SFI 2005 webcast additions

There are 13 out of 18 domestic parks (in the US) getting something new in 2005. Plus the two parks in Mexico and Canada making a total of 15 parks getting something new in 2005. The key is "domestic parks" which means the 13 parks must be inside the United States, not counting Mexico and Canada.

There were only 13 parks mentioned in the conference call. SFGAm., SFGAdv., SFMW, SFSL, SFA, SFNE, SFOG, SFKK, SFEG, GE and EV (the 11 domestic parks) plus SFM and La Ronde which make 13 out of 15 parks.

That means that two out of the following parks will also get something new:

SFOT, SFMM, SFFT (all are getting new shows in 2005, probably not any new rides)

-so that leaves-

SFAW, SFNO, SFDL and FC as the possibilites for a new ride/attraction in 2005.

All I can say to BATWING FAN SFA and CrazyB is...

BATWING FAN SFA, if you don't like the way things are going at SFA, the solution is easy...just don't go! You should feel lucky if you live in the Baltimore/Washington area that there are at least 6 major parks (SFGAdv, HP, DP, SFA, BGW, PKD) and countless smaller parks within a days drive of the area. Usually at least two out of those six parks will get something major every year. In 2005 ALL of those parks are getting something. Personally, until SFA grows into a major park where they get rides as often as SFGAdv (that's IF that ever happens), I'm personally satisfied because I know at least one of my local parks will have something new worth going to each and every year. However, I go to SFA dispite whether they get things every year. Why? Because the season passes are dirt cheap, the park is 15 minutes from my dorm, and Superman and Wild One are some of the best coasters in the area, if not the country. Besides that, since 1999, we've recieved 5 new major coasters. So that's 5 new coasters over 6 seasons (7 if you count 2005). Even Cedar Point doesn't have a record that good.

CrazyB if you don't like the way things are going at SFNO, would you rather if SF had not bought the park in the first place? Would you really prefer if Batman was gone? Are you really willing to take away all that themeing/landscaping and shadeing? I mean, if SF hadn't bought the park, it probably would have went belly up and there would be a mall being built on it's place or something by now. As for the coaster record there, the park opened in 2000, since then they've recieved a total of 5 major coasters. So that's 5 major coasters over 5 seasons...an average of one a year...not to mention the park already has a B&M, an S&S Freefall, a Salley Dark Ride, and countless unique flats...things MANY parks would love to have (personally I'd love to see any of those things I just listed at SFA).

Just chill out. Even Cedar Fair has it's parks that don't get as much as Cedar Point. Have you seen the construction record over the last few years at Worlds of Fun or Valleyfair? Ya, it's pretty shabby in comparison to Cedar Point of Knotts. Sometimes lower tier parks just have to take a back seat while the company boosts overall attendance by improving the major parks.

CrazyB,

So, how does it feel to be accused of doing something you have no involvement in?

Maybe you should read this article (dated June 1, 2004). The article quotes a Six Flags spokesperson as saying that water park plans are in developement though there are no details on the scope or timeline for development.

http://bizneworleans.com/70+M53dc2ad122a.html

An according to the article in Amusement Business, it sounds like there was more opposition to the park than just Six Flags including politicians and businesses.

http://www.amusementbusiness.com/amusementbusiness/industrynews/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1000602268

And from what I'm reading in this article, alot of state and federal economic deveopment money has been poured into saving Jazzland/SFNO. You can't fault government or Six Flags for wanting to protect their investment. Last check, more than $25 mil was invested to turn Jazzland into Six Flags New Orleans. Not to mention, SuperDome Commission's own lawyers said the Zephyrs hadn't met the conditions the SuperDome Commission had set back in April. Which inlcluded creating more parking revenue, show a signed lease with the developer and proof of financing.

Let me add, the Zephyrs had the option of starting the Superdome Commission approval process whenever it has its lease, financing and issues with Jefferson Parish resolved.

http://www.nola.com/business/t-p/index.ssf?/base/money-0/1091784563316110.xml

Honestly CrazyB, I don't think you have any idea of what the issue is. Your making this out to be a big conspiracy against the owners of Zephyrs Baseball. When in fact, they didn't met the deadlines they were given to begin with. If the residents of the parish/county have a problem with the way their local leaders conduct business, then they can vote to kick them out of office. *** Edited 11/10/2004 8:31:42 PM UTC by coasterguts***

