Virtual queue systems on trial
Posted
Disney says people are riding more, while Cedar Fair is still split on the effectiveness of virtual queue systems, which are intended to keep people in line less. USA Today reviews the systems in place at Islands of Adventure, Disneyland and Six Flags Great Adventure. The article also considers the pay-for-placement passes being offered at Six Flags Worlds of Adventure, which has been controversial among enthusiasts and guests alike.
Read the USA Today articles.
The queue board is a great idea, some parks have it. The problem is that they don't update it enough, so they just stick 1 hour on all the major rides and leave it like that. Plus the queue board is usually found at the entrance of the park and not at each ride. If they had the line jumping guard for each ride walk thru the queue area every 15 minutes with a walkie talkie, and then radio'd the wait time back to a central control center of the park, then it would work.
For example, at IOA in the afternoon the wait clock above then entrance to Popeye said 1 hour, we almost turned around but we entered the queue and it was a walkon. You can't see the queue line at the entrance of Popeye so that's an example where the accuracy of the wait clock is important. Same thing with Rip Saw falls, you can't see the line inside the building from the entrance. Wait clock accuracy is important.
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Robin Fox - "I see Stars, Can You See Them Too?"
For example, at IOA in the afternoon the wait clock above then entrance to Popeye said 1 hour, we almost turned around but we entered the queue and it was a walkon. You can't see the queue line at the entrance of Popeye so that's an example where the accuracy of the wait clock is important. Same thing with Rip Saw falls, you can't see the line inside the building from the entrance. Wait clock accuracy is important.
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Robin Fox - "I see Stars, Can You See Them Too?"
Somebody said each Six Flags has a different system. Can anybody explain them? I know SFGAm has $10 for 4 rides.
ZAch
ZAch
You know, I'd like to see Paramount's Kings Island try out the queue board idea (as robvia called it). I say Kings Island not because I think it would be especially effective in that park, but because they are already set up so that they could do it effectively with comparatively little effort: they already have QTV monitors scattered all over the park, all fed from a central source...frequent updates to QTV central with current queueing times on all the various major rides...and the information could be displayed all over the park with relative ease.
--Dave Althoff, Jr.
--Dave Althoff, Jr.
Ithink that the virtual queing works great. As an annual passholder to Universal/IOA, I arrive early, get my 3 passes for one side busier side of the park. I then go over to the other side of IOA, do all the rides there, before 12 am, then go back and use my passes I go earlier that day.
Also, Single rider lines have helped tremendously. Dueling Dragons desperately needs single rider lines, but I think that the physicla layout does not allow for it.
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allgold
Also, Single rider lines have helped tremendously. Dueling Dragons desperately needs single rider lines, but I think that the physicla layout does not allow for it.
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allgold
The problem is, that when some folks spend more time buying stuff, it is at the expense of others who are still in line. They in turn spend less time in the park buying stuff. The financial argument is groundless.
Perhaps my opinion was set when I was waiting for the water ride at DCA. It was hot, but the line didn't seem that long. Even though I had a fastpass in my pocket for California Soarin', it didn't seem to make up for the throngs of people getting let in front of me while I stood there in the sun. It feels like a class system.
And yes, how you arrange the folks in line has nothing to do with how quickly you can get a set number to ride.
I hate fast pass.
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Yeeee Haaawwww!
Perhaps my opinion was set when I was waiting for the water ride at DCA. It was hot, but the line didn't seem that long. Even though I had a fastpass in my pocket for California Soarin', it didn't seem to make up for the throngs of people getting let in front of me while I stood there in the sun. It feels like a class system.
And yes, how you arrange the folks in line has nothing to do with how quickly you can get a set number to ride.
I hate fast pass.
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Yeeee Haaawwww!
I think we are discussing two different issues: the principle of virtual queuing, and the actual implementation of virtual queuing.
For myself, I like the virtual queuing idea. I would much prefer to do anything else in the park (even sitting in the shade) then stand in line for 45+ minutes. I think the 25% ride increase could be accurate if you consider every single possible attraction at a park. In my personal experience, I usually skip the music/stunt shows so I can hit all the coasters. With virtual queuing, I can see these lower priority attractions without worry. The 25% increase makes sense unless you assume every attraction operates at 100% capacity for every minute of the day. While there are times in the peak season where that may happen, I doubt it would be the norm.
It makes good business sense for the park as well. Just as Southwest Airlines realized they don't make money if the planes are on the ground and thus implemented ticketless travel (among other things) to streamline operations, parks don't make money or increase customer satisfaction (which indirectly increases profits with word-of-mouth & return visits) with excessive waits in line.
