Vekoma Flyers / Premier Spaghetti Bowls

I disagree. I've seen so much empty station time on X-Flight that they could easily run three, even with their small crews. If there's empty station time, it's time not spent loading a train. The problem there was that they allegedly cannibalized the third.

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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com - Sillynonsense.com
"Climbing as we fall, we dare to hold on to our fate, and steal away our destiny to catch ourselves with quiet grace" - The Stairs, INXS

A correction on the Premier coasters...

The two Flight of Fear coasters were in fact designed to run four trains, with the blocks set up as follows (identifications mine):
a) Load station to end of launch track brakes
b) End of launch track to mid-course block brake
c) Mid-course block brake to transfer table
d) Unload station
e) Tunnel between stations
That's five blocks, which, according to strict blocking theory is enough to run four trains. Trouble is, first of all, Paramount Parks has standardized on a more conservative blocking scheme which effectively limits the coaster to only three trains. Second, the timing is such that in the time required for the train to complete block (b), a train can roll into the station, but that's about as far as it can get. It takes too long to load to get that train out by the time the train ahead clears (c); running four trains would mean always stopping on the transfer table and frequently stopping on the mid-course. So four trains really doesn't seem to be practical.

The later 'spaghetti bowl' coasters lack the mid-course brake, meaning that blocks (b) and (c) are effectively combined, leaving the ride with only four blocks. Add to that the fact that (a) is so short compared to (b-c), not to mention that the brakes at the end of the launch track are not the best place to stop a train, and you can see that while three trains would be theoretically possible, practical considerations really limit those rides to two.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

On Whizzer at sfgam, it used to hold 6 trains but now only runs 2...

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Surfs up in Hollister, CA! Later Dudes...

I could swear that when I rode Whizzer it was running three.......

--Dave Althoff, Jr (gotta check those notes again)

Actually Dave, FOF has 6 blocks, however blocks 3 and 4 can only hold one train total.

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So you believe that you are studying us, then kindly explain why you are the ones trapped in your seats.

Hollister, Whizzer maximum number of trains is five. They ran five when it first opened but now it is set up to run three trains.

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Mike
Favorite Wood: Viper at SFGAM,Shivering Timbers
Favorie Steel: Magnum and Raging Bull

When I first rode FOF at PKI, I thought they had 4 or 5 running because it had been broken down for a few minutes, and empty trains kept coming in. Boy, did I feel stupid when I overheard people saying "they unload on the other side." I must give credit to PKI for a great theme job, the whole "trains coming back empty" thing is so cool...

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87 different coasters for this year and counting... 149 total!

MG87, Disney beat them to the punch long before FoF with Space Mountain.
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Dude, you're getting an Intamin!

True, but I was only 10 when I rode Space Mountain, and I was 15 when I rode FoF. Yeah, I'm one of those "pathetic" teens who only wreac havok on this board. ;-)

Man, I hate stereotyping...

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87 different coasters for this year and counting... 149 total!

RideMan said:
I could swear that when I rode Whizzer it was running three.......

I saw it run three a couple times this summer, if I'm not mistaken.

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'I don't want to grow up, there's too much contradiction.' - Television 'Friction'

Marimba87, don't be so hard on yourself. I wasn't trying to be mean.
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Dude, you're getting an Intamin!

Don't worry Intamin Fan, I didn't take your post as mean. I was just saying that yes I'm 15, but I'm not trying to be like some of my "fellow teens" who only make trouble.

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87 different coasters for this year and counting... 149 total!

There is another reason why i think B&M is so much better than Vekoma. Air (and probably Superman too) runs 3 trains fine, and it's blocks are set up no differently to X-Flight's.

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This Season:
Flights on Air: 8 - Escapes From Nemesis: 9
Drops into Oblivion: 3 - Spins On Maelstrom: 2
Drops on Apocalypse, Sit-Down: 1, Stand-Up: 1, Stand-Up Floorless: 5 - Survival on Shockwave: 1

The reason for Batwing/X-Flight not running all three trains is due more to SF's choosing to run at reduced capacity than the rides not being designed to use all three trains.

If SFA & SFWOA would ever decide for once to use all three trains instead of using at most two then I'm sure that both coasters would be capable of running that way,it would certainly help to keep the wait times down that's for sure.

Actually, to blame two train op on the flyers on the Six Flags chain is a little misguided. The majority of the problems lie within the complexity of the trains. I don't know if anyone remembers, but Vekoma spent the majority of the 2001 season at SFWoA trying to make X-Flight work right, and as far as I know, they STILL haven't received payment for it...it doesn't do what it's supposed to do.

The thrid train DOES exist, but, through sheer crappiness of ride design, had to be cannabalized in order to keep the other 2 trains working, which, normally, one of them breaks anyway. The ride has so many faults and problems that keeping it in operation is akin to a circus.

I know it's the park's aim to get three operating, but it's difficult to do when they have the plethora of problems they do keeping the ride in operating condition.

Vekoma sucks. Period.

I heard about the problems that X-Flight has had (havn't we all) & yes they've had to cannibalize tyrain # 3 for spare parts but so far SFA hasn't really had that problem with Batwings trains.

They have used all three trains,just at different times & of course not all three at the same time,in some instances it's train #1 in station # 1,train # 2 in station #2 not operating & train # 3 on the storage track,other instances have been train #1 in station # 1,train #3 in station # 2 operating & train #2 on the storage track.

So basically all three trains on Batwing have been for the most part in operational condition in 2002 it's just that the park isn't able to operate all three at once while using both stations for whatever reason,as for SFWOA who knows when or if they'll ever get all three trains on X-Flight operational,perhaps on both Batwing & X-Flight the respective parks can make in effort to do so in 2003.