Continued: Cedar Fair announces Geauga Lake will be water park only

I haven't ridden it, but I totally agree that a good woodie is worth its weight in gold. The question is, can you articulate that fact to people who don't surf coaster boards in a 30 second TV ad? Most people I know / encounter in GP-land assume wood = old and rough.

That's very true. I forget which paper it was, but I did an interview after The Voyage announcement where the reporter was asking me if it was a response to people wanting "older coasters." I had to explain that the engineering of modern wood coasters is nothing like what we had even fifteen years ago. Heck, I've heard Villain referred to as "that old coaster."

All I can say is, wow, Jeff, wow. Now my tone about the marketing department disagrees with you. Okay, let me rephrase: Then CF's marketing department must be *subpar in the extreme* indeed.

And since you've cleared things up that it's not the marketing department's responsibility, I'll amend it even further: the advertising agency CF hired must be subpar in the extreme.

Is that acceptable?

Can't hype a woodie? I think there are parks in Indiana and central PA that manage to do just fine without $10 million steel coasters. They're each pulling in a million people who are mostly "GP" who seem to know what a good coaster is.

Lightning Racer is still a major marketing point for Hershey-- it was featured on the cover of their season pass coupon book for 2007. Not everyone in the GP necessarily wants to go 100 mph, be inverted a half dozen times, or go 300 feet above the ground.

Now if you'll excuse me, I have to go review the TOS.

Promoting a wood coaster does work in some places, but Northeast Ohio isn't Southern Indiana. The expectations are different.

Besides, Six Flags tried a woodie, and several steel coasters. Didn't work.

I agree. On those lines, I think that the New GCI at SFSTl was one of the strangest decisions I've heard in a long time. How does one promote that? "Come ride our new wood coaster! It's not as big, tall, long, or fast as the other 2, including the one we built a few years ago, but it's really fun!"

GL was dead. But, lucky for Michigan's Adventure and other CF parks, it had agreed to be an organ donor. It's death is helping other parks lead a longer and more vibrant life.

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How does one promote that? "Come ride our new wood coaster! It's not as big, tall, long, or fast as the other 2, including the one we built a few years ago, but it's really fun!"

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Well, except for the wood part, you just described the Maverick marketing plan.

^^ I'm not so sure it agreed to be an organ donor. I suspect its current guardian forged a living will . . .

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Brian Noble said:

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How does one promote that? "Come ride our new wood coaster! It's not as big, tall, long, or fast as the other 2, including the one we built a few years ago, but it's really fun!"

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Well, except for the wood part, you just described the Maverick marketing plan.

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Bah-Zing! Bullseye with that one. :)

Isn't it about time to finally move on? I mean honestly, what left is there to talk about with this GL closing??

How does one promote that?

You add as many qualifiers as possible to make the ride appear much more special that it is:

"Evil Knievel - The tallest, fastest, longest wooden coaster in the world named after a daredevil."

"Evil Knievel - the curviest wooden coaster west of the Mississippi, east of Kansas City, north of Springfield and south of Quincy."

*** Edited 10/21/2007 4:14:22 AM UTC by Mamoosh***

Example direct from Cedar Fair: Wicked Twister = world's tallest, double twisting impulse coaster.

Parker, since this is a thread about Geauga Lake closing its rides and going to a waterpark only format, isn't this the appropriate place for just such a discussion? I mean, if you aren't interested, don't read it.

*** Edited 10/21/2007 6:02:53 AM UTC by Ensign Smith***

If all you have to market are products that market themselves (the biggest, tallest, fastest), then why do you need a marketing staff or advertising agency anyway? The whole purpose of marketing is to convince the public to purchase a product or service they don't necessarily need.

There's much more to parks than coasters (yes, I know this is a heresy to some people in here), or a continuous stream of record breaking coasters. There are other rides, water attractions, shows, refreshments, games. But apparently if CF doesn't have the next big steel coaster to market, they're lost. (Although to their credit, a few years ago the only new thing Dorney had to market was Revolution-- the year after Hershey put in the claw. They managed to make it sound like something wonderful.)