I think many agree with virtual queuing in *principle*. But the problem is how to *implement* it. I don't like how Disney assigns one window (whereas Universal gives you a choice of times) or that it refers to the normal line as the "stand-by" enterance. Nor do I like being able to hold only one FastPass at a time (Universal offers more than one). If I understand correctly, Universal has changed their Express pass policy in mid-season which I also think is unacceptable.
As to the rides themselves, the queue areas should be re-designed. There should be a separate
enterance for virtual & regular queuing.
However, if parks really want to decrease wait times, the easiest & cheapest method would be a singles line, which an earlier poster mentioned. There would not be such animosity with other guests and each train (or other ride unit) will not have wasted space. Why hardly any parks do this is beyond my understanding...
For myself, I like the virtual queuing idea. I would much prefer to do anything else in the park (even sitting in the shade) then stand in line for 45+ minutes. I think the 25% ride increase could be accurate if you consider every single possible attraction at a park. In my personal experience, I usually skip the music/stunt shows so I can hit all the coasters. With virtual queuing, I can see these lower priority attractions without worry. The 25% increase makes sense unless you assume every attraction operates at 100% capacity for every minute of the day. While there are times in the peak season where that may happen, I doubt it would be the norm.
It makes good business sense for the park as well. Just as Southwest Airlines realized they don't make money if the planes are on the ground and thus implemented ticketless travel (among other things) to streamline operations, parks don't make money or increase customer satisfaction (which indirectly increases profits with word-of-mouth & return visits) with excessive waits in line.
I think many agree with virtual queuing in *principle*. But the problem is how to *implement* it. I don't like how Disney assigns one window (whereas Universal gives you a choice of times) or that it refers to the normal line as the "stand-by" enterance. Nor do I like being able to hold only one FastPass at a time (Universal offers more than one). If I understand correctly, Universal has changed their Express pass policy in mid-season which I also think is unacceptable.
As to the rides themselves, the queue areas should be re-designed. There should be a separate
enterance for virtual & regular queuing.
However, if parks really want to decrease wait times, the easiest & cheapest method would be a singles line, which an earlier poster mentioned. There would not be such animosity with other guests and each train (or other ride unit) will not have wasted space. Why hardly any parks do this is beyond my understanding...
Sure, in a recent trip to SFWOA, I purchased two five ticket passes to use. My experience was that this was probably a good deal for us because we were just there to ride rollercoasters and we were able in one day to ride all the best rides.
It was very uncomfortable to use the tickets knowing that I was increasing the wait time for another coaster lover.
I see this movement as an obvious attempt to get more money from season ticket holders. We have already paid in advance and it seems like a deal to be able to pay a small amount more and ride the most popular rides. But This Six Flags policy of assigning times to ride the park's two best rides is disappointing.
On our visit, We were able to see first hand the plus and minus of this system. When we first entered the park, the crowds we light and lines fairly short. We were able to ride many of the coasters covered by the pass without using the coupons.The tickets provided no value on these
rides.
We were restricted, by our tickets, to ride at 4-5 PM on X-Flight and 5-6 on Superman.
The passes did not apply to Batman so no time was saved there. The line was short on Superman so we rode while we waited for our time to come to ride X-Flight.
The lines were long for X-Flight and we did save time there but the combination of a car that had to be taken out of service and a rainstorm caused us to be unable to ride X more than once.
Since we had already ridden Superman, we gave away our remaining tickets just before we left the park.
In conclusion, the passes help a coaster lover to experience more great coasters in one visit. You do feel embarassed when you are pushed ahead of other people.
I believe that this two tiered system the parks are setting up, if it continues, will result in the operators catching more grief from these people who have paid more money and will thus demand special treatment. I noted one time, during our visit, that the people using the passes gave the operators of the rides a hard time because they were not treated as royalty.
It was very uncomfortable to use the tickets knowing that I was increasing the wait time for another coaster lover.
I see this movement as an obvious attempt to get more money from season ticket holders. We have already paid in advance and it seems like a deal to be able to pay a small amount more and ride the most popular rides. But This Six Flags policy of assigning times to ride the park's two best rides is disappointing.
On our visit, We were able to see first hand the plus and minus of this system. When we first entered the park, the crowds we light and lines fairly short. We were able to ride many of the coasters covered by the pass without using the coupons.The tickets provided no value on these
rides.
We were restricted, by our tickets, to ride at 4-5 PM on X-Flight and 5-6 on Superman.
The passes did not apply to Batman so no time was saved there. The line was short on Superman so we rode while we waited for our time to come to ride X-Flight.
