Now that CF owns Great America in Cali, bring back the railroad.

Friday, January 25, 2008 2:20 PM

lumpy72 said:
To many used operating locomotives available to by a new locomotive. IF not, why did Disney trade engines with CP. The one they traded was purchased used. The costs are still high to install a railroad.

Currently available Equipment:

CP & Knotts has three spares between them. (One is operable and two do need rebuilds)

Late 1800's 0-6-0 30" gauge steam locomotive $96,000 as is and $250,000 restored, plus additional $10,000 to reguage to 36".

36" locomotive and five cars. 18 ton, Forney-style 0-6-4RT steam locomotive was built by Porter in 1911. Fitted with new ASME boiler in 1972. Five passenger coaches. Price: $205,000 "as-is, where-is"

36" locomotive, built in 1919 by the Porter Locomotive Works as a 0-4-0T switcher, rebuilt for an amusement park into a 2-4-0 with a custom built tender. Over 1 million dollars was spent on the locomotives rebuilding, it is wood fired, in operating condition. Some of the mechanical details include: Sliding valves, mechanical lubricator, turbo generator, boiler pressure 170 lbs, steam brakes. Headlights, gauges, bell, etc go with unit but have been removed to prevent them from being stolen. PRICE: $270,000 *** Edited 1/25/2008 5:07:42 PM UTC by lumpy72***


The 1919 Porter is not 36" gauge, it's 42" gauge, which was favored by the anthracite mines in PA. The tag showing the boiler stats is the original Porter tag, and in no way reflects the actual capabilites of the boiler at this time. There is a lot more going on with this locomotive that is being stated.

The 0-6-4 Forney that Barnhardt has listed has been for sale by them for several years

As far as Knotts roster of 36" gauge equipment, both Baldwins are operational , the Davenport has not run since it's last rebuild in the 1990's. It's a matter of getting it certified more than anything else.

At CP the Mogul "Albert" is on display on the Frontier Trail. It needs extensive boiler and running gear work. Jennie K has been pulled into the shop for evaluation.

For more info on Cedar Fair RR's -

Friday, January 25, 2008 2:54 PM

Bill Muir said:
God Bless Dollywood!

Amen. Nothing beats how the ground starts shaking when those locomotives hit the grade pulling out of the depot!

Friday, January 25, 2008 3:32 PM
rollergator's avatar I highly doubt any pre-existing park that doesn't have a railroad would be getting one. Any park that took one out, almost certainly not. Land-intensive, capital-intensive, maintenance-intensive. Transportation rides in general seem to have been continuing on a decline for more than a couple decades, and that's not a trend I see coming to an end.

Wasn't there even an "incident" on DW's about a year or so ago that looked like a potential lawsuit in the making? As if liability for the parks wasn't ALREADY through the roof...

One of the parks I recommend highly for train buffs....L-A-M-A. Those guys KNOW their stuff... ;)

Friday, January 25, 2008 3:47 PM
Dollywood had a kid fall off while sitting on the end of the bench. Probably did have a lawsuit on that one and they've since changed the policy to adults only on the outside.

Little Americka is highly chronicled in three parts on my Youtube vids (Link Below) Unfortunately I didn't visit on a weekend but we got both the backshop and roundhouse tour and some good interviews.


Friday, January 25, 2008 5:32 PM
^[Dollywood] It was a grown woman. She fell off the train when someone spilt a drink on her. To my knowledge there was no lawsuit. This was back in 2004.

"they've since changed the policy to adults only on the outside."

Dollywood has had that rule as long as I can remember...way back to the Silver Dollar City days. I know because as a child I would get angry when I had to sit between my parents. I always moved the edge of the bench when the train stopped for the robbery gunfight so I could see better.

*** Edited 1/26/2008 12:44:28 AM UTC by Dukeis#1***

Friday, January 25, 2008 6:13 PM
Thanks for that correction, I have no idea how I screwed that up. Probably due to that year being my first adult visit and I knew about someone falling, Then the first thing they say in the rules is no children on the outside.


Friday, January 25, 2008 7:35 PM
No way their bringing back the train.. hell they shipped there top ride off to Caro-water rides.

The greatest Train ride out there is the one at BGE.

That park is a Killer with the walking and don't see them stopping that any time soon. Fun also on Halloween!

Seems were not just coaster nerds, but Train nerds also.. Welcome to Train-Buzz

No I don't have a kid, but I still want to ride!

Friday, January 25, 2008 7:58 PM
Every winter we get a few good Train threads. Im kinda partial to steam myself but it doesn't have to be. I often combine trips to nearby RR museums or excursion lines on my Park trips, Even only spent three hours in Adventurland IA because the UP Challanger was comming into town a hour north of the park. It came in three hours late so I was a little ticked but nothing like seeing the nations largest loco operating running.

