Polish students unhappy with work at Six Flags New England
Posted
Under a visa program originally intended for cultural exchange, the Six Flags New England amusement park employed about 230 Polish students this summer. Some of the students say that after paying about $2,000 for travel and program fees to come to the United States, they were subjected to draconian work and housing regulations. A sponsoring organization of the program says that some of the complaints were not valid.
Read more from the Hartford Courant.
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"Where you end up is largely *largely* dictated by where you start out. Yes, some people manage to move up, but similarly others fall down. And if you think it only has to do with personal motivation you're crazy."
I guess that makes me crazy then, because I come from a bankrupt family in one of Cleveland's ugliest neighbourhoods. Somehow I still managed to go to college (a private school even), graduate, and earn a four-digit payroll checks. Heck, I even survived nine years of the allgedly terrible Cleveland schools.
I didn't beat any odds, I worked my ass off. Sure, I'm a white Christian male, but if anyone suggests even for a moment that I didn't earn my income level and social status, I might punch them in the face, because nobody handed me anything.
Why should the government do more to help people? For decades it supported a welfare system that offered no incentive to better themselves. When politicians started suggesting retraining and job development programs, no one wanted to foot the bill for that either.
You're a tax payer, you want something to happen, make it happen. I've spoken to my representative many times, and he does his best to make change. What has yours done?
There are no simple solutions to our culture's ills, and as a society we need to be compassionate, but subsidizing that compassion with hand outs and extra help when we're mostly lazy isn't the answer. Without accountability and responsibility, there is no progress.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"Let's stop saying 'don't quote me,' because if no one quotes you, you probably haven't said a thing worth saying." - Dogma, KMFDM
My payroll checks barely make four digits...but then again, I'm a state-worker who gets paid bi-weekly, LOL....oh, you mean you weren't counting the digits AFTER the decimal too.....;)
Seriously, I have NO problem with my taxes going toward giving people a hand UP....I don't want to give any able-bodied human with half a brain a hand OUT....Education of the masses, which HAD been funded in Joisey when I was a kid (although NOT in Maryland where we moved)...is a prereq for any society that even aspires to "greatness"....Socialized healthcare, considered a RIGHT in most all "civilized" countries, isn't in the US because it's a big moneymaker in this country....don't just BELIEVE me (who am I anyway), go get your prescriptions filled in Canada and find out for yourself...is socialized healthcare perfect, NOPE, but it sure beats letting the "underclass" go without it until society has to pick up the REAL expenses when their health has deteriorated unnecessarily due to a lack of PREVENTATIVE health care....which is CHEAP in comparison...
the Ivy-league school I applied to was willing to "help" finance my education, but where in HELL was I going to come up with the (substantial) difference....those "good-old-doy" networks are pretty darned powerful, and you don't have to know the words to Boola-Boola to see that our country is STILL dominated by those who know the "secret handshake".....can you make it out of poverty on your own merits - hell yes! Can you break into "the club" if you weren't BORN into it - not likely....perhaps not impossible, but not likely.....G-Dub and "daddy" didn't exactly wear rubber tires on their feet growing up, that's a pretty safe bet, huh?
On to the questions of international flow of labor...these people, in all likelihood, were MISLED as to the terms and conditions.....I work with international students, and they do fairly well here (expenses are lower here than in NE though)....
Does the Government keep people down....nah, too much work for lazy government workers...LOL. But seriously, if no one needed "the man" for a paycheck, who would fry our burgers at the local greasy spoon (contrast with the silver spoon crowd).....I guess in my own screwed up view of the world, I'd like for EVERYONE to have their success (or lack of same) to be based more on their own EFFORT....
bill, who honestly BELIEVES that without retraining, and some unemployment, and most importantly, EDUCATION, the US is going to have a harder time in the future competing in the global marketplace....let's face it, cars and steel mills are yesterday's news, and those folks need to have jobs that will be "sustainable" tomorrow....finally, it does amaze me how similarly we can see it yet how different it looks on the screen...;)...and thus, my thesis ends....
Like I said... healthcare is a seperate issue and shouldn't be confused here (I happen to agree with the Canadian implementation for the most part).
