How You, the Enthusiast, can Help Arrow Dynamics

More
1
2 of 3
3

I cant understand the poeple who want Arrow to "die". There coasters are not always smooth...thats a known fact, BUT, IMO anyone who doesnt ride an arrow coaster because of roughness is a winey spoiled brat. I love Intamin and B&M, but, there not going to be smooth forever. Take Magnum for example, I bet if it wasnt over a decade old it would be a whole lot smoother. Coasters cant stay smooth forever. I even noticed the almighty Millennium Force shuffling along on more than on occasion this year. Its funny how in a month or two all the arrow bashers are going to be X enthusiasts...why do I say this you ask? Becauses its new...!
-----------------
"It's always great for us to put the newest and the best rides into the roller coaster capitol of the world" Sandor Kernacs 11/20/01

I just looked over all of there products, would they have the Arrow logo on them ? Because I am thinking about ordering one of those hat for $12.90 .

I LOVE ARROW!People without Arrow we would not have the steel coasters,or the polyurethane tires on coasters now.They rocked the industry more than anybody else I think.

I hope they recover soon.

Does anybody know if X will be finished though?

-------------
What in the world is in that bag?Watch u got in that bag!?!?!?!?!?!?!

Hmmm... as I was at work today, I thought of this same topic... buy a shirt, it may not save the company, but maybe it'll be a nice show of support.

If they do "die" (which is HIGHLY unlikely... they could live on merely as a parts supplier, if nothing else) it'll be a nice souvenir.

Great minds think alike, eh Agent and John?

The website, by the way, is http://www.arrowdynamics.com/

-----------------
"When I was growing up, we were taught something called manners. You'd understand that if you weren't such an idiot." - Jack Handey

*** This post was edited by kpjb on 12/14/2001. ***

Sorry... I forgot this: if you want to go to their store directly without going through the rides section, just point to http://www.arrowdynamicsstore.com

(Where, by the way, blankets are on sale super-duper cheap for those cold Hallowweekend nights!)

-----------------
"When I was growing up, we were taught something called manners. You'd understand that if you weren't such an idiot." - Jack Handey

Pointman - Are you looking for beef? Calling the "death" of the company that revolutionized the industry a good thing based soley on two failed instalations is a little X-treme.

Anyway, they aren't dead. Arrow is not out of business, they are reorganizing the way they do business. I do a lot of research on this stuff, and it happens all the time, with a lot of thought and research put into it. A corporate restructuring is very rarely a rash decision done in "panic mode," but a very carefully planned out one that is done to avoid excessive long-term losses and maximize gains. There are exceptions to this, but from what I've read about Arrow's case, it seems like a very ordinary corporate reorganization.

And back to the topic at hand, I actually like some of the Arrow gear, and may just pick up a thing or two. If it helps boost morale over there, that's cool with me.

-------------
"you're better off talkin bout your wack puma sneakers." -KRS ONE

It's nice to see so many supporters for Arrow. I hope Fred knows how much he and the gang are appreciated a well.

Hey everyone, I have just received some shirts! Yes the store is open, and it offers great quality and styles. The polos are nice! I am glad to see everyone supporting Arrow.

It still seems that a couple people haven't ridden Tennessee Tornado. We are capable of competing in the "smooth as glass" category, and when you get to Pigeon Forge you'll see what I mean. Unless a park specifically asks Arrow to build them a coaster with rough transitions, there will be more rides in the future that deliver the lightning quick punch and smooth performance found in Tornado.

-------------
DON'T....LOOK....BACK! The Headless Horseman awaits you in 2002!
Model coasters and rides: www.angelfire.com/oh4/tk173

Name one successful innovation that Arrow has had in the last 10 years. Now in that same period of time, how many can you name for Intamin, premier, B & M, Setpoint, CCI and Vekoma. Which of these companies has had the least. Isn't it time to let the old dinosaurs make room for new companies?

john peck said:
"Its not their fault if a park doesn't order any rides.....
i]

If I ever start my own business, I would never hire someone with this attitude to be a salesman. It is Arrow's fault. If your going to succed in business, then you have to create your market. If you can't create a market for your product, you are doomed to failure.

Also, to Homey G. Actually, too much competition is as bad as too little. Too much competition causes the smaller companies to wither and die. A good analogy is wildlife preservation. We allow deer hunting to thin the herds. If too many deer are allowed to live, then lands are over grazed and disease increases. Therefore hunting is allowed to decrease the competition for territory and food.

Another stellar example of Arrow's commitment to quality is the Steel Phantom at Kennywood. In order for this coaster to survive the park had to call in a second company to rebuild the thing.

Couldn't you make your point in one post instead of three?

Arrow isn't even the same company it was ten years ago. Different leadership, different product, different time. Why should they go away when clearly there's room for them? If B&M and Intamin are the only folks out there, how competitive do they have to be with their pricing? Not competitive at all, I should think.

If I had to guess what went wrong at Arrow in the last decade, I'd have to say that they weren't aggressive enough in R&D. Tennessee Tornado was the last really significant large ride they built, but little had changed in the design. Having been burned with various other development projects like the Virginia Reel and pipeline, I'm not surprised they stuck to their guns.

So finally they do go out on a limb and do something new with the 4th Dimension model. We saw how Six Flags supports R&D with Vekoma... build me one of those and we'll pay you when you finally get it right. Mental note: Don't build prototypes for Six Flags unless they're willing to be more financially involved in the creation of a prototype.

By all accounts from people who've put in some laps on X, and some of the engineers have done more than a hundred, this ride is a seriously big deal.

There's plenty of room for Arrow, and it would be nice to have an American company somewhere in the landscape.

