Arrow Hypers or B&M Hypers?

Why even bring Steel Phantom into the mix? It doesn't exist anymore. Once you've crested the top of the second hill, you've left anything having to do with Arrow. We're coming up on the 6th year of operation for Phantom's Revenge, so just let it go. Edit: Sorry Jeff, but you're completely wrong about Steel Phantom. If the modifications weren't made, Steel Phantom would've been torn down. It was a ride with low ridership because people hated it. People aren't stupid. If you're getting beat up, you generally don't go back for more.

I see no one has defended Desparado yet, and from trip reports I've read, I don't imagine anyone will.

I have limited experience with Magnum. I think I managed three rides in my two-day trip. Those bunny hills in the tunnels hurt my legs pretty bad the first time, as they kept smacking the lapbar (Jeff explained the trick is to make sure your seatbelt is tight). One of the rides was at night, and that was amazing. I actually felt a little bit scared when we got out towards the pretzel turnaround.

I've only ridden Apollo's Chariot and Nitro. They're both fun rides, but they're also a little bit placid. *** Edited 1/15/2006 8:15:26 PM UTC by Intamin Fan***

Steel Phantom was the best ride ever built

Arrow Vs. B&M? Easy: Neither. I choose Intamin.

mOOSH

Moosh: You would. ;)

- John, who has no idea what that means.

I'm sorry...I respect everyone's opinion...I really do, but you must be one hell of a masochist to think steel Phantom is the best ride ever! :)

I remember I was at the ACE event to say goodbye to it. There was "farewell" ERT....most people took one ride for the day, took some excedrin, and moved on!

Anyway.....I was in favor of them tearing the death machine down. Who knew that one of the worst rides ever could be turned into one of the best! (Of course, SFNE's Superman craps over any Arrow, Morgan, of B&M ever built! I'll trade you all my rides on MF, SD2K, etc. ever for just one on it!) *** Edited 1/15/2006 10:44:05 PM UTC by Peabody***

Ive ridden Steel Phantom many many times and never experienced any pain or headaches....I had just plain fun...it was awesome.

B&M all the way. Magnum and friends in the arrow hyper catalog are big rampy minetrains with poorly designed hills and uncomfortable trains in my opinion.

I enjoyed (greatly) the original Phantom for the sheer power of the ride, but anyone arguing that Phantom II isn't better is off their rocker. Phantom's Revenge over B&M and any Arrow too, while I'm spouting opinions.

I'm not one who rates coasters as far as top 10 steel or wood, but reading this thread makes me realize that hypers are definitely my favorite coasters overall.

P.S. I loved Desperado!

Throw me in the B&M list as well. I think Magnum has an awesome layout, but the trains just ruin it. If CP went the way of Kennywood and replaced the trains, we'd have Magnum renaissance.

The problem isn't necessarily Magnum's trains but how the track transitions were designed. Triangular bunnies = sharp, painful airtime.

I'll stick with Intamin thanks

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Mamoosh said:The problem isn't necessarily Magnum's trains but how the track transitions were designed. Triangular bunnies = sharp, painful airtime.

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I think both you *and* delan have valid points...the pointy hills DO throw you, but I get THROWN on PR and it is pure bliss, painless. Strong hills, where you crest quickly and drop HARD, those produce delicious airtime....but if the seats or lapbars *crunch* into you, it's decidedly less enjoyable...

B&Ms just don't produce that kind of forces to begin with, but with their trains I think they COULD produce actual forces without being painful...

...until proven otherwise, I have to believe that the 4-across B&M train, with its tight guide-wheels springs or whatever, does *something* that just makes it FEEL slower, and less powerful...I have to believe that an Intamin train on a B&M hyper would be *almost as good* as an Intamin RoS... (well, other than SFNE's, LOL)...

B&M is finesse and I dont like their hypers....Arrow hypers are great but I'll agree some of the lap bars can be bad, but the coasters are good.

I love both companies rides for what I've ridden. I would take Magnum over Nitro but just barely...and that's in part because of the location and history of the ride. I love Arrow's design though, Big One and Desperado are both in my top 5 dream coasters to ride.

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rollergator said:...until proven otherwise, I have to believe that the 4-across B&M train, with its tight guide-wheels springs or whatever, does *something* that just makes it FEEL slower, and less powerful...I have to believe that an Intamin train on a B&M hyper would be *almost as good* as an Intamin RoS... (well, other than SFNE's, LOL)...

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I think it's largely because the B&M trains are quite a bit shorter. Since the front and back rows are closer to the center of mass of the train on a B&M than on an Intamin, the same hill with the longer Intamin train will produce more air (because the front and back rows will crest at a greater speed) than a B&M train.

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Peabody said:

(Of course, SFNE's Superman craps over any Arrow, Morgan, of B&M ever built! I'll trade you all my rides on MF, SD2K, etc. ever for just one on it!)

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Okay, I'll bite. ;)

SFNE's S:RoS is head and shoulders above any other steel I've ridden (which includes almost everything in the U.S. above 200') but it's not *that* much better. PR, X, the other S:RoS's while not "perfection" aren't bad rides either. :P

But maybe I'm just spoiled from living in Boston for 5 years and logging close to 100 laps on it.

Although it was a fun ride and I would love to go back and ride it again, I thought Phantom's Revenge was well... blah.

The drop was just okay and the double down did nothing for me. Mind you I tried several different seats.

It's a good ride for sure. I just don't understand why people always seem to praise it. I must be missing something.

As for the topic, I can't believe I'm saying this but... Arrow. I would take Magnum over Nitro any day. It's more raw.

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UBRhino said:

I just don't understand why people always seem to praise it. I must be missing something.

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Yeah a brain..

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How mature...

For those who don't take shots at others for expressing their opinion please enlighten me.

The reason PR's drop was underwhelming to me was because of the angle. However, the speed going into it was nice as was the change in direction at the bottom. The ride itself just seems SO short. I thought that could have been salvaged with a knock out ending but once again, the ride seemed to come up short for me. Everyone seems to love that double down but I felt nothing.

Could it be that I had an empty train each time I was on? Has riding coasters like S:ROS at SFNE made possibly "good" coasters just mediocre?

Oh, I love it when people commit CBuzz Suicide ;)