Knoebels announces they are working on a classic!

8.3- Nice to see eye-to-eye for once!

It is hilarious but that's Nate- for some reason he does that to everything I say. Remember the topic about the reprofiling of The Great Escape Comet?

As far as this project goes, I don't understand much of the skepticism. If anything, Knoebels has proven themselves to be experts at making things work. They built their own haunted house- a darkride rated by many as #1 in the country. They relocated a wood coaster when people said it couldn't be done. They operate a fleet of classic rides- many of which are close to being extinct. And they built their own wood coaster at a time when most theme parks struggle to operate ones that other companies built.

If this were any other park, I would be a little hesitant to get excited. But considering how Knoebels has a history of exceeding expectations, I don't see any reason to doubt this is going to turn out exactly as they want. Which is usually just how everyone wants!

OK, I've read it and generally agree but there are times where not complaining, But questioning a parks decision is called for.

I still don't get putting a 600pph ride in a major park, Building 25 million dollar coasters that never run and not having all the rides that can possibly be running, Running at a park and of course allowing employees to be rude.

Other than that, Im happy for parks adding and improving the expereience. As I said earlier, To me, Knoebels really don't NEED anything, Everything they do from here on out is a BONUS and giving people a ONE OF A KIND expereience is something to be PRAISED to me.

A original wooden style flying turns! Like others have said, About the only things that they haven't done with wood and might do in the future is a Wooden Mouse (From which I hear is absolutely fantastic in Europe)and a Virginia Reel.

Go Knoebels!

I personally feel sorry for anyone who goes to a park like Knoebels and can't have fun. Thats what I DON'T get but granted, Ive never done the pay per ride plan there.

Chuck

It amazes me that when innovation means going from Xcelerator to TTD, people immediately get excited, but when innovation is taking a defunct type of ride and bringing it back for people to enjoy, people always focus on the negative.

You're right Chuck- this is a bonus from Knoebels. They could never do anything ever again and I would go back a few times a year, but since they are committed to continually improving the experience, it makes those visits all the more satisfying. Congrats to the park for pushing the envelope in the most unlikely of ways!

First, if someone's going to make comments about enthusiasts drooling over a kiddie coaster, their comment would be more effective if they didn't have "Woodstock's Express" listed in their coaster count.

Nate, you keep asking why Knoebels is building a wooden flying turns instead of buying a steel bobsled ride, and why that's a good business decision. A number of people have given you a number of reasons-- price, the fact they can do it in house, the idea of bringing back a historical ride and doing it better than the companies doing steel bobsled rides among others, but you keep insisting that nobody has answered your question.

Stop crying about "discussing the issue." You offered your opinions and other people offered theirs. If theirs happens to be ooh and aah, what's that to you? You said it's a bad business decision, other people said they thought it was a good decision. So why are you all bent out of shape? You really haven't contributed anything to the discussion except to say "it's a bad business decision." Maybe you should define or explain why you think it's a bad business decision. What makes it bad?

You tell me to read your post before I hit reply, how about extending me the same courtesy? When talking about 1920's era rides, you totally ignored my reference to Twister. That was inspired by a 1927 (I believe) coaster, yet it certainly uses modern technology and construction methods. It's not an exact replication of a coaster exactly as it was done in the 20's. What about the HP Wildcat? That was based on, although not an exact replica, of the Wildcats from the 20's.

Duh, I know that Jack Rabbit and Racer use updated technology (although the rabbit still uses classic cars and lapbars)-- you're the one who seems to think that Knoebel's will build the Turns using nothing invented after 1930. Didn't anybody mention that in order to get on the ride, you'll have to show your ticket from the trolley? And I'll let you in on a little secret-- in the past 75 years, they've learned to do different things with wood.

Your other argument is that the ride would be so watered down to make it totally boring. Who says? Again, I'll use the example of Twister. People might love or hate the ride, but boring is one adjective that is hardly ever used to describe it.

You're saying bobsled-type coasters went extinct for a good reason. What reason is that? Of the 5 listed on RCDB, 3 operated until the day the parks they were in closed. A fourth, the one at Steeplechase was damaged by fire in 1939 and never rebuilt. Economics probably had a lot to do with that.

Today, everyone and everything is into retro, nostalgia, and bringing back classics. That goes for architecture, decorating, furniture, clothing, and yes even amusement park rides. In that way, I think it's a solid business decision for Knoebels to play up its nostalgic role in the industry. For them, it's not a trend, it's their way of doing business. I think this will definitely pay off for them. If you disagree, good for you.

Nice post, Bear. But Mr. Twister (the ride the Knoebels Twisteris based on) opened in 1965, not the 1920s.

But I think you still made your point :)

This is great news to me. I am really excited and will make SURE to get out to this park asap if they build this! If I built my own park I would love to have it full of old defunct or rare rides. I think it would make it a unique park. But then again I am obsessed with the older rides right now.

New ones are cool but old ones are "new to me" and I like that feeling. Side friction coasters with no restraints that actually come airborne, Oh yeah, a lot more fun to me then a 400 ft launched ride in OSTR's. The jack rabbit when it had the leather strap was my absolute favorite coaster. I was SCARED on that one that I was really going to come out! :)

Very well put, RGB.

A few people on this site constantly assert that nostalgia is not a business plan but that's a load of b.s. Nostalgia has proven itself to be an excellent business plan over and over again.

