Is Phantom's Revenge Overrated?

Wednesday, July 18, 2001 5:35 PM
I took a trip to Kennywood Park about a month ago, it was a very wonderful park. Very clean, friendly employees, well operated park. I was a little disapointed with Phantom's Revenge. I actually enjoyed the Exterminator more than Phantom's Revenge. I guess the ride just didn't do it for me. First off, after you come off the first hill, you go into this long straight track doing nothing but going straight. This is a sign of poor ride design. Yes the second hill is pretty good, but the long straight part of the track prior to the second hill really makes the ride weak! I think Kennywood is a class A park, but I was not overly impressed with Phantom's Revenge. Now Jack Rabbit and Exterminator, those are rollercoasters!
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 5:47 PM
That straight away was put there for two reasons, to give riders the feeling of extreme speed, and to set the track up for the drop into the ravine. I don't see how one "design flaw" can make the ride weak, doesn't all the ejector air make up for it?

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Joe Cernelli
Head Webmaster, Kennywood Boulevard
http://kennywood.coasterbuzz.com
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 5:52 PM

cernelli said:
"That straight away was put there for two reasons, to give riders the feeling of extreme speed, and to set the track up for the drop into the ravine. I don't see how one "design flaw" can make the ride weak, doesn't all the ejector air make up for it?"


I totally agree with you.
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:01 PM
What ejector time, on the small hops going back to the station. That is more commonly referred to as bruising of the abs! The ejector air time you get on Jack Rabbit is far better than that of Phantom's Revenge. That ride was never designed for speed from the get go, it was retro fitted for speed. If you really want speed and air time than there is nothing better out there than Millenium Force. Lets take a different look at this, what if Cedar Point decided to make Millenium Force a multi inversion coaster and have Arrow come in and retro fit the ride. The ride would be horrible. Kennywood should have gotten a loan, used the money they spent on retro fitting Steel Phantom, and build a true hyper / giga coaster. Then they would have had 2 awesome coasters. Now they have a wannabe coaster. It is a wannabe Superman at Darien Lake, but fails to live up to its expectations.
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:06 PM
I agree with both of you as well. Just read the Kennywood books about the Steel Phantom construction. It is supposed to be there. Granted that proposed double-up would have been nice, but there is no way they could have gotten it to work like they wanted. PR is definitely the Phantom we have all deserved. Now about that tunnel......
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Thanks for riding Tidal Wave and enjoy your day here at Mariott's Great America!!
www.angelfire.com/oh4/tk173
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:17 PM
Oh give me a break, I'm sure the Steel Phantom really envies that guy with blue tights. On a more serious note, Phantom's Revenge gives plenty of speed and keeps it until the end, just like Millennium Force. I'll admit to liking MF and Apollo's Chariot better than Phantom's Revenge, but that doesn't make PR any less fun! You can't criticize a coaster for not being the best coaster out there.

Kennywood wanted to take a rough, unpopular coaster and make a smooth one that everyone could enjoy, and that's exactly what they did. I'm sorry if you don't think it's a "true" hyper (what you mean by that, I don't know), but they were worried about winning the GP back over, not breaking records or making the best coaster in the world.

I fully respect your opinion, as I don't except everyone to like it, but I'd like to see some better reasons for it.

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Joe Cernelli
Head Webmaster, Kennywood Boulevard
http://kennywood.coasterbuzz.com
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:29 PM
i agree with everyone on how the straight away shows extreme speed and i think every coaster at some point should have a straight away track to show the max speed. and the small bunny hop maybe rib bruisers if you dont expect them like i did on the first ride but you cant have that stop you from riding it again cause once you know where it hits ya good then its an all time great ride

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Webmaster - G-Screams
http://gscreams.cjb.net
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:29 PM

Just Coasting said:
" It is a wannabe Superman at Darien Lake, but fails to live up to its expectations."


What does that mean? Sounds like someone's looking for a fight...
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So many coasters - so little time.
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:31 PM
I think it is also overrated, too. I know a lot of coasters that are better. I don't like Chance-Morgan roller coasters.

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Don't Fight It: Ride It! Raging Bull
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:32 PM

Just Coasting said:
"I was a little disapointed with Phantom's Revenge."
What are the chances we'll ever see a positive topic started by you?

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Jeff
Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com
"From the global village... in the age of communication!"
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:54 PM

Jeff said:

What are the chances we'll ever see a positive topic started by you?"


I'd guess when he rides his first Dragon Coaster at his local carnival. He will have a blast on it!


StealthmF5m3 said:
"I think it is also overrated, too. I know a lot of coasters that are better. I don't like Chance-Morgan roller coasters."


There are not Chance-Morgan coasters, only Morgan. They havn't built any coasters since Chance aquired Morgan or however it goes, so none of them are Chance-Morgan.

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6 Days left.
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 6:58 PM
StealthmF5m3, I know coasters that are better than Phantom's Revenge as well. Nobody here claims it to be the best coaster in the world.

The reason we ride coasters is because they are fun. Spending your time nitpicking about the ride, saying that it's not the best, is a huge waste of time. Once you start doing this, it proves you are not really an enthusiast. It's all about fun, isn't it?

Just Coasting, Why you would call PR a wannabe Superman is beyond me. I don't know what you're trying to do here, but I think you might just want attention. I'm not sure how much I can respect your thoughts about coasters, since according to your track record, you haven't ridden any. Maybe once you ride one, you'll change your outlook. Until then, I'm sorry, I don't have any respect for your opinions.

Kennywood didn't set out to break records, and they clearly explained that they couldn't compete with Cedar Point in terms of height or speed. They also said that if they built a record breaking coaster, chances are, the record would quickly be broken again.

