Our friend, Ed Markey

Friday, July 22, 2005 11:13 AM
I know how much everyone here enjoys discussing our friend and fellow coaster enthusiast, Mr. Ed Markey, so when I came across this brilliant quote from him (unreleated to coasters), I just had to share:

"The beauty of daylight-saving time is that it just makes everyone feel sunnier," said Markey.

From this article on CNN:
http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/07/22/congress.daylighttime.ap/index.html

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Friday, July 22, 2005 11:56 AM
Yeah, I read that story and I was all for the change until I noticed that Markey sponsored it. Ugh.
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Friday, July 22, 2005 11:58 AM
Wow, nice quote Marky. Here we go again, as our tax dollars get pissed down the toilet as lawmakers argue over trivial issues. Energy conservation? How? Ok, it's dark from 6pm to 6am. Let's make it so its dark from 7pm to 7am. Great, I get an extra hour of daylight in the evening, I don't have to use the lights. But now I need the lights on in the morning because it's still dark out. How is that conserving energy again? We get an extra hour of daylight in the evening after work, that would be good.

I still say the whole time changing concept is useless and should be scrapped altogether. Every spring and every fall someone at the office forgets and shows up an hour early/late. Every spring I lose an hour of sleep (though I must admit gaining an hour in the fall is pretty cool). Just leave the clocks on daylight savings time. "Oh, but then it won't be light out until almost 9am in the winter. So? I'd rather have the extra hour of daylight in the evening when I can use it; as opposed to the morning when I'm (and a lot of people are) at work! Driving home at 5pm when it's dark out is just plain depressing. Spring forward, and stay forward I say! :)

From the article:
Upton noted that the extension means daylight-saving time will continue through Halloween, adding to safety. "Kids across the nation will soon rejoice," said Upton, because they'll have another hour of daylight trick-or-treating.

Fooey. Right, I'm sure all the kids are tuned into CNN right now holding their breath ready to release a Dove for every "Yeah" vote. One of the best parts about trick-or-treating is you run around in your scary costume in the dark. And hey, how am I supposed to scare the crap out of the neighborhood kids when it's light out?

"BOO!"
"Wow mister. We didn't see you hiding in the bush in daylight... The strobe light is a nice effect though, even though the sun is drowning it out."

Hmmmmm... maybe we should fall back after all! ;)

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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:22 PM
Hey, let's form a grassroots movement to ignore daylight savings. Let's just pretend it doesn't exist. Forget everyone else, we're on OUR own time now.

Now if only we can convince parks to change their hours. Who wants to write Kennywood first? ;)

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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:27 PM
I recently read an article (maybe in the Economist, or maybe the NY Times) that talked about the energy savings argument. That argument is based on a DOE study done in the 70's that showed that DST did in fact save energy costs.

The problem is that the way we use energy now is quite different, so it is not clear that that study still holds water. Several People Who Know claim that, in fact, it is no longer true.

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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:27 PM

janfrederick said:
Hey, let's form a grassroots movement to ignore daylight savings. Let's just pretend it doesn't exist. Forget everyone else, we're on OUR own time now.

Indiana and Arizona do it, why not everyone else? ;)

I've noticed since I moved to the west coast it gets dark earlier here than it does in Ohio. I guess it has to do with location relative to the time zone boundries. Maybe we can be an extra hour ahead. You know, to conserve energy. Xtreme daylight savings time for the Xtreme Park! Woo-Hoo!

*** Edited 7/22/2005 4:30:32 PM UTC by Danimales***

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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:30 PM
Danimales: that could be becuase you are farther south. The closer to the equator you are, the less the day's length changes from season to season. In the winter, it will stay lighter longer than it did in the (upper) Midwest.

Heck, even going from Pittsburgh to Ann Arbor was a noticeable difference.

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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:30 PM
Danimales, It all depends on where you live in your respective time zone, those who live to the east end of their zone have a later sunset than those who live to the west end of the zone...
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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:32 PM
Remember, only parts of Indiana follow Daylights Savings Time. This has been covered before in a thread awhile ago.

I just did some reading up on DST, and it's not good. For one thing, the common myth that it was for the farmers is a lie. They hate DST. There's also a significant increase in car accidents on the Monday following the change to DST, one study said by as much as 7%. One theory is that many people fail to make the time adustment, realize they're an hour late, and then speed to get to work. It also usually takes people a good five days to get used to the effects of the time change, which also can't be good for driving.

