getting tired of line jumpers

Thursday, July 3, 2008 5:59 PM
Personally, I would like to see something done about strictly enforcing the rule prohibiting line jumping in ride queue lines.
I visited Cedar Point this past Sunday, and I witnessed people line jumping in Millennium Force, Top Thrill Dragster, Wicked Twister, and Power Tower. I live three hours from CP and I am a CF platinum passholder, so you can imagine my frustration.
I have also been to Kings Island six times this year, and every time I have been there, I witness people line jumping in Delirium. It happens less often in Drop Tower, Firehawk and Invertigo, but it still happens. I cannot exactly point to people and say they were line jumping because I have no proof if the ride operator did not see it, and I don't want to risk making these line jumpers angry by saying something, so they end up getting away with it.
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Thursday, July 3, 2008 7:35 PM
Getting tired of it?

Most around here have been tired of it for years.

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Thursday, July 3, 2008 8:05 PM
I think that the idea that line jumping is a taboo is a thing of the past. Several years ago many parks just gave in and made it a perk. Cutting is not viewed the same way as it used to be.

Are line jumpers stealing from the guest in line behind them, from the park because they didn't pay for it, or both?

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Thursday, July 3, 2008 8:58 PM
I doubt that most parks have made it a perk. I saw people get kicked out of Kings Island for line jumping this year. It's the principle of the thing. Nobody has patience or respect anymore. For example: the people that were a few feet in front of me are suddenly almost at the front of the line, because they duck under the rails as the line is moving. If being impatient, rude and disrespectful enough to shove others out of the way to get on a ride is now considered a perk, then the parks should remove the line jumping policy from their websites and the signs from the ride queues. Everyone is too lenient with disobedient kids these days. The line needs to be drawn somewhere.
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Thursday, July 3, 2008 9:38 PM
Not necessarily line jumping, but a friend and I were at Canada's Wonderland over the weekend and the crews were extremely stern about having everyone get off railings and the no smoking in line policy. I'm sure if someone were to be line jumping, they'd be strict about that one, too.
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Thursday, July 3, 2008 10:21 PM
RE: made it a perk.

I assume you are talking about Fast Pass, Qbots, etc. Sorry, but these are different than true line jumping. Fast Pass, Qbots, etc are with in the rules of the parks that offer them.

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Thursday, July 3, 2008 11:09 PM
Magic Mountain hands out boarding passes as you get into the queue for X2 and Tatsu. I don't know how long they've been doing this, but they were last week (and they weren't three years ago on my previous trip). They collect them just before you enter the boarding station. Since they have attendants lined up at both points anyway (for FlashPass on Tatsu and to regulate the line split at X2), it's not a major cost outlay beyond printing the boarding passes.

The numbers on the passes are supposed to line up, to catch line jumping. Even if the attendants aren't diligently tracking the serial numbers on the passes, it seems to be an effective deterrent.

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Thursday, July 3, 2008 11:21 PM
Exactly what I am talking about. With Q-Bot and other pay-to-cut schemes, you are allowed to stand in two or more lines at a time, essentially getting more than one ride in the amount of time it takes to wait in one line. This would be just like if little Johnny's Mom stood in line for Superman while he rode Batman and then got in line with her just before she boarded the ride. The parks offer line jumping as a perk.

...And possibly we have come to a point where people do not view cutting in front of people as a serious offense. The park allows line jumping for those who decide to pay for it, yet post rules against it. It's a double standard that has degraded the seriousness of the issue.

People have cut in front of others ever since I can remember. I think that now, it's just not viewed as being as wrong as it used to. I blame pay-to-cut schemes.

We've argued over the last 5 years whether pay-to-cut is wrong or right. I wonder if we could debate about what the long term effect are/will be for such a "system".

