Flying Turns Update
The Mouse is now at 63. Busch is in line with that. Universal's 2-park one-day pass was listed on site at the park for....85 was it? But you all are on vacation in FL, so those proces may not be entirely relevant to the discussion. CF's season passes are probably more in line (although I still think the single-park passes are low in comparison to the all-park passes), but SF is still way too low...stupid-low.
Those "smaller" parks that are supposed to outstrip the prices of the bigger regionals....they're either going away, or they're growing so fast it's ridiculous. Took us almost an hour from the time we got in line to park at Covered Bridge last year to the time we actually walked into the park.
Those "smaller" regionals either grew up and got more bigger rides (i.e., HW, Silverwood, IB, etc.) or they went under (Williams Grove, CLP, etc.).Those "smaller" parks that are supposed to outstrip the prices of the bigger regionals....they're either going away, or they're growing so fast it's ridiculous.
Maybe.
But ignoring subjective things like quality of attractions, personal preferences and the like and sticking to just what's measurable on paper - those smaller parks have certainly grown, but they're nowhere near the overall size of, nor do they offer the sheer amount of attractions that the big regionals do.
Parks that can list 60 attractions, coaster counts in the double digits, acres upon acres of developed park space, more than you can do in a day - the whole spectacle. They're changing prices the in the same vicinity as parks that offer 1/2, 1/3 or even 1/4 of the experience on paper.
Yes, HW's, Knoebels, IB's and Silverwoods of the world are growing, but they still have to double, triple or even quadruple in size to equal the offerings of CF's or SF's bigger parks.
Just to clarify again, I'm not necessarily asking if the smaller parks are overpriced, because I don't think they are. I'm wondering why the bigger parks don't suck it up and go for it with their ticket/pass pricing.
If it keeps up, in a few years it will literally cost more to get into HW, Knoebels, IB, Silverwood and other parks like that than it will to get into the CF or SF parks.
Something's not right there.
Even though the larger CF and SF parks have more coasters and attractions than KG or HW, the reality is, the average person in one day only gets to experience a fraction of everything that's available.
Here's another way to look at it-- for $35-40, one could experience just about all of a park like Knoebels or Holiday World. A larger park might take two or more days to experience totally. A 2-day flex at Hershey costs $62.50, and a 2-day Ride and Slide @ CP costs $71.95 (plus parking). So if you want to ride and see everything, it will end up costing more at the bigger parks. If you only want to get what you can in one day, the costs will be more similar.
RatherGoodBear said:
You can't look at it proportionally though...If you only want to get what you can in one day, the costs will be more similar.
That's a very interesting take on things. It certainly made me think.
Upon examining my own family's park visiting habits, we tend to be of the kind for which one full day is enough at the big parks and one full day is too much at the smaller parks.
Which in turn leads me to possibly finally understand why I personally don't find the same value in the small parks that so many enthusiasts do.
From where I stand I can pay $40-$45 per person for a park offering more options than we can take advantage of in a day, yet we're totally satisfied with doing as much as we can for that one day even if we miss certain secondary things.
Or I can pay $35-$40 per person for a park offering just enough options to amuse us for a portion of a full day then we find myself running out of things to do before we've spent our whole day's worth of time.
EDIT - sorry to have kinda hijacked this. By all means, please continue the FT discussion. :)
*** Edited 1/29/2008 7:48:25 PM UTC by Lord Gonchar***
I believe Sf and Cp season passes are great deals, but i never mind that Kennywood has about a 40 buck fee to get in.
Is it a better deal to buy tickets or a all day pass, i think IB is the same? Does the cost stop you from going to a park?
No I don't have a kid, but I still want to ride!
By the way I get to see Santa.... He hasn't exactly brought me my gift yet to that park. I'll ask him everyday I'm there.
I don't know any other park that can say that besides HW.
*** Edited 1/30/2008 11:27:09 PM UTC by wes jorden***
Smaller parks like DelGrosso's I'd agree aren't full day parks-- but up till now, they haven't been part of the discussion.
Then again, maybe that's where I find it even more frustrating.
Places like DelGrossos are 1/2 day parks. Places like CF and SF parks are full day (or 1+ days) parks.
Where does that leave the parks we've been discussing?
In some weird grey area. (the 3/4 day park?)
It's a meeting in the middle that's the worst of both worlds - a size closer to the 1/2 day park and a price closer to the full day park...
...and I say that only partially tongue-in-cheek. :)
We spent approximately 7 hours and 4 minutes there before we left. (based on the time stamps on my pics from that day)
I was able to experience all I wanted to in 7 hours.
(there's a difference between experiencing everything and experiencing everything you want to)
Based on the 2003 calendar, we arrived about 2 hours after opening and left two hours before closing.
It was enough to satisfy me for almost 5 years. We'll probably head out to check out FT sometime this year.
It's not meant to be mean-spirited or derogatory or to hate or belittle or whatever - it just is what it is. Knoebels was a partial-day park for us when we visited.
rollergator said:
When I'm at a smaller park, I take the opportunity to enjoy some of the "lesser" attractions I generally skip at larger parks - like say, a Scrambler.
Seems crazy, doesn't it? Admittedly, I'm the kind of guy who feels like if I've been on one tilt-a-whirl or scrambler, I've been on them all - but the kids dig them time and time again. Sometimes we hit them, sometimes we don't. It's more likely to happen at the smaller parks just due to the fact that there's usually less in the way of truly unique rides and that lines are often shorter.
Speaking of which - Knoebels didn't exactly have long lines the day we visited. IIRC, the longest waits would have been Phoenix or Twister at maybe 15 minutes.
It's not perfect math, but it seems to me that with average waits around 10 minutes or less for most rides, one could do right around 40 rides in 7 hours.
Obviously, that's not going to happen that way - but it shouldn't seem totally unreasonable to do 20 or 25 rides with those waits and still have time to wander around, eat, check out the museums, see the bald eagles, play a little fascination, browse some shops and call it a day after 7 or 8 hours.
I'm not an open to close kind of guy either, which is why I almost never buy the handstamp there. Seven to nine hours is usually the range for me in any park. Luckily, they have the ticket option, which usually allows me to ride all I want for less than the POP rate.
By the same token, at just about all other parks I'd pay their full price for the 7 or 8 hours I spend there.
RGB - we did the RAD or POP or whatever it is and the value was probably close enough that it really didn't make a huge difference.
I'd almost argue that the added cost of POP is worth avoiding the hassle of dealing with tickets - and with a wife and two kids...it can be a hassle.
"Ok, I need three tickets"
"Mom, I dropped a ticket"
"I still need my tickets, Dad"
"Hold on to these while we go ride"
"Where'd my tickets go"
You get the idea. :)
With that said, knowing what I do now - when we swing back through (and I really am hoping to this summer) - I'll plan on a half-day visit and most likely use tickets.
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