However, how do you suppose I paid for college? Loans, baby, lots of loans. That was my choice. Hell, Steph's loans for her undergrad, first and second masters alone total twice what the average American makes in a year (doctorate is fortunately paid for via teaching assistantship). Do you think she knew some "secret handshake" to do all that school? Do you think I've enjoyed paying my loans for the last eight years?
My choices have led to my success, not any predisposition for it.
If you think there's a club and some conspiracy to keep you out of it, then the world has already beated you into submission and you gave up.
A friend of mine, during a dark time in my career (and time is relative, as this was only six years ago), once said this to me:
"There are three kinds of people: those who MAKE things happen, those who WATCH things happen, and those in a fog wondering what the hell just happened. You're in the first group. Self-doubt and re-evaluation are the trademark of the Successful."
I carry that with me everyday, and it has seen me through many tough times, including my unemployment last winter.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"Let's stop saying 'don't quote me,' because if no one quotes you, you probably haven't said a thing worth saying." - Dogma, KMFDM
I worked as a Rides Supervisor at a park for the last two years, culminating my five year tenure in the Amusement Park Business. Three of these years i worked with such a program as in discussion, and I feel that you need to understand what is going on.
Global Staffing Inc. was the group that my park chose to do business with. In retrospect, this corporation is disgustingly horrendous, and I can not believe it is still in operation.
Yes, the students are charged 2000 fees. but, they are also charged $385 a month for rent, $250 a month for Traveling Fees to and from their apartments to the park, and for Utilities. ( Not part of the 2000 ) nor are they told this when they sign their contracts. ( by the way the contracts are in english, and not all of them can read english very well, as I am sure you have noticed. )
Ours lived in townhouses. The townhouses have NO furniture, no phone, no tv, no internet connection capabilities, or any dishes, forks, spoons, etc. These all had to be bought upon arrival. Also, pillows, sheets, and bedding were not provided either. And this was all possible by the means of 385 dollars a month rent. Which was up from the original 250 that was used the year prior.
They were paid by Global Staffing, not the park. The park paid them 9.00 an hour, but the kids actually only got 7.00 an hour from it. The rest went to GS. They are only paid once a month by GS and not the two week deal like the rest of us.
Many of my employees got second jobs at local malls and such to help with expenses. We limited them to 75 hours a week, after a newspaper article by the local newspaper was written about them making the park out to look like slavedrivers. In Actuality, this wasn't true, the Global Staffing workers were working extra hours just to keep up with their growing debt. if we didn't limit them to 75 a week, they would most definitley surpass it by great amounts.
The actual employees are great. Once you get to know them, they have excellent personalities, wonderful ideas, and a great sense of hard work ethic. I personally enjoyed having them around, but it was so hard to not feel sorry for them because they were put through so much more than I was just to have a job. Since this i have quit my job, not because of this, but it did make me very unhappy about the place where i used to love and enjoy working.
In the end, the fact that parks can support this GLobal Staffing Organization is beyond me. It's so nice to learn about other cultures and interact with these wonderful people, but its so hard at the same time because they really don't have time to enjoy their stay in America, or the energy for that matter. They are way to busy trying to make the money back that they are losing.
Thank you for your time.
I find it disgusting that SF is hiring foreigners, and yet, there are people in this country that are unemployed. Hell, I'm sure some enron/adelphia/mci employees would appreciate those jobs! I'm not going to six flags anymore! They can kiss my hard earned american dollars goodbye!
The only reason I don't complain about CP's program, is because CP actually cares obout the communities they are in, and do hold charitable events to give back to the community, not just take take take. Never hear 6flags doing that.
First off, they hire foreign workers because they can't get Americans to work those jobs. They don't have any choice. People laid off can't work 60-hour weeks and look for a real job. Why would they even work at Six Flags when they'll get more from unemployment and have the time to retrain and search for a better job?
Interesting comments about that company, Nancy, and not entirely surprising either. Nothing like that American hospitality.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"Let's stop saying 'don't quote me,' because if no one quotes you, you probably haven't said a thing worth saying." - Dogma, KMFDM
Sampleman,
Believe me, the parks would love to hire americans, but unfortunately (as stated above) many kids nowadays want to work in air-conditioned splendor - not standing outside in the heat.