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Thursday, July 3, 2008 11:27 PM
But in essence Fast Pass is a form of cutting, you just pay for it. And I don't believe the business about "holding your place in line". At SFOT the qbot time for Superman was about 25-30 minutes while the poor folks in the real line were waiting close to 2 hours. We did qbot on that busy, busy day and were glad for it, but I felt weird when I saw the reactions of the other people in line when they saw people going ahead of them. They were shouting at us, a fight almost broke out and the poor ride ops were so over it. The same thing happened at EPCOT's Soarin. So John Q and his family might opt out of, or can't afford the system, and it reinforces or even promotes the bad behavior of line jumping.

I was really glad when CP got rid of theirs. IMO if they wait, I wait, we all wait.

I've seen line jumping enforcement at it's best, and it was at CP. A guy and his girlfriend were making their way past everybody in line for Millenium Force, with him acting all polite and mumbling something about a wristwatch left behind up there. (?!) So a few in the line objected and soon everybody got in it, started making noise and pointed the guy out to the ops at the unload station. By the time they got to the load area the ops were waiting for him and CP police were not far behind. They were escorted away amidst cheers from the crowd. I bet that gal was proud of her class-act date .

The worst all out blatant line jumping I ever saw was at Darien just this spring. Absolutely outragious, and not one person doing anything about it.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 12:14 AM
Has anyone refused to go to an amusement park because of line cutting? I think the industry is less concerned about the behavior of guests than their money.
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Friday, July 4, 2008 12:40 AM

mulfdog said:
Has anyone refused to go to an amusement park because of line cutting? I think the industry is less concerned about the behavior of guests than their money.

I don't know if line cutting has ever caused someone to avoid a park, but it DOES hurt the park in many different ways.

1. If hundreds of people see a group cut in line, it diminishes the experience for those who feel cheated.

2. If it goes unpoliced, it encourages more people to do so, including perhaps those who wouldn't normally do so, virally spreading the ill will of park guests.

3. Those who cut in line are typically those who know the queues well (i.e. - locals). Locals spend less at a park than out-of-towners, and I would argue that those who cut lines are those who contribute less per capita than even their fellow locals.

4. In sum, the cutters are the least valuable financial contributors, yet they are eating away at the satisfaction of those who don't flinch at the overpriced soft drinks, on-board photographs, or king's ransom funnel cakes.

5. The problem grows even worse for parks that sell FlashPass, Universal Express, etc., because it dissuades line reservation system sales if folks see people getting away with it for free.

6. Line cutting makes honest guests spend more time in line, and less walking around where they are exposed to food concessions, pay games, shops, etc. The reason why Disney doesn't charge for FastPass, is because it realizes that guests are more lucrative when they are out of long lines.

In the end, line cutting, unchecked, is a bottom-line killer. I challenge anyone to suggest otherwise.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 1:32 AM
muffdog:

I've decided to stop going to SFA because of how disrespectful the park-goers are.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 2:09 AM

RCMAC said:
But in essence Fast Pass is a form of cutting, you just pay for it.

Which Epcot did you go to? Last time I checked (today) FastPass was still free to all guests. Just because you're not smart enough to get a FastPass doesn't mean its a bad thing. Virtual queuing is a brilliant concept when properly executed.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 3:37 AM

ErinGoBraugh said:
muffdog:

I've decided to stop going to SFA because of how disrespectful the park-goers are.


I think something like this is a real concern in the new direction that Six Flags is going in. I don't have a family, but if I had small kids with me I'd probably be more cautious about confronting line jumpers, and just wouldn't return to that park. But if I'm at a park with friends have no problem confronting them. (Usually the f-bomb and chest puffing follows but they eventually piss off..) In the last few years line jumping seems to be more common than before. Not just with kids but with grown adults that think it's perfectly fine to squeeze past hundreds of people to meet up with someone in already line probably due to the increase in cell phones.

People in general are just much less courteous than they used to be so this isn't just a park issue. The movie industry tries to blame piracy for the decline in ticket sales, but I'm convinced it's the decline of behaviour and courtesy in theatres. I used to love going to see big movies on opening night. Now I won't go near a theatre on the weekend unless it's something arty or it's been playing for a month. Otherwise there's a damn good chance that someone around me is going to be talking through most of the movie. I don't want to pay $15 to be irritated by someone talking on the phone, or have to tell them to hang up 3 times.

