"Forceless" Beemers, and why we love 'em all

A good example of a 'forceful' Beemer is Nemesis, the inverted coaster based at Alton Towers in the UK. As well as being superbly themed it also packs a mean punch. If anything, the older it gets the more intense it becomes!

http://www.rcdb.com/ig776.htm

*** Edited 8/4/2005 2:25:23 PM UTC by aanatpel***

Wow, I never knew RCDB had so many pics of Nemesis.

Beemers I like:

SFOG Batman
Chang
Dueling Dragons(Both)
GA Scorcher
Incredible Hulk
SFOG Superman

Beemers I don't like:

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Well, 7 for 7. Yep, pretty good record there.

I think the vibration comes from crappy wheels and loose springs, not the steel.

Good point! But then why does Batman and Riddler run so well and Scream so poorly? Surely SFMM's maintenance crew should know how to properly care for the wheel assemblies on ALL their Beemers.

Are Keith and I the only ones who don't think Scream! is rough *at all*? I never once noticed any of the "shuffling" or whatever it is on our two rides. Now, we rode in the front row both times, so maybe that has something to do with it?

Scream! is actually my second fav coaster at SFMM now, right behind X and in front of Riddler. The ending was very, very good; better than Medusa!

Joe "I'm going going, back to back to Cali, Cali....in Oct" C.

Scream isn't rough...its just not the "B&M Smooth" we're all used to. It has that same annoying vibration as Dominator and BKF, among others, and yes...its not as bad in the front as in the rest of the train.

I didn't get the Scream shuffle in March. I thought Scream was much better than Riddlers. I'd say it was my 3rd fave at SFMM.

I also liked Dominator.

Its not so much a shuffle as it is a vibration. I have felt shuffle on Scream [Bass was there...he can vouch for it] but that's not what I'm talking about here.

You know, there's a princess-and-pea joke to make here, but I'm just not coming up with it. I leave you all with the seed of the idea in hopes it comes to something.

;)

When I rode Wildfire a couple of years ago, it had an odd vibration in the middle of the cobra roll, but no where else on the ride. Anyone else notice this?

As evidenced in my TR regarding SFMM in March, yes, there is a very noticable (at the time) vibration that Scream suffers from. It was much more apparent on Dominator at Geauga Lake in 2003. The vibrations were so much that if I were to go there at this moment, I'd have to have someone ride it first to warn me of potential jarring. Dominator actually made both Peabody and I sick. Sick. That's F'd up.

Fix them wheels, or fix something for God's sake.

See?!? I'm not the only princess who can't sleep! ;)

Yes, Nasai and I (plus Robo and a few others) just had a BRUTAL ride on Dominator in June 03. The last time I had ridden it, the previous year it was pretty much "B&M Smooth"

I noticed the vibration/rattle on the Dom back in May, but only towards the back of the train. It wasn't awful, but completely noticeable. I can't sleep either! ;-)

Katie

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Intamin pushes design much more then B&M, and that is why I respect them more.

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I'll say it again.. this makes no sense considering Intamin and B&M are not designing these coasters! They have a hand in the engineering, but the parks are giving guidelines on what type of ride to build and Werner Stengel is designing the course(=forces and everything). So the only company that you should be giving respect(or not giving) to is Ingenieurbuero Stengel GmbH because this is the main factor that is affecting whether or not you like a ride, not B&M or Intamin.

I actually don't like forceless B&M's and neither does the public. People looked absolutely bored and indifferent coming back into the station of Hyrda the Revenge. That's not the reaction you want for something you just shelled out millions for. Hydra also suffered from the vibration and roughness that others have mentioned. Someone mentioned to me that this was due to a mixture of wheels (as in type, not old/new) that were in use. I know during the ERT during the Coasterbuzz event at Dorney that there was a drastic difference between the level of intensity between Hydra and Talon. Thank goodness we started at Hydra and then moved to Talon.

As for the claim that someone had never seen a B&M down, well that's nice that you haven't, but I can think of five off-hand that have had problems the day/s I was at their respective park. Those were: Vortex and Top Gun at PCar; Medusa, Nitro, and Batman the Ride at Great Adventure. Most recently I was on Great Bear and it got shutdown for a good 15 minutes or more after we slammed into the brakes. To be fair though, I believe this was operator error.

