Holiday World to cancel all enthusiast events in 0

---

PKIEMPSOB said:
Its really sad. It was my 1st enthusiast event and most likely my last. Patrick the enthusiast doesn't like it BUT Patrick the ride op says a good idea and I have to go with the ride op in me. The whole event almost turned me off to rollercoasters in general.

Honestly I don't blame them in the least.

------------------

Wow, I thought I was the only one to feel this way. Thanks for sharing your feelings. It all has left a serious mark on me that has taken all summer to shake, and I'm not sure I have.

I truly support Holiday World in this decision and wish them all the best.

---

Paula,

I understand completely the decision that you all had to come to. I know it could not have been easy for Pat, Will and yourself to do this, but, in light of the events at SRM03, it is the right decision.

Hopefully, in the future we, as enthusiasts, can again earn the trust that had existed previously. I understand that it will be an uphill fight because as will stated in his letter, there are too many idiots out there who think they are invincible and that park rules do not pertain to them.

Either way, my family and I will visit HW in the future and I look forward to the day I can bring my little girl to your park so that we can enjoy the family atmosphere of your "little piece of heaven" in southern Indiana.

------------------
--George H
Currency Tracking Experiment...Where's George.com
*** This post was edited by redman822 9/18/2003 2:48:20 PM ***

I belive you were camped next to us Patrick.

While it didn't shake me up that bad for the simple fact that it was someone who did it to themselves, it angered me more then anything.

My thoughts were "Why do this to the park, the Koch's, the people in attendance." My initial worries were for the well being of the park, and the Koch's as they are such nice people who have done so much for us.

For me is was all about a break in the trust that these people had given to us, which frankly angered me to no end.

I feel very bad for Tamar's family and her fiance especially. however I am still angered that her decision broke the trust that was given to us. Not for selfish reasons, but for the simple "Why woudl you do this to them" factor. In fact I feel that way about all the people out there who have done such dumb, risky, and absolutely idiotic things.

------------------
If I was part of a coaster, I would be an upstop pad on an Arrow Mine Train.
MAGNUM HAD MY BABY!

Full text of Will's letter is here:

http://www.coasterbuzz.com/2003-261-216573.htm

------------------
Jeff - Webmaster/Admin - CoasterBuzz.com - My Blog
Blogs, photo albums - CampusFish
What time does the water show start?

We're not hiding from the problem. We're trying to end it.

Paula
------------------
Paula Werne
Holiday World PR
www.holidayworld.com

---

Paula,

I am really sorry that this had to be done. I respect Holiday World's decision and support them in their decision. I may not like it myself but I still understand the why.

Thank you to all at Holiday World for the SRM's that I was able to go to. It was fun.

---------------------------

To everyone else,

It is sad that Holiday World has to end SRM in order to end our bad behaviour. We all need to wake up and smell the coffee.
------------------
Zero G Thrills - Moved and Improved

This hurts to hear. I became part of my first coaster club right before last year's SRM, and didn't attend it. I did, however, travel from So. Cal. to go to Holiday World in July and absolutely loved the place. Bought more than I could carry out at the souvenier shop too :)

I was really looking forward to SRM '04, figuring that it would probably be my second event ever (I imagine that, if it's happening, I'll go to KBF's Solace first, seeing as it is so close by). Hopefully it will return again, and even more so, hopefully those that haven't behaved themselves in the past will change their ways.

Good luck to Holiday World though, and I'll still recommend the park to my friends when they're travelling anywhere near it. If SRM ever comes back, we'll all be here waiting for it :)

I for one am not shocked at Holiday World's decision on this matter, especially considering what happened. Sadly for me, I have never been able to get to SRM or HW for that matter. Events are nice, but not having an SRM '04 will not stop me from visiting this park!

------------------
We don't need no stinking badgers!

Before you read this post, be aware that I am fully behind Holiday World's decision - I just wanted to put forward one point that may have been overlooked.

In common with all teachers of practical subjects, any science experiments my students carry out come with a verbal run through of the safety rules and a written summary of the rules. If I see a single student break any of those rules, they are stopped from doing the experiment. If there are examples of foolish behaviour by more than one or two students, I am likely to switch off the gas/electricity supplies at the wall and stop the practical - either to give further warnings or to end the practical completely. It just isn't worth the risk for students to be using chemicals and not wearing safety glasses, or to be sitting down so they can't take a quick step back if something they are heating should tip over. The risk in my lab is usually of a small burn or a hole in some clothing, but even so, I have no intention of being the one liable for a student's accident - I do all that I can to prevent it.

Scale it up to the risk posed by fast-moving machinery, and Holiday World's actions are to be expected. There was, however, one more action that they could have taken. If they were so concerned that certain enthusiasts might try to get away with a higher-that-is-safe lapbar or seatbelts that are too loose, why not issue their ride ops with a "staple them" instruction? Once down, those lapbars will only pop up again if faulty, and a properly-secured lapbar ought be enough to keep everyone in their seats, seatbelt or no seatbelt, otherwise this suggests a fault in the design of the train/lapbar ergonomics. If the ride op was then unsure that the rider was sitting properly in their seat, they could ask the rider to sit properly, or if the rider persists, they could be removed from the train.

My science lab is like a coaster train with a 2-click lapbar - you have to trust the students to follow the safety instructions otherwise there will be a risk of an accident. If I feel that an experiment is too risky (or fast-moving with too much airtime) I make absolutely sure of the safety of my students, staple down the lap bar and demonstrate the experiment instead. The safest thing of all would be never to do any experiments, but that would remove the heart and soul of science lessons. You can finish off this analogy yourselves...