Yes, but SFGAdv doesn't need all those coasters. They were set with Nitro. SUF belongs elsewhere. Kingda Ka and the Golden Kingdom are capital funds that belong at parks that need coaster much, much more. SFDL hasn't seen a new coaster since 1999. SFFT got their latest in 2000. SFGAdv has gotten one in 1999, 2001, 2003, and now 2005. Who are they even up against? Small boardwalk parks? Dorney? SFGAdv doesn't need anything new. They act like there is some other massive theme park nearby that threatens their existence. SFWOA could have stayed a Six Flags park had Six Flags actually given them a coaster collection that could at least take a stab at nearby CP. An unreliable Vekoma flyer, an SLC, and a boomerang hardly put up a fight. I'm sorry, and forgive me for saying this, but that solidified Six Flags' position as the worst-run chain in the world. To have seen such ignorance makes me wince. I can't believe how foolish they were for thinking SFWOA could fight CP on a bunch of production models and no hyper. They time and time again give rides to the wrong parks. Let's start taking bets on which park will go next. With Kingda Ka boosting the already ridiculously high attendance rates at a market-monopolizing park, several other parks will suffer attendance drops. SF should expect an overall drop again. SFMM seems to be going by the wayside. Sooner or later, people aren't going to feel like going to the smaller SF parks near them because there isn't anything new. Wow. Ultra Twister, Batman-The Escape, and XLR-8 got new colors. I didn't want to go to SFAW, but I do now! What do they think paint jobs are gonna do. I'm glad to hear that SFAW is doing alright, but I question how much longer SFI plans on keeping some of its parks with such few improvements.

Coasterguts, Honestly I don't want to get into a pissing contest..Jazzland /Six Flags have said the waterpark plans were in the final stages and had been for some time prior to the Buyout. The Zephyrs Org, went to the Superdome meeting to ask for an extension to complete their work when SFNO and several members of the City Council and the Economic Development Board of N.O of which the GM of SFNO is a Member marched across the street from the City Council Meeting to file a complaint with them. The N.O city council is elected by Orleans Parish residents. Believe me Jefferson Parish residents have no voting rights in Orleans parish nor do they want to. The Superdome Commision has already commented that if Zephyrland would re instate their plans they would now be looked at differently along with Jefferson Parish and as of lately they are in the process of doing just that. If the Superdome Commission would not be the Leasee for that land the Park would probably now be being built..Its a twisted issue down here. Superdome Commision representing the State being operated out of Orleans parish sub leasing the land to the Zephyrs owned by Jefferson parish. This as you aware of has pitted Orleans Parish against Jefferson Parish. This incident only throws more Gasoline on the fire ..Like I have always said I love SF parks its just the way SFNO has used its influence to cripple an already struggling economic area in Jefferson Parish..

And what compitition does SFDL have? SFFT's compitition is other SF parks. Why does SFGAdv get stuff when SFDL does not? SFGAdv has about 10 times the number of people within 100 miles of the park than SFDL has. Therefore, chances are you'll see a much larger return in investment than you would see placeing the same ride at SFDL. Think of it this way, if you were going to start a new park, would you build it where there were a lot of people, or where there were not a lot of people? Why should it be any different for park expansions?

The fact is SFDL is holding stable for attendance right now. Larger rides will see bigger return in investments when placed at parks with larger local populations. So as of now, there is no reason to build a coaster at SFDL every other year, let alone once every five years. I grant you that they are stretching the time a little far. It has been a while, but like I said, there's really no immidiate need and while SFI is really in no position to spend money in such a way when ther are in so much finincial trouble.

Kingda Ka is going to do HUGE things for SFGAdv. It's already made national news and I'm sure you'll hear even more about it when it opens in 2005. It will more than pay for itself in year or two. Hurricane Harbor at SFGAm is the same way though it's influence will be more localized, but it will get the locals to come to the park MUCH more often.

Other than that, SFI is installing attractions at 13 of the 18 parks...you can't argue with that! You want to know what the real mistakes were? Scream at SFMM...who wants that cloned, parking lot coaster when the better floorless, Medusa, is up at SFMW?

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rentzy17 said:You can't just throw a rollercoaster into a park. You need to plan for it and analyze the area it's going to go in. Maybe not so much a small wild mouse, but a B&M floorless?! Come on. That took time. B:TDK was going to SFNE for a while.

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Well I have it on pretty good authority that the former Shock Wave of SFGAm was originally planned to be built @ GAdv, but for certain reasons could not be built there that year (as you know GAdv eventually *did* get an Arrow megalooper - GASM-II).
lata, jeremy

Okay, so the truth comes out. The plans are in the process of being refiled with the commission so your stoking a fire with out stoker. What's your problem? The way I'm reading things, they were given an extension, 120 days after the endorsement of the original plan to finalize plans and present them to the commission and they didn't do it.

You said this:

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Just goes to prove that SFI can come into your community, Persuade the local Government to shut down any new economic development that might threaten their purse strings and leave your community with Nothing.

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Now your saying this

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The Superdome Commision has already commented that if Zephyrland would re instate their plans they would now be looked at differently along with Jefferson Parish and as of lately they are in the process of doing just that. If the Superdome Commission would not be the Leasee for that land the Park would probably now be being built

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So there is still a chance the Zephyrs Water Park could be built.

The comments from the SF GM withstanding, and if I was a board member or member of a comission. Especially one that invested $35+ mil of tax payers money into a economic development project and then have that project threatened by another one, I would do the same thing. I don't know how zoning laws work in New Orleans, LA but I'm sure the Parish/County council has a say as to what goes into that project.

