Tough Pay and Work at CP for 2010?

I give thanks to employees like LK and Hopman, for making my days at CP better. :) I have total respect for anyone working with the public, whether it is at a park, the local grocery store, a drive-thru, etc.

I agree that happy employees make happy customers, and vice versa. If anyone at CP was disgruntled I never saw it. I guess they did a great job of hiding it. :) I have been to parks where it was taken out on the customers, and that's never a good thing. I have been to parks where customers took out their (mostly trivial) frustrations out on the employees, and that's not cool either.

I believe if you don't like the job then you should quit, but if you can't quit (like most of us can't) then you should make the best of it, no matter what job it is. On the other hand I can understand how difficult it can be to keep up your morale if your employer treats their employees like s***.

As far as these "rumors" I hope they aren't true. Making a CP employee pay for ANYTHING is just wrong in my opinion. They work an insane amount of hours, busting their asses to make our days pleasant. They shouldn't pay for parking or admission, even if it is half-price. That's an insult. I assume most seasonal employees are college students, who usually don't have much of a disposable income to begin with.

I also give thanks to anyone who has to work today, especially if they are in retail. I can't understand why someone would want to go to ToysRUs on a Thanksgiving Day, but that's just me. They should be home with their families!

I am thankful I have a job where I don't have to work holidays or weekends, and I don't take that feeling for granted nowadays!

And please remember to give thanks to all the servicemen/women, especially the ones who can't be home with their loved ones this weekend. If it wasn't for them we wouldn't have the freedom to go to amusement parks to begin with. Luckily my brother got to come home for a few weeks from Iraq, so trust me, we are VERY thankful for everything!

Happy Thanksgiving everyone! And the next time you are at a park (or anywhere where someone gives you great service) thank the employees and pay them compliments. It will make their days, trust me. :) I am not shy about doing that. :)

-Tina

Lord Gonchar said:
Where does 'bitching employee' end and 'constructive suggestions' begin?

When the people who have the power to change the way things are done at Cedar Point read mine and others "bitching and whining", they should look at it as a passionate complaint.

I kid because I love.

How very tactful you are, Gonch. I complain about things because I love too. I care about the experience of future Cedar point employees.

(Sorry for the double post, but Tina sneaked in her post while I was compiling mine)

I believe if you don't like the job then you should quit, but if you can't quit (like most of us can't) then you should make the best of it,no matter what job it is. On the other hand I can understand how difficult it can be to keep up your morale if your employer treats their employees like s***.

I wish I had wrote that. I love your attitude, in fact, your entire post is exactly how I feel. I wish I had the same moxie as you do.

Lord Gonchar said:

And yes, Happy Thanksgiving, gang. This place wouldn't be the same without any of you. :) :)

You feeling ok Gonch???

LostKause said:

When the people who have the power to change the way things are done at Cedar Point read mine and others "bitching and whining", they should look at it as a passionate complaint.

See, I have to admit I never even expected a response like that. My mind just doesn't think that way.

"The difference between an employee whining and and employee offering a suggestion is determined by the people with the power at Cedar Point."

That's so far from what seems reasonable and logical to me that I'm not even sure how to respond.

Sounds a lot like, "Because someone else is always the problem..."

They've run that park and company for years and years and years, but it's you, someone who's worked a few seasons at the bottom of the ladder, who has it figured out? Right?

There's a difference between not liking things about your job and being treated like crap. I don't think anything you've talked about crosses that line.

Funny that you quoted (and liked) Tina's comment because she's essentially telling you the same thing Carrie did way back in this thread - If you don't like it, quit. If you don't quit, shut up and do your best. Don't complain and bitch and whine and focus on the one or two things you happen to dislike about it and turn into a burden.

And I think that's what it comes down to. Unfortunately, we'll never agree on where that line is and when it gets crossed.

ridemcoaster said:
You feeling ok Gonch???

Gonch is full of nothing but love. (and crap on occassion :) )

Seriously, I think everyone understands the difference between spirited debate and anger & resentment. I don't think anyone around here ever crosses that line.

