Virtual queue systems on trial

Whoops. What I meant to say was:

Volcano at PKD is working with a VQ. Hypersonic is supposed to be up soon.

Jeff, while it is true that the ride capacity for the park for the day is set in stone, many things like shops and shows and smaller rides are not at capacity for large parts of the day, if at all.

If I'm in line for a ride, and I want a drink or I want to go see a show, or I want to ride a flat ride that's empty, and then get back in line in my same place, VQing allows me to do that, and who does that hurt?

The problem occurs when I take my VQ pass and then get in line for a ride already at capacity. Then I'm just cutting.

A well run, well designed system could enable guests to do more things that they wouldn't have been able to do because they were standing on line, but a poorly designed, poorly run system results in legalized line cutting.

I think it can work if parks are willing to invest in a centralized system (like a card swiper) that will prevent people with VQ tickets from getting on line for things at capacity.

SFKK recently started a FastPass system (not exactly virtual queue, but still a system of letting people in front of me!). It's another one where you pay $5. I hate these things! It's impossible to judge how long your wait will be. You think you're getting close, and then... wait! Someone has a FastPass... let's let them go instead! It is very frustrating. Those little signs that say "a such and such wait from this point" do no good when countless amounts of people can just walk right on, extending your wait.

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We are the ones who wait in line for hours for a 45-second thrill, and consider it time well spent.

At SFAW FastPass is free!

You guys are missing the point of my statement, and taking it in directions that have nothing to do with it. Disney says that people are riding 25% more rides. I'm saying that's not possible. And I'm not talking about stores or shops or whatever. I'm only talking about rides.

Disney's FastPass system sounds to me like it works the best, and is most fair. Their parks are also ideal for the system because they have shows that seat hundreds of people at a time, where capacity isn't strictly an issue, per se.

And whoever mentioned that the systems were fair, if you choose to participate, is dead wrong. SFGAdv's system is just as bad as the short-lived Millennium Force "Ticket to Ride." If you get there late, you're screwed, and can't ride. As a season pass holder who frequently visits in the evenings, that locked me out.

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com

All of the Six Flags parks that are trying virtual queue systems are using different systems because they're trying to figure out if any of them works.

The answer, of course, is that no virtual queueing system is going to increase ride capacity, and all virtual queue systems will increase the waiting time for most riders unless all riders are in the virtual queue (as at Cedar Point last season with TTR). The problem with putting everybody in the virtual queue is that you simply replace a long line to get on board the ride with a long line to get your boarding time.

Virtual queueing has been tried and tried and tried in the past, and it has never worked. This time around it appears to work for some people because thanks to Disney it is now an option...but overall it does nothing to improve ride capacity or to get more people on the rides. Worse yet, because of the limited availability of ride tickets, it doesn't even help that much to spread the crowd through the park.

I still like my self-managed queue management system idea, where each queue entrance has a sign which gives not only the waiting time for that ride, but also for the other major rides in the park.....

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

When I was at Disney in January, we wanted to get a fast pass for Space Mountain, but they were all sold out. As we were waiting in line, I noticed that the regular line was moving so much faster than the other line, and we got on before the fast passers. BTW, the line was supposed to be 80 min, but it was really 15-20. I think that if you give out too many you end up with a problem.

they're not that bad...
i only used them at Disney but you have to go on a good day when it is not very crowded
also you have to go on the popular rides in the morning so you don't wait a long time later (when i went Autopia at 3:00 was giving out fastpasses for 10 and 11:00)

we went there on a Thursday and we were able to go on all the good rides by 2:00 (we only used fastpass on one)

oh yea theres also the idiot CMs who hold up the regular line for almost a minute even though there are no fastpass people coming *** This post was edited by Wackokid on 7/13/2001. ***

I like the systems at disney/universal because they are a part of your admission to get into the park. I think the system at six flags is a total rip-off and a cheap attempt to make more money. I was at six flags great america on 7-12-01 and the only ride that the pass would have been of good use would have been on v-2. Its just another example of six flags being a badly run company compared to the other major players!

The only system that I have used is the fastpass system. For me it worked real good. I stayed there and got to get into the park early got on the main ride at the park grabbed a fastpass for it and came back in a hour or two for a reride.
I think that most people's opinions on these systems is based on weather you use the systems or weather you don't.

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"Roller Coaster favorite ride , let me kiss you one last time" Blink 182

Well as it shows in your words of speech all of you guys our gals are very intelegent. Me being only 15 ive rode only like 30 coasters my whole life but back to the subject.

Living here in kentucky sucks all i have is Kentucky kingdom right down the street though. But with the poor quality of the rides Dang that airport its all there fault.

Here at six flags kk we have something called instant ride. When you buy a pass our go to the guest services and purchase a instant ride ticket. I think there 25 bucks and they last you all day you can go to any ride the exit of the ride and show your bracelet and get on no waiting and it pisses off the people in the lines its so funny well anyway theres my 2 cents.
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SIX FLAGS PLZ SELL KENTUCKY KINGDOM
I Love Coasters
www.theanimedome.net

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Is it just me, or is society as whole becoming less patient. I've noticed people standing in front of a microwave oven waiting for their dinner to cook, tapping their foot impatiently, as if it can't happen fast enough.

That seems to be what's going on here. Folks, you're going to an amusement park, where there will be thousands of other people there too. Gee, what a shock....there will be lines, and yes, you have to wait and take your turn. (Kindergarden 101 here)

The "fast pass" idea in any form to me is a bad idea. It gives the impression of "screw you, I don't want to wait any more." We currently have road rage; line rage will be next!