But back on topic it's interesting looking back to this being a part of the problem that created the original "theme park" concept. My understanding (I wasn't around at the time) is that amusement parks in the 50s - 60s were generally considered more seedy, vandalized and very unfamily places that were overrun with kids. The basic root of Walt's plan for Disneyland was to create a place that was similar to an amusement park but that the whole family could enjoy and was comfortable and safe. Since the original Six Flags concept was pretty much lifted from Disneyland, someone might want to remind SFA of their in-name only corporate heritage roots..becuse they're going full circle now.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 9:04 AM

CPJ said:

Which Epcot did you go to?

Well, I was at the same Epcot everyone else goes to. In my post I mistakenly tried to use "fast pass" as a generic name for "virtual queue". My apologies.

Yes, FastPass is free to all Disney guests. And I don't know why every single person in line for Soarin that day didn't have one, except for maybe the return times were so far out there that it wasn't feasible (we waited quite a while to come back) , or maybe they already had one going and couldn't get a second one, or maybe FastPass at Soarin was done for the day (that happens), or maybe they just weren't smart enough. But I still felt bad when I saw all those grouchy standby people in that hallway glaring at us over the wall.

I should've left Disney out of my example. Sorry.


Oops I screwed up my quote. Sorry again. I'm going back to bed. *** Edited 7/4/2008 1:05:24 PM UTC by RCMAC***

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Friday, July 4, 2008 9:33 AM

RCMAC said:
IMO if they wait, I wait, we all wait.

Exactly. I try to convince myself as I'm fuming that they know what they did is wrong, and they will eventually get what is coming to them. I would rather do that than have the line jumper(s) start a fight with me because I said something to them. I'm not a fighter and I don't want to risk getting kicked out of the park because the ride op thinks I was fighting. It's not worth the risk, and it won't stop me from visiting amusement parks. I'm lucky enough to live an hour from KI and 3 hours from CP.
I agree with Paris completely, I could not have said it better myself.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 9:54 AM
I don't necessarily believe their are more line jumpers in todays society or that they are more aggressive, I think that other people are more passive. I remember in the late 80's at Cedar Point line jumpers were questioned and pointed out by the other guests in line. It was very difficult to cut in line because the line jumpers very visibly made a lot of people angry, and they created a disturbance that might get them kicked out of the park. Now somebody or a whole group of line jumpers can walk through line, and nobody questions them, they just let them through. My wife and I ask line jumpers where they are going, and tell them that they cannot line jump. Most times the line jumpers turn around and leave (more than likely to look for another line that is easier to cut). If they choose to continue to cut we shame them and let them be. There is no need for an altercation over a spot in line.

Now just imagine if more people simply gave line jumpers a hard time they would be less likely to jump in line. If all five feet flat of my petite wife can stop line jumping just think what would happen if more people cared enough to say something.

One more thing don't believe any excuses, most parks clearly define what line jumping is, and leaving line and returning to that same spot in line for any reason is line jumping in most parks. Their "friends" can cut back in line to rejoin their lost partner.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 10:10 AM

ErinGoBraugh said:
muffdog:

I've decided to stop going to SFA because of how disrespectful the park-goers are.


So is SFA responsible for the behavior of its guests?


Cropsey said:

Since the original Six Flags concept was pretty much lifted from Disneyland, someone might want to remind SFA of their in-name only corporate heritage roots..becuse they're going full circle now.


Are you saying that there isn't line jumping or problems at Disneyland? The worst line jumping I've ever seen was at Disneyland. Families and even employees not feeling the need to wait like everyone else.

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Friday, July 4, 2008 10:22 AM
Here's a thought if we want to curb line jumpers: Habe staff in plain cloths just stand in line as if they were patrons. The "normal guest would have no clue.
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Friday, July 4, 2008 1:58 PM
...and most of the teenagers I see line jumping would just ignore the plan clothes park people.
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