I thoroughly enjoy the discussions and it wouldn't be the same without any of the regulars.

Awwww Gonch... I wuv u (and even Carrie sometimes) too :).

Oh, and before anyone asks the all important "what are you losers doing online on Thanksgiving?" question, I'm killing time in between basting and checking temps on the bird. :)

LostKause said:

An you think that I am the one with a problem?...

You see, the people who make up the rules will never know that something is wrong, or inconvenient about the job, unless people complain. Complaining should be welcome in any situation, as long as it is constructive. It can help Cedar Point to move forward as an employer....

I'm more of a rebel who questions authority, and you are not. That's not a bad thing. It takes all types....

Happy Thanksgiving. I am thankful for CoasterBuzz and for all of you, even Gonch and Carrie.

Even if I could believe (and I don't) that all of your complaints (and your remarks toward me) are actually altruistic attempts at making the world a better place, you need to realize that you bear a responsibility for how you communicate and when and to whom.

When the people who have the power to change the way things are done at Cedar Point read mine and others "bitching and whining", they should look at it as a passionate complaint.

See, it just doesn't work that way. People don't hear things the way you want them to simply because you say they should. Most real change-makers are rarely perceived as complainers. In fact, the very fact that some folks hear you as complaining should be the clue you need to know that what you offer is not constructive.... at the very least, needs to be shaped in a different way.

Gonch said:
Funny that you quoted (and liked) Tina's comment because she's essentially telling you the same thing Carrie did way back in this thread - If you don't like it, quit. If you don't quit, shut up and do your best. Don't complain and bitch and whine and focus on the one or two things you happen to dislike about it and turn into a burden.

Exactly. Perhaps there's some truth to the fact that how you present something has a bearing on how it's received. And in fairness, I was being direct about what I think, while Tina was likely being constructive. :)

Raven-Phile said:
Awwww Gonch... I wuv u (and even Carrie sometimes) too :).

Wow, I got another "even Carrie" comment. One more and I can finally get that "How to Win Friends and Influence People" book I've been saving for. :)

What an opportune moment for me to pop in and wish everybody a happy Thanksgiving....even Gonch. And especially Carrie! :)

-- Mike, bringing balance back to the Force.

Thanks, Mike! :) Happy Thanksgiving to you, too!

Weeeee.. The wealth of double posts.. I love it..

I will join the bandwagon. I luv all of yaz.. Happy Thanksgiving..

Maybe I'm missing something here, but for the "If you don't like it, quit" crowd...

...didn't LK do just that? I thought he had left long ago but maybe I'm mistaken. Even if he hasn't, rest assured there are plenty of people who start hourly jobs at parks and don't last long, not because they couldn't cut it, but because they knew they could make more with less stress and effort at their local Dunkin Donuts. I mean I'll admit that I've only browsed the thread since my last post, but working a typical hourly job at Cedar Point, or most parks, is going to be a horrible job by the standards of many, many people. I don't really get deriding them for that, or for complaining about that is the way to go, in fact just the opposite.

Part of it is just the nature of the work, but it can also be exacerbated by ridiculous operating procedures that don't do the hourly's any favors. I don't think that makes you a "lightweight," I think that makes you someone who shouldn't be working at Cedar Point. A clever enough guy like LK is one of those.

Another piece of this pie is that whether or not you think CP treats workers well or not...they don't really have incentive to change. Turnover rates are going to be huge no matter how well they treat folks, so they don't really gain anything from coddling. That in turn leads to what a lot of people are going to see as a lame work environment. Again, I don't see the connection between that and being a lightweight.

As a side note...I'll also question the idea that every job is "hard." I consider myself a pretty lazy person by nature, and I currently do pretty well for a guy in his mid-20's between teaching and studying. And compared to doing repetitive work in the sun 60+ hours a week and cleaning up vomit-filled garbage barrels for awful pay, it's pretty darn easy. At the very least some jobs might be "hard" but if you enjoy them it makes up for it. Hourly work at a park is "hard" but enjoying that sort of thing is a pretty rare breed. More power to them but you just can't expect it of many people.

