Snapping the Flyers

Monday, May 10, 2004 10:54 AM
I was a Knoebel's this weekend and trying to work the very snappable flyers. I had a couple of runs that were godly, but a couple of pretty lame runs. Any tips on how to snap?

I can't figure out what causes the snap. Should I be trying to be perpendicular to the direction of motion in the trough? Should I be trying to fly backwards and forwards as much as possible? Does weight shifting help at all? How do you adapt for different wind conditions?

I usually try to hold the rudder out at the bottom, straighten it to fly out and forward and just as I'm starting to turn in, I jerk the rudder in for a quick downswing, but only hold the down for a few seconds. Once I'm in the trough, right before I'm about to bounce, I hold the rudder out and go... As mentioned, sometimes this works great, sometimes it just fails.

Monday, May 10, 2004 10:57 AM
Andy - to be honest everyone has their own technique and rhythm. The only thing I can tell you is that you want to get your tub to "stall" as close to the center of rotation as possible.
Monday, May 10, 2004 2:51 PM
Or go nuts and hope for the best. Or a strong wind in your favor. ;)
Monday, May 10, 2004 3:56 PM
its awsome snapping them. i do it all the time.
Monday, May 10, 2004 4:04 PM
I always sit on the outside of the tub (away from the door). To me anyway, I think some tubs are better than others for snapping.

As for technique I just think it's somthing you need to just experiment with until you find your groove.

I can always tell when I'm going to get an insane snap a few seconds before it happens. When I'm at the highest point and my tub basicly does a nose dive to the ground I know it's going to be nuts!

I know I had a good day on the Flyers when I have a sore lower back for the next 2 or 3 days later. *** Edited 5/10/2004 8:09:18 PM UTC by coasterpunk***

Monday, May 10, 2004 4:16 PM
I get this question alot. There is no real way to teach snapping unless your in the tub with the person. Also, as Moosh said, everybody has there on flavor. Some people like to get higher in the wind, others like to snap them down towards the ground.

If you want a nice show, go straight to the Flyers at PKI after the ropes drop.

Monday, May 10, 2004 4:27 PM
Could someone explain what "snapping" the Flyers is? :)
Monday, May 10, 2004 4:31 PM
When you stall your tub near the center of rotation one of the cables attached to the tub becomes slightly slack. When your tub catches back up with the rotation of the ride the cable "snaps" back into tension.

Perhaps this should be in some sort of FAQ? I think I've answered this questions about three dozen times in the past two weeks!


Monday, May 10, 2004 4:53 PM
My name is David and I am a Flyer Fantic. :)

That said, I would have to go with Moosh, I think teaching snapping via classroom, text, or lecture is not possible. You need OTRT (On the ride training). I mean two weeks ago I was having insane Flyer rides at PKI, but don't ask how I did it. It's not that I am unwilling to share, its just that I can't put it into words.

I mean the ride starts, and my Flyer instincts kick in, and my mind shuts off.

But since you asked. You can't do anything until the ride kicks into high gear. The slow warm-up period though is useful in making sure you have the rudder postioned correctly to rise. (I beleive moving the rudder handle to the inside makes the tub rise, but I cound't swear to that)

Anywho, once the ride gets going, when you feel your tub start to take off, thats wen you violently move the rudder to the outside. You shoudl twist and dive. Note that it will be very gentle at first, don't get discouraged, you have to get momentum built up.

After you get momentum, when you think your flight is about at its peak, turn the rudder in (handle to the outside), and you twist and dive. Don't move then handle again till either you snap or stall out at the bottom (sometimes without snapping you just sort of settle to the bottom), then move the rudder out (handle in) to ride again. Once I have a snap, I usually rise, count to 3 in my head, and move the rudder in, dive, snap, move the rudder out, count to 3, move in, snap, until the ride ends.

Can't guarantee this workes for you, but at least I THINK thats what I am doing.

