What Cedar Fair park should inherit "Big Dipper"?

I loved Big Dipper... I haven't experienced such an air-time woodie like that ever. The front car was the best... it gave literally standing-air-time. The size of the coaster is completely misleading to the ride itself. The back was a little rough, though.

With that said... it really doesn't HAVE to go to another Cedar Fair park. Why not sell it off? Why give the rides to some other park in the chain when they could make a few bucks and sell it to a park who could really use it?

I bet there are a few small parks that could use it... if you use a proximity within a couple hundred miles radius of the park (for shipping purposes)... Darien Lake would benefit greatly from a second wooden coaster, especially a ACE classic as such.

Oh, and believe me... if they even thought of the wrecking ball for this coaster, you would get a lot of ACE preservationists up the yin yang to try & save this little guy.

In all likelyhood it's probably go the way of SFAW's cyclone....the bulldozer.

Does anyone think that ACEs will buy the trains for their museum?

It took $4 million to move and rebuild starliner at Cypress Gardens, so it is possible. But a new wooden, such as Renegade cost $6.5 million, so making it doubtful that it will happen.

I would say RWB and double loop are going to get scrapped as well, but you never know.

Paul Blackstone said:
No historic value? What exactly gives a ride historic value?

Compare the Cony Island Cyclone or Leap The Dips to Big Dipper. Which rides have some real history?

If nothing else Big Dipper was fun, one of the best coasters [at] Geauga Lake and best wooden coasters in Ohio.

That's all subjective. I personally didn't like the ride... It hurt like hell and was pretty boring. Given it's not the worst thing ever (that special spot is reserved for The Beast) but for me it's always been a mediocre ride. It's not worth the effort to try and save it from the wrecking ball.

Playa said:
That having been said--why don't we treat others like it was happening to our own home park? A little sensitivity, perhaps? Wouldn't kill ya...

That's the thing... From the posts that I've read, no-one is complaining that the park is closing - Only that this "special" ride is being lost.. but it's not that special.

I think coasters old and young are great fun and all, but I totally don't understand the emotional connection related to coasters. Parks? Absolutely... But coasters? I just don't get it.

kRaXLeRidAh said:
Most people could care less if the ride has history if it's a piece of sh*t.

Exactly.

Audioslaved said:
Does anyone think that ACEs will buy the trains for their museum?

The museum is such a joke. It'll never actually happen.
*** Edited 9/22/2007 5:42:50 PM UTC by rOLLocOASt***

That's the thing... From the posts that I've read, no-one is complaining that the park is closing - Only that this "special" ride is being lost.. but it's not that special.

Just because it isn't special to you doesn't mean it's not special to others, or an important piece of coaster history.

I see a slight possibility of Double Loop being saved, I mean, DelGrosso's amusement park is about to open the former Revolution from Liberty Land, and IMO it was WAY worse that DL, so why not save it too?

I'd be happy if someone just rebuilt a clone of the ride with all new materials. It's not that being an old ride makes it great. The ride is just great, period. It could be even better with a few tweaks. I don't see how any wood coaster fan could not love the Dipper. It is packed with airtime akin to Avalanche and Phoenix. It has a couple of tastey lateral spots as well.

Outside of somone rebuilding it from scratch, which would proabbly cost less than moving it, the best thing to hope for is it staying at GL and continuing to operate as the gateway to Geauga Lake like in those old park photos where cars are parked in front of it. I would think the waterpark could benefit from having a select few rides remaining. *** Edited 9/22/2007 7:00:07 PM UTC by Acoustic Viscosity***

C'mon, do we really have to mention Knoebel's buying every coaster that's facing the chopping block?

It's too similar a layout to Phoenix, and they're already waist-deep in another coaster construction.

When Dipper was running well it was an excellent ride. Many parks could benefit from it, but I doubt any will pull the trigger. I just don't think the market's there.

Maybe they could save a little face with the Cleveland market and move it along with a couple GL flats to CP... but not very likely.

Unfortunately, same goes for Double Loop. I like the ride, it's still smooth, and I think it's a great transition ride for kids before hitting a major steel coaster. Not that big of a footprint, either. I still just can't see any park thinking that it would be a great addition to their lineup, and especially not a Cedar Fair park.

I really believe that the only rides you'll see popping up elsewhere are those that were added by Six Flags. It's a sad ending for "An American Classic."

I don't see it popping up at Knoebels, but MAN, what a collection of wood they would have if it did!

How about a new perspective on this loss that is going to happen. I think that the title of the thread should include all of GL's rides.

But it does point out that we should try and see what kind of posetives this will create for those about to receive whatever relocates from GL.

I'm probably talking out of my A$$ about this since I've never been to that park. I do feel this is not a good thing taking place though. A loss is a loss.

Double loop would obviously not go to a park like Cedar Point or even Michigan's Adventure. But it could be a good fit at a small Pay-Per-Ride park. Now, will that happen? Who knows. If in the end they don't sell or relocate all the rides, they will likely end up as spare parts for similar attractions within the chain. With the rest going as scrap. I think steel is over $100 a ton now.

I'd like to see CF sell (well, they probably wouldnt) or lease the ride section to someone else to run. It would still compliment the draw to the water park and they can wash their hands of the operating expenses and liability.

Yeah, I know, dream on. I still hate their guts for this. No water park needs to be that big. Just thinkin'......

"Compare the Cony Island Cyclone or Leap The Dips to Big Dipper. Which rides have some real history?"

