Rockets, anyone?

Um, Playa? That has the exact same layout as this.

Which is why there's an incidental helix around that support column, right? And the wide 180 turn that just so happens to wrap around the Kite-flying tree at the other end, no?

Dude. It was a custom build for MOA.

-CO

All those listed prices above in Ramblin's post average to $14.38 mil. Throw in one coaster at $4 mil, the average drops to a whole $13.64 mil. Sorry Playa, you're wrong, he's right, in fact, he erred on the cheap side a little (maybe accounting for the Dive Machines or Deamon or something ;) ).

Since there are so few (coasters with listed prices) to really get a good judge, I just tried to get a few from each type, so hopefully that provides a good estimate. I mean you could build a custom kiddie coaster for probably less than a million bucks... I'm just being a little too picky I suppose...

*** Edited 12/23/2004 10:07:37 PM UTC by RamblinWreck***

You have to read between the lines when it comes to costs. CF's Morgan hypers were generally a MAJOR feature of a large capital expansion season. For example, VF spent between $10 and $12 million in '96 (depending on which report from who you choose) when WT was built--but that budget also included a new 3-floor employee dorm and parking lot, a Skytower and then some. So was all of it green steel? Nope.

Construction costs are also a huge factor. Mantis was built over a swamp that had to be drained first for footers. Silver Bullet was built in a park that doesn't have an off-season. So if you gotta keep the construction workers longer to accomodate for limited hours--bingo! It costs more. If you have to fill the supports with sand--bingo! Costs more again. If you wanna add theming, a snack bar and a gift shop....(as was done with DP's Talon, for example)...see where we're going with this?

A CCI woodie can cost $20 million if you add in the right construction factors and other additions! Am I right or am I right?

Most of the Morgan hypers were under $10 million in and of themselves. Knock off the theming and other incidentals and even the high-ticket rides--in and of themselves--cost less. Even Storm Runner - the only looping rocket - had some estimates of $10 million.

If you wanna qualify that as average B&M coaster, sure. But average custom? Nuh uh. Not even close.

-'Playa

*** Edited 12/23/2004 10:13:29 PM UTC by CoastaPlaya***

Cap'n Obvious strikes again! ;)

So you're saying the prices on rcdb.com are inclusive of all in-park improvements that year, not just the coasters themselves? I don't buy that for a second.

You keep claiming that it's not even close, but have only been able to provide one example that has since turned into an "off the shelf" model, so it's validity can be called into question. So, if it's so darn cheap for a custom steel coaster, provide the evidence? Where's the 13+ custom steel coasters in the $2-$4 million range, like Ramblin' provided?

I would think the prices on RCDB.com are for the rollercoaster...hence the name...Rollercoaster Database.

So then why does Captain "Obvious" claim that the prices include theme, and other in-park improvements such as TAlon's food stand?

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kRaXLeRidAh said:

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gomez said:
Rockets are popular not only because they aren't too expensive (like Xcelerater and Storm Runner, TTD and Kingda Ka don't count).

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Okay, that's more than half the Rocket Coasters in existence you just listed there. You proved no point with that. Rocket Coasters are not for budget conscious parks, they have a high price tag.

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Sorry I made that unclear. I meant that Xcelerator and Storm Runner aren't all that expensive when you compare them too the $25 million that TTD and Kingda Ka range around. $13 million is the price for a high quality thrill ride now a days, B&M's cost about the same.

And added helix does not make it totally custom (see-Goliath and Titan, SLCs and SLC +s). I think its pretty fair to say that Average sized custom coasters cost between 8 and 12 mill. Give or take, it still averages about that. I think he made his point clear, and I tend to agree.

He has used RCDB to provide facts that weren't pulled from his crack, where are yours? Shouldn't you provide more than just Morgan Hyper costs? I'd think that providing more than that would be Obvious...

Who are you talking to Tekno?

Isn't that "Obvious" by my use of the term at the end of the post? Not you Kyle, now run along;).

Tekno: Anyone who's actually seen TT would know it's a custom design for KCS-MOA. And that, my friend, is OBVIOUS.

Just because CF ordered one of the same for WoF doesn't make it an clone or an off-shelf model.

And if you ever bothered to read every word of a CF press release, you'd see exactly what I've already told you. They don't break out the coaster or ride cost alone. They call it a key feature of a X million dollar cap budget.

For crying out loud, learn...to...read.

Or better yet, don't. I got this fabulous Bermuda timeshare I wanna sell you!