I was surprised to read that it used to be an all around the year event, and that it was made permanent in 1986 under Reagan. One of the major backers of DST was the petrolium industries, since later light increases the amount of people driving, therefore needing more gas. *** Edited 7/22/2005 5:02:34 PM UTC by Intamin Fan***

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Friday, July 22, 2005 12:55 PM
Yup...the further east you are towards the boundary, the earlier the sun rises and sets. There is a 15-20 minute difference between Southern and Northern California (because believe it or not, Southern California is further east than Reno).
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Friday, July 22, 2005 1:12 PM
I sure do enjoy the extra hour of daylight after I get home from work.
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Friday, July 22, 2005 1:20 PM

Intamin Fan said:
For one thing, the common myth that it was for the farmers is a lie.

It was done for the bars. One Saturday, every October, the bars can stay open till "3" because the clock rolls back before the 2pm cutoff time. How sweet is that.

If this passes, it should be put to a vote of the people. WE should get to decide if it goes into effect, considering it affects many more of us than it does those guys in DC who work 2 hours a week, and even then its only to see who can piss furthest.

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Friday, July 22, 2005 3:34 PM
Daylight Savings time is bad! Who here doesn't enjoy night time rides at parks? Often times, they change the atmosphere completely and people's minds about how good certain coasters are (you all know night rides are much wilder and better). Not to mention in the South (or anywhere where the sun is just too hot) it's a pleasant relief from the sun. With the way parks have been snipping off hours from the operating schedule and the way these idiot lawmakers have mush for brains, we may never get to enjoy parks at night again. I hope this move to expand it has opposition. It will definitely make me unhappy. I enjoy the long night hours at the end of October.
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Friday, July 22, 2005 3:40 PM
Despite my first post, I actually really like Daylight Saving Time (not savings, FYI). When it's 9 p.m. and it's still bright and sunny and warm out, that just makes me happy.

I spend a lot of time in Vegas during the late fall, and being right on the edge of the time zone, it gets dark at like 4:30 p.m. there. That's good for the neon, but otherwise weird.

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Friday, July 22, 2005 3:45 PM
Well I don't care about whether we're ahead or behind, I just don't like the change. Let's just set 9 PM to be the sunset on June 21st (in San Diego of course) and leave it alone. ;)
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Friday, July 22, 2005 3:47 PM

Den said:
Despite my first post, I actually really like Daylight Saving Time (not savings, FYI). When it's 9 p.m. and it's still bright and sunny and warm out, that just makes me happy.


I agree completely. One of the great treats of summer is that it gets late so dark. When you work a 9 to 5 job, there are many days in the winter when I never really see the sun. Coming out at 5:30 and it is already dark is really depressing. I think it is stupid that they are discussing this but I would be all for it.

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Friday, July 22, 2005 4:15 PM
Maybe Mr. Markey was one of Katrina's "Waves" back in the 80s. ("Walking on Sunshine" for those of you who are too young or were too smashed to remember.)

You're right about the farmer myth though. Farmers work from sunup till sundown no matter what time the clock says it is.

I remember the last time they did one of these all year round DSTs. It was back in 73-74 during the "first" energy crisis. In December it was pitch black going to school, and still dark past 9AM sitting at my desk. They were worried about kids waiting for school buses in the dark. A lot of schools and companies moved their hours back an hour, so everyone was basically back where they were before as far as sunrise and sunset went. So what was accomplished, I don't know.

I don't buy into this "I'm going to drive more and use more gas if it gets dark an hour later" thing any more than I buy this "we'll save so much energy if it stays lighter later."

So many things are running 24 hours now, and much of that doesn't depend on light or dark. I mean things like TVs-- in 1973, we had three NY channels that broadcast past midnight.

You also have millions of computers and systems that run 24/7. I read in Newsweek a while back that computer usage is almost entirely responsible for the total increase in energy consumption in this country between now and 20 years ago. Everything else we use, from lights to appliances to HVAC, has gotten more energy efficient. How will a later sunset change that?

We should all write letters to Rep. Markey telling him how much we like his idea to extend DST and how much more time it will give us to ride those dangerous rides at those greedy, uncaring amusement parks and carnivals.

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Friday, July 22, 2005 4:21 PM
RGB: those observations are the ones underlying the "Energy use is totally different now" argument. Thanks for stating it better than I did.
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Friday, July 22, 2005 9:42 PM

Danimales said:
Wow, nice quote Marky. Here we go again, as our tax dollars get pissed down the toilet as lawmakers argue over trivial issues.