There is a difference between being down Temp. during the day like all coasters do, and being down for, oh, I dunno, say a couple months, like Intamins do. Were those B&M coasters down the entire day you were there? Possibly, but were they down for a month? Having said that...

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But, how many times have you been to a park with these coasters and they be shut down for some reason for another.

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All coasters have problems. I've been in line for Top Gun at PCar more than once when it had to go down for a while. Thankfully, it came back up soon and I didn't miss out on a ride on my fav. invert.

I've only ever been to a park where an Intamin was down for a signifigant amount of time during my day. That was TTD. I will say that the Rockets are problematic for sure. But Intamin has more coasters than B&M under their belt, and even more that aren't listed on RCDB, as well as working on ones that weren't necessarily 'intamin' coasters. Plus they have a lot of other products that B&M do not, and while some of the newer ones have some issues, most notably the 'innovative' new ones, the Majority of Intamin coasters seem fine to me. When was the last time American Eagle went down for a long period of time? Colossus? Colossos? Disaster Transport?

Sure, Kingda, TTD, and Xcel are exceptions. I doubt the Disney issue recently was Intamin's fault, as evidince by them operating in Manual mode. And I can think of 2 issues on the hypers. Restraint design not withstanding, what Intamin Coasters have really been down a long time like those, other than S:TE? (and yes, I did call it a coaster).

Just curious - do people take reliability into account when rating a coaster....I mean, given that they got on?

Obviously a ride that has a 15 minute line will be a better experience overall than a ride that has a 4 hr. line, but does that affect how you judge a coaster once you're on?

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TeknoScorpion said:
Amen to the Vortex comment.

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I liked PCar's Vortex (decent forces, decent elements, a nice windy ending section) but they could do without the puke at the end. ;) :P

I am a B&M fan plain and simple. I don't really find any of them "forceless." The only B&M I can honestly said I didn't really like is Batman: The Dark Knight (and yes, I've ridden the Vortex rides and me lika the Mantis).

I went to Dorney the other day and rode Hydra ten times or so. I too noticed the vibration, which was worse in the back. Maybe some softer wheels would fix this problem. Overall it's not as good as Talon, but the ride is really fun. There were some nice forces in the first half of the ride and the drop surprised me with it's "out of the seat" effect. I did think the small hop before the final cork was kind of lame because it's so slow.

I am also a huge Nitro fan. This past week Gadv. was running the ride with the brakes on harder than last year which sucks. The didn't have the trim before the third hill on, but the one after it was on. Nitro is just pure fun and although not as wild as Superman or Steel Force, I can't complain about it at all.

As for the other Beemers, I love Talon, Carowinds' Top Gun, Kumba, Montu, Hulk, Dueling Dragons, Alpengeist, Silver Bullet, Raptor, Mantis, etc. etc.

Flatspins on the B&M's don't normally bother me, I usually get more jaw-knock in the cobra roll elements.

I also don't remember any B&M's that have been closed for any reason other than weather. *** Edited 8/6/2005 2:52:26 PM UTC by Willh51***

^^ SRoS SFNE had a nice collision that kept it closed for quite some time if you don't remember.

Not a coaster, but PP has had multiple chain brakes and has probably had more downtime than up.

Volcano was down until August of its opening year when it was supposed to open much, much earlier.

And where did you read that Disney was running the ride in manual mode (Screamin')? I didn't read that anywhere, can you cite your source?

LOL to you though, with all your "other than this coaster and that coaster and that ride" preface.... ;) You took all the easy ones away!

Joe "Intamin Reliability cheerleader" C.

EDIT: Tekno, B&M has *way* more coasters than Intamin does..if you look at recently constructed ones. No one cares about the bobsleds, not to mention Eagle isn't really Intamin, they were the ones who sold it.

I usually consider anything from Volcano (1998) onward to be "Intamins"...if that makes sense. *** Edited 8/6/2005 2:53:07 PM UTC by Legendary***