-CO

*** Edited 12/24/2004 7:58:18 AM UTC by CoastaPlaya***

Wow, I've got a new nickname for you, Cap'n Oblivious.

Is that all you can do, tell me to learn to read. Whatever. You're slipping.

Maybe you should learn to read better. You are the one that mentioned an additional Helix on the little spinny coaster, in response to moosh. You mentioned another element, but it still breaks down to the fact that we were talking about an *average* (hey, thats a key word there, please remember) custom coaster costing an *average* of 12 million. Not some small spinny.

Something else you yourself said was a qoute of CF hypers (how that automatically translates to being the end all of average custom steel coasters beats me. There are plenty more *average* veko, arrow, and even intamin custom steel coasters than Morgan could dream of building) are between 8-12 million, since you said (with your facts that you haven't totally proven to me yet, other than telling me to read a press release that could back up what we're both saying) they cost less than 10 mill, and the rest of the 10 mill is cap ex. Why does RCDB list some of those prices for coasters? Did the cost of Millie and TTD go up to 25mill, or was that the cost of the coasters(and yes, it still counts towards construction, blablabla, that is cost of the coaster), a new bathroom, and paint on Mantis, or was that what they spent on the coaster, as listed on RCDB.

Which is why the term *average* was used for a *custom* steel coaster in the first place.

You can keep your Bermuda timeshare, I'd just rather have you realize that maybe, just maybe, more people than you'd like disagree with your 'obvious' conclusions. Now that, to me, seems Oblivious.

:) *** Edited 12/24/2004 9:47:06 AM UTC by TeknoScorpion***

$4 million vs. $12 million proves that rides of different size cost different amounts - pretty simple? A mouse no matter how custom, is going to cost less than some 200ft monster. Change it to a "custom large-scale European designed coaster" and is everyone happy?

For what it's worth, to add to the mess we have here, this new coaster for WBMW is actually AUD$12 million, not USD (as rcdb suggests), which I think by today's conversion rate, works out to be around $4.95 ($9.2 million if you take it using "conventional" methods).

Also factor in that this ride is going to a park that has a strong history of heavily theming rides, and there is no way the actual coaster is going to cost anywhere near USD$12 million. I personally see absolutely no way they'll pull it off with this measly budget, but find some way of surprising me.

Throw in there that their last addition, a custom Mack wild mouse cost AUD$13 (USD$10 for you lame-brains ;)) million, less than what this presumably custom Rocket will cost. It's all too confusing... *** Edited 12/24/2004 9:51:52 AM UTC by auscoasterman***

No, the cost of this ride in U.S. dollars would be over 9 million if what you say is correct. But Duane usually lists prices in other currency if that was what was given, so it may be 12 mill, it may be nine mill. Either way, thats still between my 8-12 million range:).

We already kinda threw out mice, boomerangs and the like, because those would be considered 'small', not average. I think what some people are considering as average is different that what other people mean.

To me, the small spinnys, mice, and smaller Antons/Vekos/Arrows,and even Kanonen, where I'll admit Duane was wrong on what it translated to in USD, since it is really around 7 mill, are 'Small' Custom coasters.

Things like Tennessee Tornado, Storm Runner run in my 8-12 mill and are average.

Things like Viper, GASM, Shockwave, and a few others are 'Large'.

Then you have the TTDs, Kingda Kas, and ultra themed Disney 100million as 'XL' and 'XXL', respectivly.

The Scooby Mouse was probably rather expensive, as it was highly themed, right? Themeing of that nature could definitly move something into *average* custom coaster.

Edit: Fixed link. You'll have to put in the currency yourself to see:). *** Edited 12/24/2004 10:07:28 AM UTC by TeknoScorpion***

Wow, Captain Obvious has George W Bush disease - he can't admit any kind of wrongdoing! Just keeps altering his position as he restates it until he's closer to the truth. Amazing. Well at least I can get a little more insight into that mindset.

I like the Capn Oblivious tag for this instance Tekno. ;) You put up another entire post where you only refer to your one $4mil example and don't come up with 12+ more. Come on, put up or shut up.

i thought i was Captian Obvious??? Or was it Captain Oblivious???
Whatever.
I like Rockettes. They dance really good! Nice legs.
...or was that rockets?
:)

I like the Houston Rockets, is this the same thing? ;)

All I can say is I don't really care about average costs or converting foreign currency to US Dollars.

Back on topic, I have only been on one rocket coaster...Dragster and I have to say that I would like to see rocket coasters with more length and overbanked turns and bunny hills and inversions. Something like Stormrunner but longer (as in duration).