Brief Cedar Fair and MA rant.

Thursday, March 29, 2012 12:01 PM

Speaking of Geauga Lake...

Most of the stuff that got auctioned off up there...yeah, there was a reason for that. Some of the stuff that didn't get auctioned probably should have been.

Six Flags was not a particularly good caretaker of that park.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 12:05 PM

The thing that frustrates me the most is that MA was nothing before Shivering Timbers and now people are saying that Thunderhawk was too much for MA or that the park doesn't need more rides. If Thunderhawk was too much ride for that park, then in my opinion, so was Shivering Timbers. For a park to grow, they have to add big rides every once in a while, and it's obviously working since MA continues to break attendance records.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 1:17 PM

Timber-Rider said:
Most days you can get on any ride in under 20 minutes.

Timber-Rider said:
I would rather have the Bat. But, at MA. it would probably end up having the longest line in the park, considering that the park's other one train coaster does have lines surpassing a 2 hour wait. Not worth it.

So which is it? Every time you post, you contradict nearly everything you typed in your last post. Let it go.

-Nate

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 4:20 PM

Exactly. If I have no major competition and I have people showing up and buying tickets, I'm not going to build something new. I'm going to put all that money I'm not spending on something new in the bank.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 5:48 PM

CPcyclone said:
It's obviously working since MA continues to break attendance records.

If MA breaks attendance records with their current lineup, why would they add anything new?

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 5:55 PM

To make their fans happy, of course.

This is obvious to most people who frequent CoasterBuzz, and exactly what people are getting at, but I'll just say it anyways. Parks add new attractions to maintain attendance. When they are doing well, it's not necessary to add new attractions.

You are welcome.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 8:41 PM

Timber-Rider said:

Most days you can get on any ride in under 20 minutes.

Timber-Rider said:
I would rather have the Bat. But, at MA. it would probably end up having the longest line in the park, considering that the park's other one train coaster does have lines surpassing a 2 hour wait. Not worth it.

So which is it? Every time you post, you contradict nearly everything you typed in your last post. Let it go.

Nothing is contradicted.You can get on most rides in 20 minutes, but like any other park there can be long waits. And, their one train coaster the Wolverine Wildcat can have over a 2 hour wait on a busy day, so when I said it wasn't worth it, I was referring to the Wildcat, not being worth a 2 hour wait. As for the Bat, I was just commenting that it would have a equally long line as a one train coaster.

What's wrong with that? Some days there is nobody there and you can walk on every single ride in the park with no wait at all, and others you spend all day standing in line. I wouldn't tell anyone they a contradicting themselves over something as varied as a que. I have been at Cedar Point and walked on the the corkscrew with no wait, and others I waited an hour. Am I going to be contradicting myself by saying the corkscrew isn't worth it?

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 8:46 PM

LostKause said:
To make their fans happy, of course.

This is obvious to most people who frequent CoasterBuzz, and exactly what people are getting at, but I'll just say it anyways. Parks add new attractions to maintain attendance. When they are doing well, it's not necessary to add new attractions.

You are welcome.

If they don't add new attractions because they are doing well, why raise prices? Seems to me if their guests are already happy with what they have, they should be glad to say to their guests, we are not offering you anything new this year. So, we will keep our prices the same as last year so that you will feel good about coming back...BUT NOO!! We aren't going to do that! We know you like coming here, so we are going to raise our prices to get more of your money, and offer you nothing in return. Thanks for coming!

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 10:30 PM

You are in complete denial of the simple concept of supply and demand. If you can charge more and maintain the same attendance, you do. At the very least, you increase prices enough to cover inflation.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 10:30 PM

Timber-Rider said:
If they don't add new attractions because they are doing well, why raise prices?

Because the cost of everything goes up from year to year. Things which involve running a park, such as food, water and energy.

Or, simply because they can. If you could raise the price of something by 5%, and sell just as many (or, at least not lose more than 5% of your costumers), then you get more profit. Amusement parks are businesses, so they make decisions to keep them healthy.

"Customer appreciation" is a marketing term made up to instill a false sense of value to the customer. If you can overcharge a customer, AND make them feel like they got a bargain, you've just won the game.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 10:57 PM

Timber-Rider said:

If they don't add new attractions because they are doing well, why raise prices?...

