No, DeSantis isn't "winning" against Walt Disney World

bigboy:
I believe that, similar to 2020, there are far more that will refuse to vote for Trump than polls indicate.

You have far more faith in the American public than I do.

I'm weird in that I have always had a penchant for talk radio. For fun or maybe more for curiosity, I sometimes tune into a local talk radio station, 100.1 FM, "The Talk of Akron". When we first moved to NE Ohio in 2009 it was a collection of random stuff mainly about the area, local sports, and some politics, but ever since Trump, and then Covid, it's literally become nothing but 100% Trump everything. Some examples;

• January 6th was a patriotic act because the election really was stolen
• Trump is the most successful president in history
• The Hawaii wildfires were started by the Biden and the left to help push a climate change agenda (by some kind of space weapon!!)

You get the idea. Every single caller is a broken record about all the, for lack of a better term, "bat**** crazy" stuff. Full-on Marjory Taylor Greene audience.

Anyway, today I heard something surprising. An older gentleman called in, identifying as a long-standing Republican. He stated that he had "had enough" (even though he voted for Trump twice), and that regardless of what is true or not about the allegations, he thinks Trump is now unelectable, and he would not be voting if Trump was the candidate due to his behavior.

The surprising part was that this was the first time I heard an actual voice from someone who is Team Elephant speaking out against Trump. The non-surprising part was that he was labeled a traitor by the host and shot down by subsequent callers.

I'm no political scientist, but I do think there is credence to the idea that people in the middle, who are clearly not in that far-right bat**** crazy crowd, and maybe even some long-standing GOP members, have simply had enough; at least enough to say it's time to move on.

Just based on the conversation, I thought the crowd would enjoy this; I personally laughed because that same radio station keeps playing it in the background pretending he is on their team, when really he is just, well....not. Or any other team.

First time you heard someone calling into that show speaking out against Trump or first time you heard a republican speaking out against him? From what you say about the show, wouldn't expect anyone but Trump supporters to call in. But there are a lot of republicans out there who don't support Trump (about 50% in most recent polls). So if you are talking about first time you have heard any republican speak out against Trump, that would be surprising. There have been republicans in this thread speaking out against him.

I think there are even more who would support a different candidate if they thought he/she could win the general.

At the same time, I still see a lot of Trump flags driving/walking around. And down south last year, talked with a boat captain who said there were parades up and down a river there every week with Trump supporters. I could understand what some people saw in him in 2016 but I didn't agree it would translate well into politics. Understood the support less in 2020. Now its a total headscratcher in terms of what people see to say they want more of that.

Sorry if I misconstrued; first time I heard a caller on that show speaking out. I know plenty of hard-line GOP folks who have wanted nothing to do with Trump for sometime. The fact that I heard it on this particular show was what was surprising, because it is, as I described, nothing but his supporters calling in and also hosting the various shows during the day.

Interesting that the screeners for that show let the caller on the air. And that the caller would want to call to speak out against Trump in the first place. Why bother on a show like that? Like going down to UAW Local 856 to talk about the merits of outsourcing. Maybe it was a long time caller into the show who was a supporter originally but finally had enough and wanted to share?

Years ago, I sometimes would listen late, late nite radio on the way home from work late night. Was surreal. Conspiracies, coverups, paranormal, etc. Back then, people had to gather in the middle of the night on radio shows in something of the shadows. Now they gather online totally in the open and can easily find each other. Contributes to the issues discussed in the book Prof. Noble linked yesterday.

Back in the day, I had to deal with my mother being a medical expert (she wasn't) based on a Prevention magazine subscription. Today, I deal with my sister as a medical expert (she is even less so than my mother) based on Facebook and Instagram.

While I would hope that guy does cast his vote elsewhere, I firmly believe folks like him won't.

When push comes to shove and there are two candidates on that final ballot, "the lesser of two evils" instinct will kick in, and of course, blue = bad. And perhaps begrudgingly, another vote for Trump will be cast.

Having spent the last few days reading some recaps of the Republican debate, I find myself more annoyed with the whole situation than ever.

One group with whom I’m really annoyed is the media. I pulled up CNN’s homepage the morning after the debate and had to look for a couple minutes before I found the headline about the debate. Why was it so hard? Because encircling it was headline after headline about Trump. The media is certainly obligated to cover the fact that a former president has been hit with 90+ indictments and charges, but there is absolutely no need for a dozen headlines about it to one headline about the candidates who aren’t facing jail time.

You would think that by now, the media would realize that they’re just turning Trump into a martyr. You’d think they’d realize that blasting non-stop coverage of his crimes and failures at the expense of the numerous other civilized candidates is totally ineffective at this point. Those who would ditch him over that have long since done so. For the rest, the effective approach would be to de-legitimize him.