Chuck, who's also visited Steamtown, and that RR and Museum near Dutch Wonderland as part of my trips

Friday, January 25, 2008 10:30 PM

So does that mean your a Big fan of Winston Link?

No I don't have a kid, but I still want to ride!

Saturday, January 26, 2008 1:46 PM
It's bad enough the train was removed for a Vekoma, but I can't believe it now with that Vekoma gone. I've been to PGA after Stealth was gone. The removal of the train very much ushered in my opinion of the mediocrity of the park. I wanted that train back. My eyes were out during my visit looking for the remaining trackbed around the loop of the park.
Saturday, January 26, 2008 3:23 PM
The Great America Scenic Railroad was not removed for a Vekoma. Stealth was designed around the railroad, in fact, the railroad was still running when Stealth was testing. The railroad was removed for Hypersonic, but Paramount sent Hypersonic to Kings Dominion at the last minute.

2012 SFGAm Visits: 26 2012 Season Whizzer Rides: 84 X Flight Rides: 91

Saturday, January 26, 2008 4:39 PM
Does anyone know what happened to the engines and coaches once they were removed?
Saturday, January 26, 2008 6:12 PM
^The red train ended up in Florida. It has been for sale for several years now:

Not sure where the green train went. I think I read it was sold as well, though I wouldn't be surprised if it was scrapped.

Saturday, January 26, 2008 6:46 PM

CoasterMonkey said:Charles,So does that mean your a Big fan of Winston Link?

I like his photos and sound recordings and apreciate what he did for preserving some RR history. Nickleplate 763 has been towed from Roanaoke to the Ohio Central steam shops and will be rebuilt.. That will make Four Bershires in operation, Mostly in the midwest. Just search OC Steam. They got about 11 loco's now and eight are operable.


Sunday, January 27, 2008 9:24 PM
I did miss type the gauge, my mistake. This yet another example of a locomotive that could be regauged pretty easily to 3 foot gauge.

As for the boiler it may be operational in the state it recently operated. Since it is not being used on a federally regulated railroad like the Whitewater it may not be operational in a different state. Pennsylvania has tougher boiler codes and enforcement than say Iowa.

Under FRA, it would not be operational until goes through a major overhaul and the paperwork updated. I don't know of any operational steam locomotives in parks that could meet the FRA regulations without some type of teardown and testing. Dollywood would probably be the closest, since they use the FRA regs as a maintained guideline.

My point is that equipment exists which makes building new a waste of money. Even if the Albert and Jennie K need major overhaul, it is a more cost effective route.

William W. Gray, CuratorWhitewater Valley RailroadConnersville, Indiana

Sunday, January 27, 2008 11:18 PM
Yes there is a lot of equipment out there that can be utilized. Just off the top of my head there is the former Petticoat Junction hoarde sitting down South. There is a lot in private hands that could possible obtained.
Sunday, January 27, 2008 11:45 PM
Dollywood #192

William W. Gray, CuratorWhitewater Valley RailroadConnersville, Indiana

Sunday, January 27, 2008 11:59 PM
Here is Flagg Coal #75 when it visted our railroad last September. It dosen't have to be a big locomotive to put on a show. I am standing in the door of #75 in the first video. I was running in reverse in the second.

William W. Gray, CuratorWhitewater Valley RailroadConnersville, Indiana

Monday, January 28, 2008 4:55 PM
janfrederick's avatar Wow, that puppy is hauling! ;)
"I go out at 3 o' clock for a quart of milk and come home to my son treating his body like an amusement park!" - Estelle Costanza
Monday, January 28, 2008 8:28 PM
Cedar Fair's "track" record with properties that they have acquired bear out that they usually install a RR if it doesn't already have one (MA). However steam isn't at the top of the priority list. Of all the CF parks only three have steam railroads (CP, KBF and KI) the rest all have infernal combustion, usually Chance-Morgan C P Huntington's, with the exception of the trains at Valley Fair and Dorney Park, which are Crown diesel hydraulic steam outline. The latter was originally built for Canada's Wonderland , but wasn't delivered, allegedly because of a customs issue. If they keep Knotts Great America (or whatever they are calling it this week) there is a good possibilty that a RR would be built. It probabaly wouldn't be like the original, as the feasabilty of rebuilding the line after Paramount ripped it out to make way for other attractions appears to make that a daunting task. *** Edited 1/29/2008 1:30:31 AM UTC by Dutchman***

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