The lines were long for X-Flight and we did save time there but the combination of a car that had to be taken out of service and a rainstorm caused us to be unable to ride X more than once.
Since we had already ridden Superman, we gave away our remaining tickets just before we left the park.
In conclusion, the passes help a coaster lover to experience more great coasters in one visit. You do feel embarassed when you are pushed ahead of other people.
I believe that this two tiered system the parks are setting up, if it continues, will result in the operators catching more grief from these people who have paid more money and will thus demand special treatment. I noted one time, during our visit, that the people using the passes gave the operators of the rides a hard time because they were not treated as royalty.
During my recent trip to Six Flags over Georgia (which was not mentioned in the article), I saw first hand the results of their advanced queue system. I personally believe that is a cheat to other park goers. I waited almost an hour to ride The Ninja just to get to the gate and watch a family of three come through the exit and get into the front car, the same car that me and my little brother was about to get onto. You could definantly hear the booing and hissing spread through out the waiting visitors, espically the people in the front-row line. What ever happened to the good ol' days of everybody waiting the same time to ride? If you have been to any Six Flags parks, you know the policy. If they close at eleven 'o clock and you are waiting in line to ride when the park closes, then you are guarenteed to ride (which I did for Batman: The Ride.) But if you can stand to be booed at and hissed at by a couple hundred coaster riders and still feel good about it, then you go ahead. I'll be one of the people booing at you!
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Heath Sneyd
Gray, TN
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Heath Sneyd
Gray, TN
robfb: I think you hit it on the head: We'd all like a system in theory, but the implementations has been, in most cases, fairly poor.
However, regarding capacity, the only way you have less than 100% capacity is if you have empty seats (a negligible impact) or mechanical down time. At parks like Cedar Point and Kings Island, it is rare that you see this on any major attraction. Disney's claim implies that their rides were 25% or more empty, and we all know that didn't happen. If that were true, you wouldn't need a virtual queue in the first place because there would be empty seats!
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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
However, regarding capacity, the only way you have less than 100% capacity is if you have empty seats (a negligible impact) or mechanical down time. At parks like Cedar Point and Kings Island, it is rare that you see this on any major attraction. Disney's claim implies that their rides were 25% or more empty, and we all know that didn't happen. If that were true, you wouldn't need a virtual queue in the first place because there would be empty seats!
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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
Jeffs right. It's just like Communism. In theory, its a great system, but when it comes to life, it makes the "government" money hungry and the "citizens" furious at the conditions.
Jeff: You are taking the statement out of context. It said that people that USED the FastPasses experience 25% more rides. That is COMPLETELY believeable as the less time you spend in line, the more time you can spend riding. The statement says NOTHING about guests that do NOT use FastPasses.
And furthermore, I dont think the "empty seat" factor is as negligible as you claim. Sure, the "FastPass attractions" are all pretty much filled all the time, hence the long waits. But what about the smaller rides? The ones many people pass over because they want to ride Space Mountain. A closer to (your) home example; how many times do Cedar Downs, Ocean Motion, and Calypso have walk on lines when Raptor is out on the midway?
Remember, the general mindset of people is to ride rides once (maybe twice) then move on to something else. If they have already done what they wanted via the fastpass (or the like) then they maybe willing to try other things, including those rides that get little business. Therefore, it is possible that the aggragate number of rides taken by actual patrons could increase.
jeremy
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"Nobody writes about the planes that land." Steve Salerno Washington Times 7-10-01
And furthermore, I dont think the "empty seat" factor is as negligible as you claim. Sure, the "FastPass attractions" are all pretty much filled all the time, hence the long waits. But what about the smaller rides? The ones many people pass over because they want to ride Space Mountain. A closer to (your) home example; how many times do Cedar Downs, Ocean Motion, and Calypso have walk on lines when Raptor is out on the midway?
Remember, the general mindset of people is to ride rides once (maybe twice) then move on to something else. If they have already done what they wanted via the fastpass (or the like) then they maybe willing to try other things, including those rides that get little business. Therefore, it is possible that the aggragate number of rides taken by actual patrons could increase.
jeremy
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"Nobody writes about the planes that land." Steve Salerno Washington Times 7-10-01
OK... so what if it is only people that actually use the system? In the end, that means they ride more at the expense of someone else. The net change for park capcity is still zero.
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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"
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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"
Personally, taking two kids, big enough to be on coasters, having to spend even more money once we get in there to ride seems wrong. Admission prices are pretty high as is, not to mention the three dollar sodas. Give us poor working folks a rest and quit thinking of ways to cost us more money.
Basically it's for people who have more money than patience and can't get up early for park opening and who can't plan a route through a theme park!
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