Kennywood has successfully accomplished what seemed impossible. They made the unrideable rerideable. So I commend Kennywood in taking the risk of taking a once-record breaking roller coaster and trying to make it better.

The general public seems very satisfied with Phantom's Revenge, as you can clearly see by the wait times. Just look at the Phanatom Phanatics website - people aren't just riding once. They get off and get back in line, unlike the Steel Phantom where people would get out off the ride, and not come back to ride for the rest of the day.

Not everyone likes PR (believe it or not), and not everyone likes every coaster. I guess you just can't make everybody happy.

*** This post was edited by Kennywood Insider on 7/18/2001. ***
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 7:09 PM

Kennywood Insider said:
The reason we ride coasters is because they are fun. Spending your time nitpicking about the ride, saying that it's not the best, is a huge waste of time. Once you start doing this, it proves you are not really an enthusiast. It's all about fun, isn't it?



I couldn't have said it better myself, it's a shame more people don't think that way. :(

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Joe Cernelli
Head Webmaster, Kennywood Boulevard
http://kennywood.coasterbuzz.com
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 7:52 PM
Okay, okay, okay... I'm going to ignore most of this thread that most people are doing well enough debunking themselves. I would like to take up one specific issue, though:

Just Nitpicking, er, Just Coasting said:
That ride was never designed for speed from the get go, it was retro fitted for speed.

Do you have any clue of the history of the design of this ride? This ride was built specifically for speed. If they wanted a simple Arrow looper in the first place, the second drop and high speed turn wouldn't have been incorporated in to the ride at all. This so-called ride not built for speed was the fastest coaster with the longest drop for many years longer than any other coaster had that record.

Also, before I go, about not liking the high speed straight away... ever heard of antici........................pation?

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"Let's go out and have some fun!" (New Order)
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 7:59 PM
To be honest I'm amazed how quick people have been to jump on this thread. Just Coasting was mostly POSITIVE about Kennywood (in his original post) and still the debate starts.

To answer the original question, in my opinion, no, Phantom's Revenge is NOT an overrated coaster. I actually happen to love that flat stretch taken at speed -- it doesn't take long, and now that the shoulder restraints are off it's an awesome bit to raise your hands and just feel the wind.

That doesn't mean the opinion is "wrong". Someone didn't like the ride as much as many of us. Oh well, life goes on. I DO disagree with the "Superman wannabe" comment, though -- I've ridden SFA's version, which is a mirror of SFDL's, and I like PR MUCH better. ;) (And the comment about "never designed for speed" is a bit odd, but KPJB's already refuted that nicely)



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--Greg, who happens to think PR is THE best roller coaster at present time, but that's HIS opinion

http://www.pobox.com/~gregleg/

[Real name removed at user's request. ;) -L] *** This post was edited by Lynch on 7/19/2001. ***
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 8:09 PM
I also forgot to mention in my former thread that much like GregLeg mentioned, everyone's opinion is just that. An opinion. Opinions CANNOT be wrong by definition. They are not meant to be fact, simply one's own feelings. If someone thinks PR is crap, who am I to disagree?

It's just things like the "not built for speed" comment and others like it (both about this coaster and others in other posts) that irk me. If you don't like something, say you don't like it, however if 99% of the people do like it, you can't say its design is flawed simply because you don't.

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"Let's go out and have some fun!" (New Order)


*** This post was edited by kpjb on 7/19/2001. ***

[Lynch beat me to the request, but it's done -- gjl] *** This post was edited by GregLeg on 7/19/2001. ***
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 9:11 PM

kpjb said:
"Also, before I go, about not liking the high speed straight away... ever heard of antici........................pation?"

Since you don't like your real name mentioned (which is fine)...

After that comment, maybe I should call you Frank. As in, Frank N. Furter. Eh?

Anyway. It's funny... for the first day or so after KennyKon, nothing but praise for the new ride. Now, all of a sudden, the naysayers start saying nay.

You just can't please some people, I guess.

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Matt Lynch
Co-Webmaster, Kennywood Boulevard
http://kennywood.coasterbuzz.com
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 10:51 PM
There's a big difference between a "crap" coaster and an over-rated one.

PR is a good ride - extremely smooth, some nice air, and I don't mind the flat straight bit either because it allows you to feel the speed of the ride, however it is too short to be one of the best coasters out there.

I've seen people on here say it is the best coaster ever. Maybe it's the best coaster they've been on, but the thing cannot compare to S:ROS at SFNE.

I was disappointed by PR because of the hype on here, so I would have to say IMO PR is overrated, but still a good ride.

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Parks done 2001: BPB, PKI, SFWOA, CP, KW, HP, DP, Knoebels, Astroland, SFGAdv, SFNE, SFA, LC, Moreys Pier, PKD, PCW, BGW, DMP.
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Wednesday, July 18, 2001 11:08 PM
i try to have fun on coasters while riding them. i dont try to examine everything as they go by, i just like riding and having a great time. i think i had more fun riding SKULL MOUNTAIN(backseat) than NITRO a few times this year. if some rides dont have what your lookin for or dont live up to what you thought it would be, its no reason to say its a poor ride or overrated. all coasters are fun in some way! thats why they are made.

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NITRO!
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Thursday, July 19, 2001 3:20 AM
Gee Jeff, I didn't know every topic had to positive! Who cares if the topics are positive or not, all I did is express my opinion on a ride that I thought was overrated. Alot of people "Brag" about this ride and other rides on how awesome the ride is, I just wanted to give a very different view point, different from that of popular opinion. Why can't I have the right to say maybe it is overrated! I wasn't bashing the park, I think the park is great! However the ride is overrated!
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Closed topic.

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