As for your comment that...
...enron/adelphia/mci employees would appreciate those jobs!...
That is not the case either, as most people who have full-time "career type" jobs would not take a job that they feel is "beneath them".
I am not slamming on park employees but am speaking from the viewpoint of a person who knows many people who worked for Andersen here in Chicago and lost their jobs for no wrongdoing on their part.
The general consensus is that they wouldn't take a minimum wage job because a) it reduces their ability to look for work that they spent many years and thousands of dollars of college to obtain in the first place. b) can you imagine a 30+ year old whose career background has been spent in an office behind a desk having to work outside, dealing with customers while getting paid minimum wage? I don't think customer service and a friendly demeanor would ensue...
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My "guess" is that if there was REAL investigative journalism (tips hat to Woodward and Bernstein), that a list of those who BAILED on those stocks in the days and weeks before they CRASHED, those are the folks in "the club"....call me a conspiracy theorist if you want (and you very well may be right), but I'll wager there are a few hundred people out there that knew IN ADVANCE when to get out....Martha Stewart is "representative" of a very small, VERY powerful group....getting busted for it is what separated her from the group...
edit: we CAN succeed by our own definition of success through our own efforts....but you'd be surprised to meet some of the people who've never set foot in even a grocery store...."that's what servants are for"...(Dionne Warwick?)...
second edit: thanks, Nancy....."sold my soul to the company store"...
*** This post was edited by rollergator on 9/6/2002. ***
AMEN Redman! My 40+ husband has been out of work for 2 years now. He is college educated and was a computer consultant/project manager (as was his best friend). The company they worked for went bankrupt just as the economy started taking a nosedive.
Believe me, my husband and his friend want to work. Jobs in their skill level are few and far between. The first jobs to go in a bad economy are the "management" level ones, so the market is flooded with out of work management types. When they apply for lesser jobs, they are told they are "over qualified". No one wants to hire them for fear they'll leave when something better comes along.
If they were to take jobs, such as those at an amusement park, it would look pretty bad on a future resume when the economy does turn around, and would ruin their chances of ever getting the kind of jobs they lost.
Those who have spent years clawing their way to the top have a very hard time when it all comes crashing down.
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I'd rather die living than live like I'm dead
Wow, this thread got pretty deep the last couple of days. The bottom line, in my opinion, is that the parks should be telling these kids up front exactly what they are signing up for.
That is what I did at CP. When hiring I always told the kids they would be working 6 days a week and would often go over a "normal" 8 hour work day. I further stipulated that there was no overtime and the there was a cost to housing. CP didn't profit from the cafeteria sales...as that was pretty much at cost.
If there is any fault it might be that the kids didn't know what they were in for. I suspect, however, that the information was given to them and that they chose to come anyway b/c there really wanted to go on this program and would agree to about anything.
That same thing happened to those of us who went to Disney. The cost for housing was pretty steep compared to other parks and the jobs were just as tedious. We all would take any job, though, for the chance to work at WDW and get away from the cold for six months.
Jeff said something to the effect of: Why should the government do more to help people? For decades it supported a welfare system that offered no incentive to better themselves. When politicians started suggesting retraining and job development programs, no one wanted to foot the bill for that either.You're a tax payer, you want something to happen, make it happen. I've spoken to my representative many times, and he does his best to make change. What has yours done?
Why should the government do more to help people? What a typical American answer...
Hmm, let me think, because it's the right thing to do, because some people start out in a bad social strata with no postive role models and drug addicts for parents, because a culture is only as good as it's poorest members...I could go on but I'm sure you get the jist of it.
I agree that the welfare system as it currently exists has problems, but I think a lot of people who've never needed it *also* miss the point. The reforms that the feds have been making to force people to work 40 hours a week (even if they're single parents) to continue receiving benefits sounds great until you ask who's going to raise the kids?
In northern Europe this is solved with socialized child care (and consequently, people have a much easier time getting themselves off welfare for good...) which I doubt we'd ever have here since socialist anything seems to get shot down immediately because people have been conditioned to fear and/or hate the concept for no good reason.