This isn't just with coasters, but with any product or service. Any agency worth their salt is going to be able to sell any product, no matter what its size. Do you really think agencies say to companies "well your product isn't as large as what company B is selling, so we really have no clue how to market it?"

Those spokespeople on home shopping channels can go on for an hour about how wonderful some trinket, or sheet set, or string of Christmas lights is. Ad agencies have turned marketing pitches for the most mundane products into catchphrases and buzzwords. Maybe CF needs to get rid of their current staff (I don't care if they were along for the honeymoon) and hire Billy Mays and the HeadOn crew-- they'd sell wood coasters for you.

I'm not an expert in sociology or demographics, so I have no idea why Ohio is an isolated pocket of population that has no interest in anything but large steel coasters. The only possible explanation is that the chains who were present in the area the past few years have a record of horrible maintenance when it comes to wooden coasters. No wonder why folks equate wood with old and rough.

Just for the sake of discussion, let's get on the trolley and travel to the world of make believe.

toot. toot.

Cedar Fair honestly had no intention, ever, of keeping Geagua Lake, and purposely under-marketed it so that it could re-distribute the rides to other parks in need.

Pretending for a moment that it is nothing other than fact, what does that mean to you? Will you change your park going ways? As a consumer are you going to do something....such as boycott Cedar Fair parks?

Just curious what you're all prepared to do.

Maybe those Ohioans don't visit those parks in adjacent states enough. Parks like KW, IB and HW certainly know how to maintain wood.

Also, what about those memories of great woodies of the past such as the Idora Wildcat and the Coney Island Shooting Star? Of course many people today are too young to have been around back then, let alone old enough to ride those coasters.i

I actually just finished reading the Coney Island book by Jacques. Quite a fascinating park in its heydey it was. *** Edited 10/21/2007 11:20:24 PM UTC by Agent Johnson***

That's an amazing book... and amazing story of an amazing amusement park. It's bittersweet how the park became a victim of its own success. Definitely one of the great lost parks in amusement history.

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RatherGoodBear said:
Maybe CF needs to get rid of their current staff (I don't care if they were along for the honeymoon) and hire Billy Mays and the HeadOn crew-- they'd sell wood coasters for you.

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Since they'd proably call it Thunderhawk, here's how the new GCI would be promoted:

Thunderhawk, sit down and ride it! Thunderhawk, sit down and ride it!, Thunderhawk, sit down and ride it! Thunderhawk...well you get the idea. Make sure to know where your mute button is, or a slegehammer, because you're going to need it.

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The only possible explanation is that the chains who were present in the area the past few years have a record of horrible maintenance when it comes to wooden coasters. No wonder why folks equate wood with old and rough.

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The two definitely go hand in hand. It's hard to convince someone that something is new and improved, but not impossible when creating a new woodie. It just might involve some trickery, and postive word of mouth.

Take El Toro for example. To the average person it looks like a traditional wood coaster, but we know differently. ET gets huge lines because it's awesome and rerideable. The things that were changed from the traditionally-made woodie such as the wheels, the track, and the trains make a huge difference in the rider's comfort.

There are a few exceptions, but theme parks are generally terrible when it comes to wood coasters. There are plenty of people in this area that will not ride a wood coaster because they had a terrible experience on Rolling Thunder. I'm sure that does make it hard for a theme park to "sell" a wood coaster to guests. But it can be done.

If you can't hype a coaster as being the "-est" anything, hype it as being a fun ride, or talk up the retro aspect. Claim it's like the coasters that scared the crap out of your grandpa, or mention how many moments of airtime it has. There are definitely ways to market wood coasters, many parks just choose to ignore them.

It'll be interesting to see how SFStL markets Evil Kinivel next year.