"Cyclone and Leap the Dips have more historical importance than Dipper" =/= "Dipper has no historical importance." It's like saying Nitro isn't a big coaster because there are still other coasters that are bigger.

"From the posts that I've read, no-one is complaining that the park is closing"

Maybe you should read more posts, then. Dipper is the focus of attention because it's old and well loved and a sentimental favorite. But just because Dipper is one focus of the discussion doesn't mean it's the only discussion, and if you'd like to pretend people aren't saddened about the park closing as a whole the only explanation I have is that you're being deliberately obtuse just to goad people who are upset.

"but it's not that special."

Wait, didn't you just play the "but that's all subjective" card? I mean your opinion of Dipper is yours, and that's fine, but if your subjective opinion is that the ride was crap and not worth saving then that's never going to trump other ones that say the opposite. It seems like you'd like to have it both ways here.

Isn't that special!?
Isn't that interesting?!

Funny, coming from the corporate howl of stuff like cookie cutter B&M's and such...

Dipper had rough seats. Like most woodies, the over-the-wheel seats could be a little rough.

I remember night rides when the thing was flying and had more laterals and air than all the other woodies in Ohio put together.

Knoebel's has a fairly new woodie with skid brakes. Other parks still run their woodies with skids. It has 'special rain operations' but it isn't that difficult to run a ride like that.

I'll take Big Dipper over most of the woodies that have been built in the last 20 years.

Holidayworld could still use a real out and back ;) (that was somewhat of a joke).

There's not way Knoebels re-locate another woodie...they're pretty much out of space and the Phoenix is already the park's signature out and back.

Holiday World could use a classic out and back though....but again I doubt anyone will actually buy it.

I think the only way to find wood as old as Knoebles or Kennywood's is to cut down a sequoia tree.

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CoastaPlaya said:
What if CF purchased SFMM and shut it down since it was a gangster-infested, poorly operated dump without a horrid reputaton, no flats worth mentioning and a park they had already been outdrawing with KBF for years? And THEN parceled out the rides amongst the other CF parks?

-CO

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LOL. I like how you assumed using Magic Mountain as a counter-example would help me realize how I feel about this Geauga Lake situation.

You're wrong.

Not only would any of those problems you mentioned be fixed with Cedar Fair's style of management, Magic Mountain's attendance has never fallen from a high of 3 million to less than 700,000 a season like Geauga Lake -- regardless of how the park was managed or what they built on a year-to-year basis. You're comparing apples to oranges.

Secondly, I could really give a rats ass if Magic Mountain were to be closed. That park is a dump, but that still doesn't escape the fact that the venue is still capable of drawing over 2.8 million guests annually.

^Way to totally dodge the point. You've done it here, you did it in the News section, you did it in the Astroworld thread, and you're doing it over at TPR, too. A park closes, you jump all over people who are saddened by it under the guise of "It's just business, get over it" and then stand back to watch what happens.

We get it. You don't care when a park you don't care about closes. That's fine, but prodding and poking folks who are understandably saddened by a park closing, and doing it over and over again is getting pretty trollish IMO.

Ok.. Here we go.

Mamoosh said:
Just because it isn't special to you doesn't mean it's not special to others, or an important piece of coaster history.

I checked RCDB to refresh my memory, and Big Dipper had been around since 1925, a John Miller, and is/was an ACE coaster classic. That's definitely some history there, but at the same time I honestly feel that there are plenty of other rides which are more significant historically which are also much better rides. Coaster at Playland is a perfect example - It's the only Carl Phare left and is still an absolutely amazing ride. Hell, it's was number 19 on the "Wooden Coaster Poll" this year. Big Dipper was only number 76 ;)

matt. said:
"Cyclone and Leap the Dips have more historical importance than Dipper" =/= "Dipper has no historical importance." It's like saying Nitro isn't a big coaster because there are still other coasters that are bigger.

I wouldn't nearly generalize that far. I realize that the ride has some history, and it's most definitely worth mentioning in the books and the museum if that ever happens. I just think that there are better/more significant rides to save. Coaster at Playland is once again my perfect example.

Dipper is the focus of attention because it's old and well loved and a sentimental favorite. But just because Dipper is one focus of the discussion doesn't mean it's the only discussion, and if you'd like to pretend people aren't saddened about the park closing as a whole the only explanation I have is that you're being deliberately obtuse just to goad people who are upset.

Do admit that I haven't really looked around a whole lot, and I honestly feel for anyone who is saddend by the loss of the park - but to me, losing the park isn't the end of the world. Most of the rides are being moved to other parks and Big Dipper will at least be remembered by some as being a great ride that thrilled millions of people for almost 100 years.

Perhaps I have a diffrent way at looking things than most... When I lose something or someone close to me it most definitely saddens me, but I always remember the great times and that makes it better, because even though they're gone now, I was there and had the privledge of knowing them and experiencing life with them.
(Kinda hard to translate into parks/coasters, but hopefully you get my drift.)

your opinion of Dipper is yours, and that's fine, but if your subjective opinion is that the ride was crap and not worth saving then that's never going to trump other ones that say the opposite. It seems like you'd like to have it both ways here.

Hopefully this post clarified everything. I tend to get misunderstood a lot ;)

As I said in my first post, in terms of praticality, if you really want to keep something around from the ride for historical significance/memories, put the trains in a museum along with photos/videos/whatever else that's around. It'd be a great tribute.

Hell, in all honesty I agree with Matt - I'd love to see a park build an inspired and improved version of the ride. I'd definitely go and ride it.