(and a lot of other good stuff)


Wow. Dan, that might be the post of the year in my book. I cont think of a single thing I disagree with. Maybe we should all copy that and send it to our Reps/Senators!

lata, jeremy

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Saturday, July 23, 2005 3:21 PM

jdancisin said:

Den said:
Despite my first post, I actually really like Daylight Saving Time (not savings, FYI). When it's 9 p.m. and it's still bright and sunny and warm out, that just makes me happy.


I agree completely. One of the great treats of summer is that it gets late so dark. When you work a 9 to 5 job, there are many days in the winter when I never really see the sun. Coming out at 5:30 and it is already dark is really depressing. I think it is stupid that they are discussing this but I would be all for it.


Respectfully disagree. I love nighttime and dislike sunlight! I love riding coasters after dark, and the "magic" of the nighttime park experience in general, and like Cameraman said, this new law will take even more night hours from the nighttime park experience in an era where they are already dramatically shrinking to begin with!

It may seem trivial to some, but when you consider that with the trend towards earlier closing times in the industry, DST often makes the difference between whether a park is open AT ALL after dark.

For instance, SFNO closes at 8 PM on summer weeknights, right before the sun sets. If there was no DST, the 8 PM close would at least give parkgoers an enjoyable, if small, taste of the "magic" of night operation.

Having grown up when midnight summer closings were fairly common at both corporate and traditional parks, anytime a park closes before sunset if feels very "unnatural" and disapointing to me - like trying to watch my favorite movie but the theatre forgot to turn out the lights to get the glare off the screen!

So if anything, I am 100 percent in favor of ELIMINATING DST COMPLETELY rather than expanding it!

Here's another example directly related to this new extension of DST:

The last 2 years I went to Texas in March and since the parks were in standard time then, with an 8 PM close at Fiesta Texas, I had about an hour's worth of night rides on Rattler, Superman Krypton Coaster, etc. This doesn't seem like much, but for Fiesta, it's actually a lot, due to their notoriously early closings in general. In summer, the best they do is 9 PM, even on Saturdays, which means about 20 minutes after sunset.

Had the park been on DST on my March visit, as it will be under this new law, the closing time would have been right around sunset, and the appeal of visiting then would have basically been gone, since the amount of night rides available is the largest criteria I use for planning my trips, followed closely by the coolest expected temperatures possible (riding Titan at night in 40 degree weather at SFOT's Holiday In the Park was one of my favorite coaster sessions ever!)

I like night rides so much that I've actually paid an "upcharge" to get into ALL-NIGHT "buyout" events open to the public for which my season pass was not valid, just so I could ride hour after hour under a cool, dark, and "magical" night sky with no unwanted intrusion from the sun! I attended "Flags All Night" at SFOG last year, which lasted until 6 AM. This was my favorite park visit ever as I rode all the way until the end! Hour after hour of night rides on coasters like Mindbender was like a dream come true! I plan on attending a similar event at SFFT next month.

If the trend of shortening "regular" park night hours and expanding DST continues, these rare "all-nighter" events for which the public may buy a ticket may end up being the final bastion to experience a park for hour after hour after dark, instead of just for a few token night minutes, or worse, no night operation at all.

Frontrider

PS. If parks were like 24 hour Wal-Marts, I would NEVER visit during the day. All of my visits would begin at sunset or later! Depending on my schedule I would stay as late as I could, but would ALWAYS leave before the sun came out to crash the party!

PPS. I salute those states, or parts of states, that do not observe DST. It already gets dark too late in the summer to begin with, because the length of daylight is so long and because many regions observe the time zone one zone east of where they technically should be based on their geographic longitude. Perhaps this is why Indiana does not observe DST, for instance - if they observe Eastern Time, it is already getting dark one hour later than it should be if they observed Central Time, which is actually the zone their longitude places them in (based on the idea of 24 time zones, each 15 degrees of longitude wide, with the center of the first zone being 0 degrees (Grennich England), and all other zones following based on that, with the time in each zone corresponding to the number of zones they are ahead or behind Grennich). *** Edited 7/23/2005 7:24:20 PM UTC by Frontrider*** *** Edited 7/23/2005 7:43:38 PM UTC by *** *** Edited 7/23/2005 7:50:23 PM UTC by Frontrider***

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