Jeff,
You started this off by saying "Disney says guests are riding 25% more. How is that possible with the same number of rides?" I agree with that, mostly. I was thinking that perhaps they mean the average family who would leave earlier if forced to wait in long lines. Obviously, us Coasterbuzzers would stay the whole time lines being long OR short, but not everyone is like that. Maybe people are staying longer since they don't have to spend all of the time that they are there stuffed into queue lines with other sweaty, tired individuals. Therefore, they are riding more by staying longer. Just a thought. :)
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We are the ones who wait in line for hours for a 45-second thrill, and consider it time well spent.

But the statement is still misleading, because it doesn't say that guests are staying longer or whatever. The park still has fixed operating hours, and therefore fixed capacity.

Dave's idea for a queue time board at major rides is one of the most simple and common sense ideas I can think of. At Cedar Point in particular this year. I've seen Raptor with an hour wait and Magnum with ten minutes. If you approached the Raptor line and saw the difference in wait times, wouldn't you go to Magnum?

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"

Ahh, that explains the one free Instant Ride ticket I got for SFKK in my season pass premium book. "Present this ticket at the exit of any ride and you and a friend can ride without waiting" Sort of a free sample of it.

While I don't mind FastPass and have benefited from it, the pay-extra arrangements of queue management bug me. I know they shouldn't, its like First Class vs. Coach on a plane, or Self Park vs. Valet Parking at the club, or even the Ritz-Carlton vs Motel 6. Our society teaches us that those who can afford the bigger price tags get the better experience.

The whole thing reeks of the patron who spends more cash gets shorter lines and more rides. Try explaining that to families that their $40 admission tickets aren't good enough you also need the $10, $25 add-on for the optimum experience.


Personally I like Fastpass so far Disney's version that is. FastPass is the only virtual queue system I have experienced, and it seems to work well there: Certainly I got more rides than I would have without it. Do you have to keep your day planner with you, yes, do you have to keep your watch handy, yes, do you sometimes have to run yourself ragged getting from one part of the park to another, yes, do you have to backtrack yes. But you do seem to get more rides.

P.S. Disney fastpass tip, you have an hour window, do not present yourself for your virtual ride rght at the start time, use this time to pick up Fastpasses for your next attraction. For one you will have alredy entered the virtual queue for the next FP attraction, and two when you get to your current destiantion the initial influx of guests whith the same FP time you did will already be cleared through.


At DisneyMGM -
I was able to watch the Beauty and the Beast show whil I virtually waited for RockNRollercoaster allowing me to expeirnce both attractions.
I was able to ride the Great Movie Ride, watch a little bit of the parade, while virtually waiting for Tower of Terror.
Even beeter I had a relative chicken out of Tower of Terror, so I used his Fastpass and got two back to back rides on it.
Then later on we took the movie studios tour while virtually waiting for Star Tours.
This was in July, peak season, and we saw everything except the Indy Jones Stunt Show. (And my family did that while I had my ToT double ride session)

At Disneyland:
I rode Space Mountain and Honey I Shrunk the Audience while virtually waiting for the Autopia
I rode the Autopia while virtually waiting for Star Tours.
I rode the Jungle Cruise and walked through Tarzan's treehouse while waiting for Big Thunder Mountain RR.
I rode Big Thunder Mountain and the Haunted Mansion while virtually waiting for Indiana Jones
I rode Indiana Jones, wlaked through sleeping beauty castle, went out to locker and got my coat, waled through the castle, saw ToonTown, rode Matterhorn Mountain while waiting for Splash Mountain
Rode Splash Mountain and saw the Country Bears while waiting for virtually waiting for another ride on Big Thunder Moutnain.

At DCA:
I was able to ride Soarin 4 times by using FP's while seeing the rest of the park. We even had dinner while waiting for one of the rides.



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David Bowers
Mayor, Coasterville

Parks need to make certain accommodations. They are after all the hosts and we pay good money. Visitors shouldn't have to wait too long to get food, or go to the bathroom or ride attractions they advertise. 3 hours is simply too long to wait for a three minute thrill. Ceder Point saw that for Millennium Force and did the responsible thing and had a virtual queue system. More parks need to pay attention to lines that get too long. The danger is that parks may get the idea that pay-for-placement is an okay thing to do. Nothing can ruin a park experience more then watching rich people cut in front of you all day long as your wait in lines doubles. People pay as much as $50 a day so they don't have to deal with the class system that exists outside the park walls. They pay for equal access to the rides. But parks are greedy, and they will try to implement a pay-for-placement policy if they feel it will be profitable. They need to know that their parks will become unpopular and even blacklisted if such pay-to-cut policies become a formalized. Thrill seekers need to be on top of this we are to nip this in the bud, for it will be bad for parks and visitors alike.

The fast pass has a benefit the parks aren't talking about. If you are not standing in a line, presumable you might be buying food, merchandise, playing games etc.

I would be interested to see if per-cap spending has seen a noticeable increase at parks where the fast pass is being implemented. Seems to me the parks would only pay for, research, and implement this technology if there was something in it for them.

These fastpass things are great!!! How could you not like them? I was just at disney, and have used Universals before. They are a great idea. You can do something else untill it's ur turn. I love it and think all parks should do them. These passes allow you to experience more at the park. GO FASTPASS!!!!

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Best Steel: MF @ Cedar Point
Best Woodie: The Beast @ PKI
Best Park: IOA!
Get to the Point, Cedar Point!

I did that it works really good

I was at PKD yesterday, Friday the 13th and Volcano had a "fast pass" system set up in plain view but it wasn't on. The wait was over an hour and Hypersonic's was 2 hrs. long. Flight of Fear(awesome!) had a 20 min wait and everything else was a walk on. spent very little time waiting in lines.

My first day at SFGAm was great. The fastline system is awesome on Raging Bull. 10 minute wait from when you hit the station for the front seat. Hey, I'm still here. Two more days of coasting!

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SFGAm Trip - July 13-17, 2001