(Note if the ride turns at 8RPM (typical), counting to 3 should give you just under half a revolution, giving time for the dive, you will find you will develop two favorite dive spots you always tend to hit. At PKI my two spots seem to be right in front of the queue, and just past the exit gate. Although last time I was there I was hitting just before the operator shack, and before the exit. so who knows)

Important: If you feel like the world has stopped, all has gone quiet, and you feel like you are just floating, lean forward getting your back off the seat back. It's gonna be a hard hit.

Monday, May 10, 2004 5:06 PM
"Important: If you feel like the world has stopped, all has gone quiet, and you feel like you are just floating, lean forward getting your back off the seat back. It's gonna be a hard hit." true!

I'm reminded of the very first time I [accidentally] snapped a flyer tub, at PKI in 1983. I was 17 and riding with my cousin Chris, who was probably 10 at the time. Scared the living crap outta us ;)

*** Edited 5/10/2004 9:10:04 PM UTC by Mamoosh***

Monday, May 10, 2004 5:26 PM
I'll be happy to give anyone lessons on the Flyers at Knoebels. :)

My rates are:

$29 for an all day lesson with coaster breaks from time to time.

$15.50 for Sundown lessons with coaster breaks.

$6.50 every Wendsday and Friday from 6 till 10 with no coaster breaks!

Just drop me an email! :)

Actually if anyone is planning to visit Knoebels just let me know and I'll be there!

Monday, May 10, 2004 5:28 PM
So you live near Knoebels, eh? BITHC!!! ;)
Monday, May 10, 2004 5:28 PM
You are riding on a pendulum.

Gravity controls the pendulum. It controls where it goes, it controls how fast it goes there. The path of the pendulum is defined by the suspension ropes.

Wind can be used to drive the pendulum. That's what the big sail on the front of the aircraft is for. Point it out, and an outward force is applied to the aircraft. Point it in, and an inward force is applied.

Initially, you want to apply these forces in phase with the natural oscillation of the pendulum, in order to maximize the amplitude of oscillation. That is, when the tub is swinging out, steer it out; when it is swinging in, steer it in.

Once you reach full amplitude, just *before* the tub gets to its highest point, turn the sail inward. This will drive it downward, while gravity is still saying, "It's not time to do that yet." What you're doing is using the wind to steer the tub inward. But because you can't steer it downward, it goes into a freefall condition. Gravity is pulling it down, but you are moving inward, removing the tension from the suspension ropes. You can only go so far, though, before you literally run out of wind. At that point your inward translation will stop, and the ride center will try to catch up.

At this point, if you turn the sail outward, you will be able to blow the tub outward, taking the slack out of the ropes, and it won't snap. Instead, keep steering inward, even though nothing seems to be happening. Nothing happening is exactly what you are looking for, because as you just sort of hang there, the center keeps rotating, and as it does, it will take the slack out of the front suspension rope. It will jerk, loading the end of the sweep. The sweep will absorb this shock, then unload by springing upward, shooting your tub skyward again.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

Monday, May 10, 2004 5:33 PM
Moosh, I can be at Knoebels in 20 minutes or less. Thats even quicker than you can order a pizza!

I think from my house to Knoebels is like 12 or 13 miles!

Monday, May 10, 2004 5:37 PM
Worked on Thunderhead, lives near Knoebels. You really know how to get on a man's good side, don'cha? ;)
Monday, May 10, 2004 5:41 PM
Did I mention I worked on the hydraulic building for Storm Runner about a week back in November) and the footers for the Claw the year before too? :)
Monday, May 10, 2004 5:50 PM
Monday, May 10, 2004 5:58 PM
At least you live in LA where it's sunny most of the time (when the smog burns off) and that LOOOOONG open season.

Winters suck here Moosh, especially when you want to go outside and need to wear layers and layers of clothes to stay warm.

I don't think I'd trade the Flyers for warmer winters though, Moosh!

Monday, May 10, 2004 6:02 PM
Would you trade them for hot babes in bikinis in the winter?
Monday, May 10, 2004 6:05 PM
Any chance of an agreement for visiting rights?

2 weeks on 2 weeks off? :)


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