My comment about quitting a job that one is unsatisfied with was not directed at LostKause, specifically.

The point is that we all have choices to make in life. Choosing to quit a job that one finds to be unfavorable is about the only right we have in the work environment, except obviously those which are deemed to be minimum standards by law. Perhaps these complaints should be taken to the legislators instead. I don't know.

Complaining about the expectations an employer has about picking up a paycheck and about one's inability to get to work on time in a clean uniform, makes you a lightweight. I stand by that.

Are there other aspects to the work at CP that are unfavorable? Absolutely. But the ones that sparked my response do not qualify. We can simply disagree about that.

My point remains the same. People get to choose to work at CP or not. That someone made the determination that the job wasn't for them and quit, more power to them. Then it becomes time to move on.

Complaining about it for years on an enthusiast board serves no one. Especially since, as you point out matt., there are still plenty of people who are willing to work there (and even enjoy doing so) with whatever standards CP provides. As long as that is the case, there is no incentive to change.

It's the same old tired supply and demand discussion.

matt. said:
As a side note...I'll also question the idea that every job is "hard." I consider myself a pretty lazy person by nature, and I currently do pretty well for a guy in his mid-20's between teaching and studying. And compared to doing repetitive work in the sun 60+ hours a week and cleaning up vomit-filled garbage barrels for awful pay, it's pretty darn easy.

If you grade on the curve, sure. But are you telling me your teaching requires no effort or doesn't push you in any way? That it's never difficult or there's nothing you'd change if you could?

Because if you do, I'm calling you a liar. :)

Carrie M. said:
Complaining about the expectations an employer has about picking up a paycheck and about one's inability to get to work on time in a clean uniform, makes you a lightweight. I stand by that.

And I'll second it.

Raven-Phile said:
Oh, and before anyone asks the all important "what are you losers doing online on Thanksgiving?" question, I'm killing time in between basting and checking temps on the bird. :)

I'm here because I lack the ability to love and am spending the holiday alone...

...in the dark...

...without heat.

Carrie M. said:

Complaining about it for years on an enthusiast board serves no one.

This is quite presumptuous. I personally encountered quite a few ridiculous policies and procedures when I was a hourly, seasonal worker at a park, and don't mind hearing the war stories of others.

You can take it as whining, or whatever, but that doesn't mean it's not applicable to discussion, or that other people don't want to hear it.

Thanks matt.

Carrie said:

Complainingabout the expectations an employer has about picking up a paycheck andabout one's inability to get to work on time in a clean uniform, makesyou a lightweight. I stand by that.

Gonch said:

And I'll second it.

You never worked at Cedar Point, so I can understand why it would be so hard for you to grasp. Calling me out for it really isn't fair, because you really don't know what you are talking about. Cedar Point is not like any other seasonal job.

If new employees knew what to expect, it may help them to cope. Some of the reasons it is different?

Many people move there, away from home, which costs time and money. If, once they are there, they decide that working at Cedar Point is not right for them, going home is more difficult than with a lot of other jobs. This especially is difficult for the foreign workers, who have to pay for their own air travel to and from the U.S.

Another point about quitting your job before your contract is over, is that management may use the accumulated bonus against employees. It is well known among past employees that management would fire people for minor reasons toward the end of the season just to save from having to pay them bonuses. Many employees are very nervous towards the end of the season that they will be one of those who will lose their jobs before they finish their contract.

Once employees get to the park, they have to room with others, sometimes strangers. Not all of their roommates are guaranteed to be trustworthy, to keep their hands off of other people's stuff, or to keep quiet during sex with their friends while you are trying to sleep (this is especially annoying if you are sharing a bunk bed with the sexing couple). I don't have any ideas of a solution for this problem.

They have to use a public restroom all summer. Thankfully, showers have a little privacy, until the shower curtains disappear sometime near the middle of summer. It has happened every year that I have been there, '99, 00, and '06.

If they are riding the bus to work, sometimes the bus is full, and they may have to wait for it to come back around, which can make them late for work. If they are driving to work, during the busy months it will take them 30 minutes, more or less, to get to get to the parking gate, which could make them late for work. Being late for work is a write-up, no matter the reason.