Consider that for a moment. Even in all the coverage of the debate, there were numerous references to the fact that they’re gunning for number two. Why on Earth would someone say that? They’re aiming to the president, not the person who lost the least to Trump in a primary. There should have been article after article about the candidates, their platforms, and their performance at the debate. THAT would be responsible journalism.

It’s just becoming increasingly apparent that Trump is the threat that he is because his opponents and the media are doing a good job of making him one. They’re harping attention on him and the nuttiest of his supporters and it’s only energizing them further. If you really want to push him and his supporters back into the shadows, stop talking about him and then and focus attention elsewhere.

/rant

Three things that I just can't wrap my head around:

1. The absolute fervor with which Trump supporters buy his merchandise and proudly wear t-shirts, fly flags, etc. In recent years the only other person I have seen wearing a political t-shirt was for a local alderman. But that was being worn by his bodyguard.
2. How Biden can both be senile and a mastermind who can run a deep state cabal.
3. Speaking of which, the mainstreaming of conspiracy theories. I'm more worried about a coworker who has a special bag to block his cell signal so that the government can't track him with 5G than any of my LGTBQ trying to groom high schoolers. How did we get to a point that people openly say crazy **** out loud?

The internet.

When I was down in Pigeon Forge in the spring there were retail stores that featured nothing but Trump merchandise. They had names like Trump Store, The Trump Store and We the People Trump Store. I can’t even call them pop-ups, like Halloween City. They seemed like legit, permanent brick and mortars. I didn’t darken the door of those places but in the meantime I’ve seen photos from the stores. T shirts and banners with obscenities, “F Biden” being the most popular, and everything you can think of that could display an image of the confederate flag. Trump 2024 banners, and plenty of stuff referencing a stolen election.
Then in touring around the area I came face to face with plenty of maga merchandise-wearing citizens. And at places like The Island every retail gift shop had lots of Trump stuff, just an aisle over from the Dolly stuff. I entered into a personal, moral discussion with myself about what I would do if I was a retailer trying to make money in that market. In other words, would I play to the audience and make a quick buck or would I stay on the right side of things? I concluded that I’d have to come down on what I consider to be the correct side.
And I’m so dismayed (is frightened a better word?) that there seem to be so many who’ve chosen to blindly follow, disregarding any critical thought process. When there’s mention of statistics like 50% of Republicans don't support I have to wonder, because maga people seem large in number and loud in their presence.

I mentioned this in my Dollywood TR from May, but:

Finally, the park has always been what I'd describe as "faith-forward." They do not have a holiday festival, or a winter festival. It is a Christmas festival. One of the biggest and longest-running acts is a Gospel quartet, and you'll get some of that in most of the musical acts. None of that has changed, of course, and the guests have always been long on the same. But, I noticed a lot more christian nationalism and all that goes along with it among the guests than I have on prior visits--the most recent was about a year before the '20 federal election and associated fallout. I'm not sure if I'm just paying more attention, or if it's truly gotten more visible, or maybe a bit of both. Worth keeping in mind if you're planning a visit.

The fact that Trump didn't have a shirt with his mugshot on it front and center on his website within moments of it being taken, I think, proves he's not a really great businessman.

Both sides would eat that **** up.

When there’s mention of statistics like 50% of Republicans don't support I have to wonder, because maga people seem large in number and loud in their presence.

Based on a Google search, there are about 35-40 million registered republicans in the US. You saw a few hundred or thousand people? Not sure you can say much about the sample of people that you saw. And certain locations will have higher concentrations. From what I understand, Pigeon Forge is one. I know that Orange Beach last summer was as well.

Trump is polling about 52% at this point.

https://projects.fivethirty.../national/

Mug shot t-shirts.

https://www.washingtonpost....s-georgia/

Raven-Phile:

The internet.

I don't buy it. The internet was around way before Trump became President. Remember Al Gore invented the internet after all. Nobody was this gaga over W, Obama, or Biden. Something is different about Trump and this strange hold he has on people. I'll grant you that the internet has amplified this.

Speaking of shirts. The tagline under the mugshot says "Never Surrender!" Don't you have to surrender to have your mugshot taken and grossly underreport your weight?

I guess I'm still the only one still rocking Dukakis/Bentsen wear.

I imagine a peaceful future in which Donald Trump is forgotten and not often spoke of.

It's really scary how easily fooled some people in our country have become. Can we just call it what it is? A cult. He and his people designed a cult that appeals to a large number of Americans. He says something over and over, and then it becomes true, at least to them. They don't understand what is real or fake anymore.

Like I always say, we are doomed.

Mulfinator:

1) The internet was around way before Trump became President.

2) Nobody was this gaga over W,

3) Obama,

4) or Biden.

