have 6-8+ months of immunity, they don't know for sure yet until that time period passes. I have seen many an article that you will be getting boosters similar to a flu shot to continue immunities. Regardless of the variants and the unvaccinated population there is a good chance you will still be getting a booster.

Little sidethought, boosters are great for the bottom line of those drug companies, its like a yearly subscription for the population. Wonder if they could develop something longer term, but maybe the financial incentive is better for them to go for the short term + boosters.