Many work locations are more than 5 minutes from either of the two employee eating facilities, so a fifteen minute break requires 10 minutes of walking, 4 minutes of ordering food, and 60 seconds of eating it. On a positive note, one solution for this problem is to "stack" your breaks, which simply means adding them together to get a longer break, however, some managers or TL's will not allow this practice.

From what I have seen, most food service employees do not even get a break unless the park is empty. It is well known that they will pick at the food that they are cooking for guests and other employees. Another words, it a food service employee is hungry, and is only in the middle of their 14 hour shift, they may decide to pick a few fries out from under the heat lamp and pop it in their mouth while they are preparing other people's food. I believe that this breaks a few laws, but it is a normal occurrence.

There are no sick days at Cedar Point...If an employee is sick, and they don't think that they can work their shift, they are required to go to the first aid station. This usually results in getting some meds like pain reliever and cough syrup, so they can make employees go to work whether they feel like it or not.

In my experience, they don't care about the employees or their health...One of many personal examples is that the employee cafeteria had vats of mustard, catchup, or mayonnaise during one of the seasons that I worked at the park. Sneeze guards were not installed over the vats, and they sat there open, with a plastic disposable spoon in each vat provided. It was not uncommon to see hair or debris in the condiments. When I asked the manager if they could provide either a sneeze guard, a dispenser, or packets of condiments, he got very angry and smart with me. "This isn't Wendy's, we don't have to make our customers happy!" is one thing that he shouted at me. I remained pretty nice throughout the whole discussion (well, for him it was an argument). This proves that the employees are not cared about the same way that the guest are.

In my experience, CP Police are sometimes bigots...A Cedar Point Police Officer once said to me and my friend as we were exiting an employee gate, "You ladies have a good night." We were the only ones there, and he looked right at us when he said it, and his voice was very sarcastic. I definitely do not look like a lady, so I complained to the supervisor, in which his reply was to question if I was gay or not. When I reluctantly admitted to him that I was, he said, "Well that's probably why he said that then".

...Tip of the iceberg, by the way. I am trying to help Carrie and Gonch to understand, then maybe they can add more to the discussion than, "You are a lightweight".

Now if anyone reads this who is thinking about a Cedar Point job, maybe they will know more what to expect. Don't be scared away though. There is some good to the job, which will probably even out the bad. I could include those in the discussion, but that isn't something that new employees need to be prepared for.

Let me remind everyone, again, that I worked there for three seasons, so I liked the job. The first season was difficult because I didn't expect to have to deal with the inconveniences. I was employed and worked way before I got the job at Cedar Point, so I wasn't afraid of working.

The second and third seasons, I knew what to expect. It wasn't a bad place to work once one understood that the ark really didn't care about their employees, and that their would be hundreds of daily inconveniences to deal with.

Maybe the imaginary book that I mentioned, which wouldn't be anything like my posts here, should be called "An Idiot's guide to surviving working at Cedar Point." That would more show the constructive nature of the book.

You guys rock!

Peace. :)

matt. said:

This is quite presumptuous. I personally encountered quite a few ridiculous policies and procedure when I was a hourly, seasonal worker at a park, and don't mind hearing the war stories of others.

You are absolutely correct, matt. I wasn't meaning to discount the entertainment value or commiseration of these stories. I was referring to LK's stance that his purpose for complaining on this board is meant to effect change in CP.

LostKause said:

You never worked at Cedar Point, so I can understand why it would be so hard for you to grasp. Calling me out for it really isn't fair, because you really don't know what you are talking about. Cedar Point is not like any other seasonal job....

...Tip of the iceberg, by the way. I am trying to help Carrie and Gonch to understand, then maybe they can add more to the discussion than, "You are a lightweight".

It is not hard for me to grasp what you said were your complaints on page one. Again, that's what sparked my response and I stand by it.

What is hard for you to grasp about this?:

I said:

Are there other aspects to the work at CP that are unfavorable? Absolutely. But the ones that sparked my response do not qualify. We can simply disagree about that.