BTW, if you have any links to other articles about this project, I would like to read those articles, since the newest link I have is August, 2004.

SFDL hasn't seen a new coaster since 1999.

But they have received new attractions since 1999 and attendence has remained steady. I'm sure when Six Flags feels its time for a new coaster and they can get a return on their investment a new coaster will be added.

SFFT got their latest in 2000.

See above.

SFGAdv has gotten one in 1999, 2001, 2003, and now 2005. Who are they even up against? Small boardwalk parks? Dorney? SFGAdv doesn't need anything new. They act like there is some other massive theme park nearby that threatens their existence.

SFGAdv serves the largest metro areas in the US. The park's huge attendence means that new attractions can be paid for quicker. Again, its all about return on investment.

SFWOA could have stayed a Six Flags park had Six Flags actually given them a coaster collection that could at least take a stab at nearby CP. An unreliable Vekoma flyer, an SLC, and a boomerang hardly put up a fight.

Your problem here is that you assume all park guests think like enthusiasts do. Coasters is not their hobby and they don't travel from park to park each year. Few, if any, care that there are three dozen other Boomerangs or SLCs in the US.

I'm sorry, and forgive me for saying this, but that solidified Six Flags' position as the worst-run chain in the world. To have seen such ignorance makes me wince. I can't believe how foolish they were for thinking SFWOA could fight CP on a bunch of production models and no hyper.

See "thinking like an enthusiast" above.

With Kingda Ka boosting the already ridiculously high attendance rates at a market-monopolizing park, several other parks will suffer attendance drops.

13 of 18 parks are getting new attractions.

SFMM seems to be going by the wayside.

That park's problems go far deeper than what rides they have and what they add each year.

Sooner or later, people aren't going to feel like going to the smaller SF parks near them because there isn't anything new.

Again, 13 out of 18 parks are getting new attractions this year.

Wow. Ultra Twister, Batman-The Escape, and XLR-8 got new colors. I didn't want to go to SFAW, but I do now! What do they think paint jobs are gonna do.

SFAW got two new rides this year.

but I question how much longer SFI plans on keeping some of its parks with such few improvements.

You realize that Disney parks go YEARS without new attractions, right? How can they pull that off and still keep the guests coming? Easy: when your guests leave with a smile on their face they don't care that there was no new attraction that year.

Just my .02 cents.

mOOSH ;)

I agree forthright and wholeheartedly with mOOSH, save for one thing...

Although SFWoA patron may not know that SLCs and Boomerangs are located in many other parks, they DO know that they suck, and while I personally prefer SUE more than WT at Cedar Point, they get the GP with bigger and better in Sandusky.

-Brian

You're not disagreeing with me, Brian. I never stated what park guests think of the rides, just that they didn't know about they were clones.

I've seen some pretty serious waits for SLCs at some parks, can't ever forget the walk-ons for ROAR! East while their *sucky* SLC had a 20minute wait....guess where I spent MY valuable park time, ROFL....;)

Waterparks WILL bring in the kind of money parks need to build us our shiny new coaster toys....they may not make all of *us'ns* the happiest people on Earth, but they DO make their businesses *profitable*....and in the long run, a profitable amusement park is more amusing than a condo or parking lot...;)

RGW: But we all know that wooden coasters are rickety and are bound to fall over during the next storm so there is *no way* I'm getting on that! ;)

moosh: You were doing alright til you made the Disney comparison. Disney gets a *way* larger portion of its business from 'vacationers' not locals. Those on vacation likely dont go to Disney ever year (or every other year for tham matter). It's not as important for them to have something new every year as they are not relying on the same people coming thru each year.

Moreover, especially in the case of WDW they tend to publicize one ride in one park as a reason to go to every park in the complex, so they get away with stretching additions out even further.

or at least that's what it looks like from up here ;)
lata, jeremy

Jeremy - ok, so it wasn't the best comparison, I'll give you that. How about using the Sea World parks instead?

Coasterlover:I was just pointing out to CrazyB how we both have our own frustrations over the way our local SF parks are when the time comes for a new ride or expansion...personally I'm quite happy with the fact that SFA is finally gonna make some improvements to it's waterpark in 05,improvements that were long overdue & then maybe,just maybe take care of a few other things by 06/07 such as fixing the dead ends between coyote creek & gotham city...although I'd much prefer a small SFGRAM 04 style expansion to olde boston/nantucket first.

About your comment on visiting some other parks though:the only other park within an hour's drive or so away is PKD,as is I'm only able to make it there once a season & believe me I would like to visit SFGRADV or Dorney but currently lack the means to travel to a park that far.

Now I do think that SFI is on the right track this time with their cap ex budget,it seems like some of the parks that have been overlooked will finally get something while others that have been given alot lately will take the year off to fix what they have...15 parks will be seeing improvements/attractions which is quite alot when compared to the past two or three seasons,ohh & BTW SFDL will be recieving a little something for their waterpark next season.