-----------------
Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com, Sillynonsense.com
"As far as I can tell it doesn't matter who you are. If you can believe, there's something worth fighting for..." - Garbage, "Parade"

Very well said Jeff, I think if anyone would be to blame for Arrow's recent restructuring, it would be Six Flags. They want a brand new "WOW!" coaster, but they don't want to help design it, or fund it. SF is miffed because Arrow hasn't got X up and running, yet they pushed Arrow into building it when it never should have happened. Same goes with Vekoma...Six Flags was the cause of their restructuring too. A note to SF...PAY UP FRONT. You get what you pay for, and in this case, it wasn't much. Keep Arrow AND Vekoma alive, as they BOTH have their niche in the coaster world.

I wouldn't say it shouldn't have happened, only that you're bound to run into unforseen problems with something new. Six Flags should know that, given the experience with Superman: The Escape at the very same park. Any ride that is drastically different from anything previously built isn't going to just happen out-of-the-box. I don't know what kind of arrangement there is between Arrow and Six Flags. It may be fair to say that Arrow should have only accepted the deal with the understanding that they need cash, and that the customer should expect some delays. However, I assume they've spent a good deal on R&D for the 4D and Arrowbatic, so I'm sure they had bills to pay, and a signed deal was welcome.

It's my understanding that Paramount does fund R&D for prototypes to some degree, as they've apparently got some rights to Vekoma's Flying Dutchman design. That sounds like a better arrangement. You put cash into it and you get to better control how it's used after they put it in one park. If the design succeeds, great, build more for your other parks. If the design bombs, let the manufacturer build it for someone else (like Six Flags) and get a cut of the transaction.

This is kind of a difficult topic to takes sides on for me... I can see both points of view, and both possible ultimate outcomes (including the "Death of Arrow" as we've called it here).
Arrow hasn't proven themselves within the overall last ten years. They've tried within the last few with the ArrowBatic, and now 4-D.... Because they've had to do something new to attract business again, once B&M and Intamin came screaming onto the scene. It hasn't worked... through the eyes of Joe Q. Consumer... think about it, you have before you the options of buying a top notch B&M which is all the rage at every other one of your competitors, or purchasing a new concept from Arrow... the company who you bought something from last time, now isn't quite so loved for it's roughness... and who's last major new concept the Pipeline... never happened...
What do you think they're going to do? They'll buy the B&M, of course... why take a chance, when you can be sure. "Arrow's Death" could come into play here, with the company gone, other new companies like SetPoint can bloom on the market, and they've got the ideas already.... look at their designs! Tell me you wouldn't want one of those in your back yard.
But, on the flip side... I absolutely have a place in my heart for Arrow... Cedar Point, and more notably Magnum XL-200 were my reasons for falling in love with coasters. It would be a serious dissapointment to see them gone after creating such a legend.
In their prime, Arrow rocked the industry, nobody can dispute that. And I bet they can do it again... something's brewing behind all of these concepts they've been having lately... something's waiting to go off in that design house that will rock the industry again... and it'll be the next big thing.
With Arrow remaining on the market as a player, that provides more competition between companies. More competition is better for us, the ultimate consumer of the ultimate service... riding the thing! More competition means lower prices, lower prices means more parks building, which we don't mind one bit! If Arrow goes, the remaining major players can up their prices, and not require the innovative things we crave...
What I think the bottom line is, is that Arrow's fate is really up to some park out there taking the next big chance on them. Will it happen? I can't really say for sure right now... I would love to see them stay, but things will be different if they go. Different for the better, or different for the worse... who knows. I think either way, the industry is just starting to see the creativity some of those people who come up with these fantastic machines. With or without Arrow, we're about to get rocked again.
((end of rant.))
Jeff
(Jeez.. that ended up being more of an editorial than a post.. sorry bout that )
Edit- And I just went to the Arrow Store and purchased both one of those cool blankets with the Full Arrow logo (I think it's cool how you can pick which logo you recieve) and one of the unstructured baseball caps with the Arrow "A" on the front, and the "Arrow" text on the back... cool stuff! Just my personal way of both showing my support, and saying "Thanks for making me a coaster lover!"

*** This post was edited by Gravity on 12/15/2001. ***

Don't forget also that not only did SF not want to pay up front for X, but wanted to open it a year earlier than originally planned, as part of this "Xtreme park" nonsense. We're looking at two ironies here, looks like SF will have to own up to the fact that this coaster was a 2002 project all along. Two, it probably would have never been built at all without SF's involvement as the project was dead and buried before Gary Story came along.
My prediction: This time next year this will be a non-issue. X will open in 2002 as intended. It will be a big hit and Arrow, now working as a "smaller" company will continue to build for smaller parks with less demands. Just my opinion.
-----------------
"Time flies...Whether you're having fun or not". -Mary Engelbreit.

*** This post was edited by DWeaver on 12/15/2001. ***

As a park manager, I am really enthused at the posituve response in this subject. I ordered myself a blanket, and hat, and a shirt, since I have to wear ties in the off season. I hope the boys at Arrow see this link and some fan support.

I just went to the Arrow Dynamics store and bought one of there best jackets, I hope that raises there spirits, I hope it raises there spirits.

I still think if the Statosphere ride was approved, Arrow would not be in this bind right now, but whos to tell if they were to get their money, or part of it up front or not.

This decision could have been made a year ago as a "Plan B" in case X and the Strat didn't work out

Hmmm... as for that Stratosphere thing, that only happened because the low-life people who live down there and city council in my city are STUPID!

Didn't this same thing happen with Giovanola? They're still making coasters, aren't they? Plus, Arrow can also merge with another company, like Chance did with some other company (morgan?). Arrow is cool, and don't forget, other companies have designed really bad rides, too!

More
1
2 of 3
3

You must be logged in to post