If you think the current "representative" system is in *any way* willing, or interested in my low status university student views then, again, you're not looking at the whole picture. Our system is based on special interest groups, they who have money pull the strings.
If my name was Bill Gates and I had a few hundred thousand to throw toward my cause of choice, then yes, a representative or two might listen, and stuff might begin to happen...but I don't even think Gates has the money to make something like socialized health care or child care a reality. Getting something like that passed would require mass propaganda in the media for years to sway public opinion *at all*; as most Americans *don't* give a damn about the poor, it's one of the defining characteristics of our "culture" along with rampant materialism, the protestant work ethic, and lately, xenophobia.
(EDIT: Changed my mind, not the right place for such a political conversation)
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"To get inside this head of mine, would take a monkey-wrench, and a lot of wine" Res How I Do
*** This post was edited by 2Hostyl on 9/6/2002. ***
"Our system is based on special interest groups."
I don't disagree, but the difference is that you can sit around and complain about it or try to make things happen, even if it is within that system. If you're still a student and you're that jaded, then I fear for our future.
And if you wonder why people "fear" socialism, it's because they've thought it through. History has only shown that socialist nations benefit few and favor those who run the system. Absolute power corrupts absolutely. Socialist society limits your ability to succeed. I had a Russian friend in college who lived in the Soviet Union before it came down. He said the press for change came about because no one came out ahead, everyone was poor and organized crime was a way of life.
Are there socialist programs that work? Of course there are, as health care systems in some other industrialized nations show.
With regards to subsidized child care, it is available, today, right here in the US. My single mom managed to do it on a nurse's salary at a county hospital, back in the day when there was no nursing shortage. We barely had any money, but she sure as hell wouldn't settle for welfare.
I'm a bed wetting liberal for the most part, but to suggest that the government can fix society's problems is to suggest the absurd. I never see a third of my income as it is, and even at this point the world tends to be a pretty crappy place at times.
Helping people, inspiring people and working to make better lives is a noble cause and the right thing to do, but it's something that is most effective at the community level. If we did a better job taking care of our own first, our family, friends and neighbours, we'd be a lot better off.
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Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"Let's stop saying 'don't quote me,' because if no one quotes you, you probably haven't said a thing worth saying." - Dogma, KMFDM
I think it's important to seperate the concept of authoritarian from socialist. The socialist end of things is where you have positives like free health care, child care, etc. The negative end is when you have authoritarianism, which *does* restrict what people can do, say, and think.
I'm not arguing for authoritarian socialism, I'm arguing for democratic socialism like you can see starting today in Europe and Canada. I think the problem is that a lot of people look at socialism the way you do, that authoritarian is the only form, and as such, I feel justified in fearing for the US *ever* implementing social programs.
I might be jaded about the government, but I'd argue that people who disavow the poor as lazy and beyond hope are worse. I still have faith in the working class, and I think if you put appropriate systems into place to help them along the way, we'd be able to raise *everyone's* standard of living, and have a happier country as a result.
I understand that subsidized child care exists in some places, but subsidized is a far cry from socialized. Having a government sponsored, and run locations, stocked by well-paid and competant workers *for free, for anyone* is a world of difference from subsidizing Tom, Dick, or Jane's private business IMO.
A final point as well, Americans pay the lowest taxes of any "first world" country, and I for one would be more than happy to lose more of my money to taxes if the government would be willing to set up some of the socialized programs I've outlined, in addition to increasing funding for higher education, because the world we're living in now flat out requires a degree to earn an honest wage.
Well, it is late, I had so much to say about this topic. In fact I wrote three different essays about it. Ultimately, however, it comes down to the fact that Americans are not significantly exposed to people of other cultures and nationalities. We see Indians, Arabs, Europeans, etc., as not being American and therefore different and beneath us. Don't deny it, I see it everywhere. In reality, we simply don't understand them.
Hence, it would stand to reason that a supervisor at an amusement park that has never had foreign workers before would go through a culture shock. They simply would rely on their familiar American employees and give the shaft to the foreign employees.
This is why the exchange workers were complaining, they were disgruntled because they were not treated fairly.
I hope this makes some sense.....
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