1) So has flat Earth, Chemtrails, Anti-vax (The Jenny McCarthy kind,) etc, etc. As the internet, mainly that ubiquitous scapegoat "Social Media" has gotten bigger and faster, so has all of this.

2) Anti- W was massive. Mostly in bumper-sticker-on-Prius format. (S.M. was in its' infancy)

3) I think Obama did actually garner a huge amount of PRO support both in his campaign and his term. I mean, he won a Nobel prize before he even did anything. And wasn't his inauguration the largest ever?

3.5) Anti-Obama was massive on the internet. Mostly in forwarded email format.

4) "Let's Go Brandon" isn't actually about NASCAR.

sirloindude:

The media is certainly obligated to cover the fact that a former president has been hit with 90+ indictments and charges, but there is absolutely no need for a dozen headlines about it to one headline about the candidates who aren’t facing jail time.

I'm not sure it makes sense to provide much, if any, media coverage of the first debate of a primary when the first state doesn't cast a ballot for another ~five months, and we're more than six months from Super Tuesday. The group following this stuff at this stage is pretty niche. A former President being charged with numerous crimes is quite historic by comparison.

You would think that by now, the media would realize that they’re just turning Trump into a martyr. You’d think they’d realize that blasting non-stop coverage of his crimes and failures at the expense of the numerous other civilized candidates is totally ineffective at this point. Those who would ditch him over that have long since done so. For the rest, the effective approach would be to de-legitimize him.

That's not supported by the data. Yes, it's true that a certain segment of the population will vote for him no matter what, but those people don't decide elections for the most part. To win nationally, a candidate needs the vote of the people in "the middle", and his favorability ratings have been hurt by the charges against him, and there's little reason to think things will improve as attention ramps up over the next year.

Mulfinator:

The internet was around way before Trump became President.

True, but "the algorithm" wasn't. It's become clear that for companies like Face-, er, Meta, they will gladly burn the whole thing to the ground if they can make a tidy profit doing so. And Musk has basically turned Twitter into his own misinformation megaphone under the guise of "free speech", a concept he's made clear he has no grasp on.

RCMAC:

When I was down in Pigeon Forge in the spring there were retail stores that featured nothing but Trump merchandise...

That blew my mind as well. Some of the other attractions in the area (Goats on the Roof comes to mind) had a ton of Trump merchandise for sale as well. I've always said -paraphrasing the legendary Foghorn Leghorn here - that I am about as sharp as a sack of wet mice, but I never understood the Trump merchandise thing. There weren't Obama stores. There were no W stores. Even Reagan didn't have hundreds of different types of merch. The MAGA thing just baffles me.

I am a big fan of visiting county fairs and I have been to 4 so far this year. 3 of them had several tents selling Trump flags and t-shirts and stickers... and each of them were doing a great business. My favorite was at the Tuscarawas County Fair (OH) last year. One of the merch tents had nothing but pro-Trump, anti-Biden items and were also selling brass knuckles and knives. Ah, the fun of the fair! :) Props to the Erie County Fair in Hamburg, NY for not having any political merch tents (at least from what I saw. The fair was mobbed).

As they say on Twitter/X, "It's not a cult"

We visit fairs as well. In the fall we’d usually visit Fairfield Co. Fair and/or the Circleville Pumpkin Show as they are great October events and the last of Ohio’s season of fair food and carnival rides.
Well, one afternoon ahead of the last presidential election we went to Circleville and I was shocked at the number of MAGA-dedicated merch booths. We parked a distance down the road (as one does) and there in front of the Hardee’s was a bus that blasted patriotic music and was flying huge Trump flags (one of which said “Women For Trump” - a concept I couldn’t wrap my head around) and a guy yelling into a megaphone spewing falsehoods. Into the festival we encountered a sea of red hats and Trump shirts even on the kids. We didn’t last a hour there and whole thing made me so uncomfortable that I insisted we leave. It also made me sad- we are a couple made of one city boy (me) and one small town country boy and I have enjoyed the fairs and have stood side by side with those red-county people my whole life with no problem. Until something came along to divide us as a population, that is. I’d never felt so unwelcome.
I’m all for people having different political beliefs and I know these differences existed before Trump stepped onto the political scene. But something happened that normalized outrageous and uneducated behavior. On the way out I spotted the Democratic party’s tent and I stopped in. The guy looked up and I said “Lonesome?” He laughed a little and had to agree with my assessment of the crowd. He had a terrible job that day and said he’d already had his fair share of harassment.
I didn’t watch the first debate. I did hear a quote from somebody (DeSantis?) directed at Vivek Ramaswamy saying that he’s unqualified and we can’t have a “rookie” as president. My milk and my cereal went up my nose with that one.