Ask Ford, whose retro-styled Mustang is the most critically acclaimed Mustang ever and sold through its 2005 model year production before the beginning of the summer. The factory is still trying (and failing) to meet demand.

Ask baseball team owners who are designing their new stadiums to resemble stadiums of eras gone by instead of the bland, symmetrical structures that have been regarded as "cutting edge" for years.

Ask the owners of bed & breakfasts in Cape May, NJ who fetch hundreds of dollars a night for rooms that treat people to the same experience that vacationers were treated to at the beginning of the 20th century. Good luck getting a room in one of those places.

Notalgic things tug at the hearts of people who are old enough to remember growing up with those things. More often than not, those are people with loads of disposable income. As for everyone else, those people will gravitate to what they like. Know what the most popular non-coaster ride was at Knoebels on rainy PPP weekend? The Looper- that came from Dick himself. Apparantly, the teenagers that flocked to it didn't know that the "new" ride was older than many of their parents, they just cared that it was a good ride.

Wow! This turned into quite a thread since I dropped in this morning. I see the coasterbuzz vampires have dropped by to suck the lifeblood out of their latest victims. . .

A spirited discussion, to say the least.

And an informative one.

What's this "little club" that keeps getting referenced?

Would that be the newly formed Wood Coaster Club of a few years' back? BTW, how's that doing?

BJW

Yeah, Nate refers to the WCFC as the "little club" in his feeble attempt to downplay the opinions of anyone who finds wood coasters to be worthwhile.

The club is doing just fine, more than one hundred members strong. The forums on the site are pretty active and worth checking out if you have a few free moments. Nate reads them religiously (I know this) despite the fact that we are just a little club.

well there's this: http://woodencoasterclub.tripod.com/

But they don't seem to do anything. The 2003 season of Six Flags New Orleans is featured for cripes sake!

And then there is the Wood Coaster Fan Club formed in 2004: www.woodcoaster.org
It's healthy but could stand to have some more participation from the membership :)

Rob:

Thanks for the update.

I've been wanting to join that club for a long time. Are there any special events held? I thought I heard that there was some AWESOME ERT at the spring event one year which was held at. . .Knoebel's, if memory serves?

What's coming up?

BJW

We held an event at Knoebels on opening weekend this year, although it wasn't limited to WCFC members- all enthusiasts were allowed to attend without having to pay any additional money. There was an hour of ERT on Phoenix and Twister following the close of the park on Saturday.

The 2006 plans are far from finalized but you might look to expect something at one or two parks adding wood coasters. We're also discussing the idea of another Knoebels opening weekend event.

I am definitely planning on attending that Opening Weekend deal @ Knoebel's. I heard nothing but great things from everybody who attended.

Of course, the Wood Coaster Club would be perfectly named, and positioned, to sponsor an event at that oft-discussed gem of a park in Southern Indiana when the seldom-discussed (yeah, right!) VOYAGE opens next Spring. . .

Membership would probably take flight along with the first drop. . .

BJW

Is the WCC that Millrace links to in his post a different one than the current incarnation?

We're talking about two separate and distinct entities, right?

BJW

Yeah, there is (was?) something called the wood coaster club (run by John Allen! ;) ) but there doesn't seem to be much going on with them aside from an outdated webpage.

Wood Coaster Fan Club is a different (and less lethargic) animal!

Right, the WCC is John Allen's club (I'm not kidding)- it has a lot of support but they have yet to implement many of their plans. I'm not sure what's going on with the club, you'd probably have to ask him yourself. The WCFC has members, a website, forums, a small clothing line and a quarterly publication. The WCFC has John Allen as one if it's members (the WCC's John Allen, that is.)

Right now I can't release any details on any potential event locations but you probably won't have to think too long about what those locations could be ;)

For some reason, this doesn't surprise me. Only Knoebel's would do something this awesome. Lets look at an updated check list here...

Flying Turns: looking good, check!
Idora Wildcat remake: Sigh, I can dream can't I?
Mountain woodie: Same as above.

1 out of 3 isn't that bad, I'll take it.

Yes, Millrace, I went to your link and it does seem kind of sad to see MegaZeph's picture there as their header.

I think it high time they do a content update. I was always very fond of MegaZeph and am certain that I won't be riding that again. . .

My biggest complaint about SFNO were the bugs and the heat. . .I simply could not imagine being in that park in the middle of August. . .

BJW

I could have sworn I read something somewhere saying that Twister was based on an even older ride than Mr. Twister. Oh well, my mistake. I guess all I can do is delete everything I ever posted here, since none of my points are valid. Yeah, watch me.

The nostalgia angle can't be underestimated. Not everybody riding the Looper or any other ride at PPP was a teenager. And I saw quite a few that are older than I am. When I was a teenager, it was practically unheard of for people in their 40s or older to ride coasters or other thrill rides. Even though few people have ridden Flying Turns, most of us are curious about it. I think this ride will capture the attention of those into tradition and nostalgia, as well as those who are into something new. This ride will be both for many of us.

RGB, Twister was designed from the blueprints of Mr. Twister that was located at the old Elitch Gardens in Denver. What Knoebels basicly did is take the original measurements, angles, etc and mirrored certain areas and came up with what you see at Knoebels in order to fit the land area. Some parts were changed but they tried to keep it as close to the original as possible.

The two look nothing alike but certain parts still are basicly identical but only mirrored. If that makes any sense.

Mr. Twisters Swoop

Twisters Swoop