I've learned many things from CoasterBuzz over the years, and one of the most significant is supply and demand. Prices on anything will change from time to time to find a sweet spot where the most profit can be made. Businesses try to get the price of their products at just the right place. If it's too high, less people will pay. If it's too low, they are letting potential money slip through their fingers. Finding the right price to charge means that everyone wins.

I feel strange posting this, because I am no expert on the subject. Some people might claim that supply and demand is common knowledge. I forgot it between high school and when I relearned it on CoasterBuzz, so I understand if you are not taking this into consideration.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 10:58 PM

How's that Kool-Aid, Travis? :)

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:04 PM

Supply and demand are one thing, inflation is another. As the price of gas rises, so do lots more expenses. And MiA seems to add stuff from time to time, but why would a business waste money when the whole point is to make money?

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:05 PM

I know why they raise their prices, from all of the stuff you guys mentioned. Inflation and all of that BS. It's the same arguement that the oil companies use to justify charging over $4.00 for gasoline, even though everyone you asks thinks the oil companies are ripping people off, no body comes to their rescue, because they are wrong in doing what they are doing, yet, with some of the people on this board all this economic stuff involving the parks, is justified? I don't think so.

Are any of you ok with paying over $4.00 for gas to get your favorite park? are you ok with that kind of business logic? If you look at the basics of both businesses it's the same idea. Supply and demand, and rising costs of doing business. But, i am not ok with paying $4.00 for gas, nor am I ok with paying $10.00 to park the car, at a park that is in the middle of nowhere.

These people remind me of the guy from Jurrasic Park. They tought up all these ideas to make huge amounts of money, but, they never think of the outcome of what will happen if they do it. Look at what Cedar Fair did to Geauga Lake. Took a great park, and ruined it, so that they could basically get rid of a major competitior. And, since they own almost every major park in the Great Lakes region, besides Great America. They could be better at pricing, and should.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:08 PM

CoasterDemon said:
How's that Kool-Aid, Travis? :)

Tastes like reality to me...

...or maybe fruit punch.

Either way.

Last edited by Lord Gonchar, Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:09 PM
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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:11 PM

Timber-Rider said:
Are any of you ok with paying over $4.00 for gas to get your favorite park? are you ok with that kind of business logic? If you look at the basics of both businesses it's the same idea. Supply and demand, and rising costs of doing business. But, i am not ok with paying $4.00 for gas, nor am I ok with paying $10.00 to park the car, at a park that is in the middle of nowhere.

Then there's your problem. You're letting what you think get in the way.

These guys are telling you how it is.

You can hate it all you want, but it's kinda like bitching and moaning that the sun comes up every day and makes things too bright.

Last edited by Lord Gonchar, Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:12 PM
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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:35 PM

But Gonch, my green/blue eyes are sensitive to the light!

~Rob

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:35 PM

I forgot to mention inflation and the gas prices.

I am not against an amusement park making money. If a park is not profitable, they will close. Most any price any amusement park charges will seem like a money grab. People will pay it. When enough people stop paying it, they will lower their prices.

Entertainment is expensive. I just paid $17 for the new Muppets DVD last week. I hated to pay that much, but I wanted it bad enough that I paid it anyways, because I am a big fan. That's just one example.

Rehashing the ol' Geagua Lake conspiracy theory just makes me uncomfortable with trying to explain anything to you that makes any kind of sense.

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Thursday, March 29, 2012 11:56 PM

Conspiracy or not, it still sucks. I'll pass on the kool-aid, thanks.

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Friday, March 30, 2012 9:10 AM

When they are doing well, it's not necessary to add new attractions.

With one caveat: if they do *very* well, they will need to add capacity to the park.

But, i am not ok with paying $4.00 for gas, nor am I ok with paying $10.00 to park the car, at a park that is in the middle of nowhere.

Then don't pay it, and find some other way to get from point A to B, and some other way of entertaining yourself on a summer afternoon. If enough other people stop buying gas or going to the park, the price will come down and/or the business will fail.

When it comes to gas, this has actually happened. Demand for gasoline in the US is dropping. In other words, gas prices could be much worse (and probably will be when the summer driving season hits):
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2012-03-27/u-dot-s-dot-gasoline-de...rcard-says

But, demand for Michigan's Adventure has been going up. In other words, people are increasingly finding it a good value for their entertainment time/dollars. It's true, no one likes paying more, and everyone would rather pay less, but wanting it doesn't make it so. Market forces matter.

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