Cedar fairs obsessionn with Cedar Point

Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:31 PM
I was wondering if anyone whos homepark is worlds of fun, knotts berry farm,Valleyfair, or dorney park thought that they were cheated out of new big rides everyother year. I live in Kansas City and i think worlds of fun is being screwed over by cedar fair. Worlds of fun got Boomerrang last year and it blows. This year we got Camp Snoopy. Woo Hoo. Not !! I highley doubt WoF will get a rollercoaster next year as well as the other cedar fair owned parks since thell be busy building 2 or 3 more coasters for cedar point so they can get the title for having the most coasters. Arrgghhhh. It ticks me off. Does anyone else fell this way???
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:35 PM
Cedar Point is the "cash cow" of the group. Each park has to pay for it's own existance and new rides. CP and Knotts are the only two parks of the chain that can rationalize the dollars necessary to pull off massive rides.
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:38 PM
I would also be mad. However, I can't complain since The Point is my homepark. The best rides combined with best staff, best food, and most importantly roller coasters is truly amazing.
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"The end of endings is coming," PHILMORE - Our Finest Hour
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:41 PM
...Look who is getting a kick*****inverted called Talon...not Cedar Point.
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:43 PM
I don't know the money story and all behind it, but if Cedar Fair is just neglecting the park and focusing only on their more significant ones then they should just sell it or pay more attention to it. I agree that a major-chain park that rarely gets any serious rides would be lousy. But doesn't WoF have the Mamba and Timberwolf and a couple other good ones? I've never been there but it doesn't seem like they're too bad off.
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:46 PM
Look who will most likely get a hella sweet *** coaster next year....not worlds of fun or valleyfair. We dont get crap. The least cedar fair can do is get WoF a family roller coaster. He got rid of ours to make room for Boomercrap.
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:46 PM
All of those parks are very good parks, but Cedar Point will always be the best. Ghostrider was 24 mill. dollars at KBF so i don't think at all that they only focus on Cedar Point. Dorney Park is getting Talon this year, so they aren't getting "screwed" and all of the other ones i think will eventually get a large attraction in years to come. You're right, Cedar Point is Cedar Fair's main focus, but it doesn't totally screw other parks in the chain
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 3:49 PM
There not bad off. But we got timber wolf in 89. Orient in like 80 i think. and mamba in 98. but thats a long time between each good coaster. Cedar Point expects something huge every other year almost.
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 4:26 PM
No not really, if im mistaken (prob. am!) Mantis was built in 94? Woodstock Express in 98?? & Mf in 2000, that isn't alot of big things every other year for Cp...

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Drachen Fire, Will it be swimming with the fishies?
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 4:31 PM
89-Magnum
91-Mean Streak
94-Raptor
96-Mantis
98-WE
99-PT
00-MF

If that's not big I don't know what else is. Too bad more than half(DT,ID,CCMR,CS) of their coasters before Magnum were pretty bad IMO.

And how is CF paying attention to Knott's? Two SBNO coasters, 2 shuttle coasters, and a mediocre family coaster. Sure GR, SS, and PP were good, but they needed them to bring back the business. IMO, CF has the worst hypers overall out of all the other park chains. I never hear any praise towards Mamba,and Wild Thing and Steel Force are only occasional recognized. Magnum can be plain rough sometimes.

Believe me, if CP didn't have an invert already, Talon would've gone there. To other CF home park-ers, be glad you don't get the first of all these. Eventually,(hopefully) you will get the better coaster than CP because they already have
it.

It's unfair but I guess you have to live with it. I would give CF the award as worst chain. At least SF spreads the coasters around very evenly and nicely according to popularity and ROI. I respect them for that.

Thanks for listening to *my* $.02.

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A Monster is Rising!! Be afraid...be very afraid!
Reptar's revenge-April 7, 2001
PKI-Kings Mills, Ohio-Wooden and Kiddie Coaster Capital of the World! *** This post was edited by Koaster King on 3/27/2001. ***
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 4:31 PM
Raptor was built in '94, Mantis in '96, Power Tower in '98, Woodstock Express in '99, and MF in 2000.....that's pretty much something big every other year....wouldn't you say?

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Jeff Young
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 4:43 PM
Us Knott's Berry Farm fans can't complain, Cedar Fair has pumped TONS of money into this park the last 3 years. The park looks great, it's the only CF park actually "removing" a bad coaster rather than settling for it, and then there's Ghostrider, a wooden coaster so good that even Cedar Point fans want something similar. I can't wait to find out what they're building next year. And I'm pretty sure WOF and VF have great rides coming as well. *** This post was edited by DWeaver on 3/27/2001. ***
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 4:52 PM
Look, 'LiL B', Cedar Point is Cedar Fair. Its just a name combo of Cedar Point and the newly purchase of Valleyfair in the mid-70's. The Board of Directors meet there, and Kinzel himself lives just outside the parks gates on Lake Erie. All those people running those other parks came from Cedar Point. Even my fomer boss Jack Falfas now runs KBF. He is doing an incredible job, being he started in Cedar Point's Frontiertown around 1974 operating the Antique Car ride. Kinzel himself was a salesman who sold products to Interstate United, who was the main concessionaire to the park in the 70's.

That staff who makes up the Board 'lives' the industry. They know something about everything. Those people who are running the other parks all were hand picked by Robert Munger to assist in the transition of power to Kinzel before his untimely death. Those guys made a resort profitable when they experienced decades of struggling with finacial control.

And for the record, Dorney Park was up to their eyeballs in debt. The Hunt's family,with World's of Fun, who meant well, did not want to commit to the day to day operations of what a themer needs to survive. Same with Knotts. They just got too large as a family, and decision making was burdensome,and time consuming. When multiple family members are in disaggreement, the park loses focus. They could have taken a better deal from SF, but the Knotts new the park would be in good hands with Cedar Point. Does anyone know that the Knotts have several seats on the Board? Camp Snoopy? Came with the deal. Its much easier to operate from Valleyfair than Los Angeles.

And the new waterpark in San Diego, Soak City? It was bankrupt. It operated on a year to year basis. They essentially saved that park from auction. It could be housing complex now. The point is that Cedar Fair is a 100% committed company in the amusement industry. They use their own money to expand and develope. They are over-safe, and their training is top notch.

Bottom line is that they are respected by their peers(even our giant park)and everyone involved in the industry. Everypark has what is needed to maintain attendance and profit. If more parks were like them, the industry would be a better place for all of us.


*** This post was edited by Agent Johnson on 3/27/2001. *** *** This post was edited by Agent Johnson on 3/28/2001. ***
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 5:02 PM
Living in the Heartland I can relate to the WoF buzzers as I'm a Valleyfair season ticket holder and the two parks are similar in their recent developments. However, before I really lay anything on thick I think new rides are based a lot on park performance.

For instance, if Valleyfair does as good next year as it did this year I'd be shocked to see them get denied another coaster in 2002 or 2003. However, I realize that there's no real pressing need for VF to get loaded up with any new rides as there's not really much in terms of competition. So, there's no real great sense of urgency to get rides put up. I wish VF got coasters as often as CP does though, I think I understand why they don't. Also, in MN we're just pretty much happy with what comes down the chute. And we're willing to wait for quality so much instead of quantity.

As for WoF I can see where fans of the park can be a bit peeved. And there's a series of arguments why CF is kind of giving WoF the cold shoulder.
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Randy Hutchinson
You build it, I'll ride it...eventually
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 5:02 PM
So there we go. Couldn't agree more, Agent Johnson! :)

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Po!nt of View: A different look at Roller Coasters.
http://www.crosswinds.net/~justmayntz/thrills/index.html
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 5:04 PM
Before everyone starts complaining about how Cedar Fair is neglecting all its other parks listen...

I remember this topic coming up not too long ago and from what I heard, Cedar Fair DOES NOT run its parks like Six Flags. If Cedar Point makes enough money to get a new coaster then they get the coaster. If Dorney Park doesn't make any money, then they don't get anything. It all depends on home much the park makes. It isn't "Oh lets use the money from the smaller parks to get a roller coaster from Cedar Point." Now I could be wrong, but I don't think so. Seach for this topic

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Best Coaster: Millennium Force
Worst Coaster: Project Stealth
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 5:14 PM
Well if the case is that the parks manage their own money, then something has to give. I don't live anywhere close to VF or WOF, but I would like to see them pull something off the drawing board to make some attempt to kept up with competition.

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Talon is going to rock, roll, and take its toll!
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 5:22 PM
Yep, its just like Jeff has always been saying. Its all about the cash. The amusement park industry is a business, and its all about the profit. I do find it ironic how big rides attract guests but having lots of guests is why the big rides get built :)

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"I traded my soul for a ride on Millennium Force"
www.starcoasters.com
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 5:23 PM

You Ungratefull He Whores. Would you rather be a SF like Elicth Gardens and Have Nothing but a Boomerang and expect to get nothing. Look at what Cedar Fair Does. They get to all their parks sooner or later. Almost all their parks have HYPERS!! aND NOW WE ARE GETTING AROUND TO GETTING iNVERTS. Be grateful that you are getting a Quality coaster otherwise you could have gotten Stuck with NINJA AT SFOG!!!!
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Tuesday, March 27, 2001 7:16 PM
Intaminrocks says:

Look at what Cedar Fair Does. They get to all their parks sooner or later. Almost all their parks have HYPERS!!


Huhh??? Correct me if I am wrong but only CP and VF have hypers. CF has a total of 3(including MF). I know CF doesnt have many parks but at the same time you shouldnt make a statement like that because it isnt impressive considering the amount of parks they own.

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"SAVING THE WORLD BEFORE BEDTIME" Powerpuff girls
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