Listen to Paula, then maybe you'll understand the decision: (Jeff: Please delete this if I have done wrong by posting it)

From:jpwerne@holidayworld.com (Raven Maven)Newsgroups:rec.roller-coaster Subject:Re: Will HW Attend Eastcoaster?Date:19 Sep 2003 19:03:03 -0700NNTP-Posting-Host:63.75.25.193NNTP-Posting-Date:20 Sep 2003 02:03:06 GMTPath:kermit newsfeed-east.nntpserver.com nntpserver.com news.maxwell.syr.edu newsfeed.stanford.edu postnews1.google.com not-for-mail
Coastin_Steve@webtv.net (Coastin Steve) wrote in message news:

> who is still AMAZED that a group of people is being
> blamed for the actions of 1 (or a few)

I hope I can explain this so that most of you understand...I know it's
too much to hope that everyone will get it. :0) But anyway, I'll
try...

So many have posted concerns about possible attendance drops or
financial loss this season. Thanks for worrying, but the big concern
on this end--and the primary reason for the "no events in '04"
decision is an emotional one.

I can't expect any of you to know what we went through this summer.
That awful, awful night. Telling Will. Telling Mrs. Koch. Saying
goodbye to the SRMers. Hugs from so many as they filed past me.
Listening to Will talk to her father on the phone. Handling the first
calls from the media. Worrying about our employees. Tears. Prayers.
Low-flying news helicopters. Inspectors. Police. The coroner.

Crisis counseling. Ministers. Emails from well-wishers. Hate mail.
Flags at half staff. Closed for the day. Satellite trucks everywhere.

Getting up after two hours of sleep and vomiting. Filled with dread
about what the new day will bring. Knowing the truth, but the truth
doesn't change reality. That beautiful young woman who made a mistake
is gone forever.

I haven't trusted myself to say this before...but the cruel names that
have been posted here regarding the ACE member who died that night
have cut me to the core. She has a name. It's Tamar Fellner. She's not
here to defend herself. I pray that she rests in peace. And that her
parents find peace. And I pray they don't read some of what has been
posted here.

At first, Will said we shouldn't talk about whether to have future
events. It was too soon and he didn't want to make a hasty decision.
We should wait till the season slowed down. A few weeks ago, we
started talking about it after a directors meeting. The pained look on
his face convinced me he'd made the right decision even before the
words came out of his mouth.

"I just can't see doing it. I can't see putting our employees through
it."

Next May 31 will be a difficult day for all of us at the park. SRM was
always such a joyous occasion for all of us--we truly looked forward
to it each year. It was like a family reunion. Friends, new and old.

But the thought of sending the ERT coaster trains up the hill in the
dark of the night when the memories are still so fresh--we just don't
want to do that to ourselves. Too many sad, sad memories.

So, you see, it's not all about you the enthusiasts. It's about us. We
have to take care of our own. It's not about lawyers. It's not about
insurance. It's about helping our staff through a rough anniversary.

Please don't clobber me with "Well, what about...?" questions. It's a
Friday night and I'm sitting at home trying to give this to you
straight from my heart.

We don't hate enthusiasts. We're not mad at ACE. We're not trying to
punish anyone. We welcome all those who will follow the rules to visit
us and enjoy their day. But, for '04 anyway, no events. We honestly
don't know about future years.

Please find it in your hearts to at least agree to disagree with us on
this. Don't look for a deeper, more clinical meaning, because it isn't
there. And maybe say a prayer when you have a quiet moment.

Thank you for reading this.

Paula Werne
Holiday World PR

Post Followup

I hope none of my postings on the internetwas trying to encourage what some may believe was unsafe behavior. On one of my postings on rrc and roller-coaster talk I was asking if a maximum of 2 inches of lapbar space with a loose but securedly fastened seatbelt was safe. I've felt that IMHO that it wasn't a safety hazard simply because at 2 inches I thought I was in there tight enough that it would be dificult for me to stand up therefore making it impossible for me to fall out when seated. This does NOT imply that I'd try to stand up since there is NO WAY I'd even think of trying that in the first place!! I think standing up on a train ride would be a safety hazard because I believe the risk is of losing your balance causing you to fall out even on a forceless family ride. On roller-coaster talk I got flamed and someone tried to tell me how unsafe in all caps a small amount of space was but surprisingly people seemed more civilized on rrc without anything I'd considered a flame. This may sound bias since I feel HW can do no wrong but I too can NOT blame the park for their decision to cancell the events. My last visit to HW was on a normal public day and it seemed better than ERT was I was there because of no lines on the day I was there. I think events like SRM are fun but to be honest I don't feel a big loss since the park is a joy to visit any day as long as at least one of the woodies are running. It would be nice to see SRM return in the future but it is not the end of the world if it didn't.
*** This post was edited by Pink Floyd Fanatic 9/20/2003 7:03:50 PM ***

I agree PFF. I don't need SRM or any ERT to enjoy that wonderful place. SRM was more of a get together anyway. The fun was after the ERT as far as I was concerned (see Corey's video), but it still saddens me that it has been removed from the 2004 schedule. Still, I applaud the decision, even if the selfish side of me wishes otherwise.

One thing I think I would miss, though. The darkness. Is there any time during their operating season that those coasters run in darkness equivalent to SRM? Just wondering.
------------------
Rob - Jerk/Loser - Standing up for the unfunny and unattractive. - Click here for details

Rob, they were open til 10 P.M. a few nights this season. I wasn't ever at the park that late, but from my vast Indiana knowledge I can tell you that it probably started getting to dark around 9:30 during those days (middle of summer, mind you.)

Maybe 1/2 hour of darkness, probably nothing like midnight though.

--Ryan

...Remember that Holiday World is on the *extreme* Eastern edge of the Central time zone (but they have DST), so it gets dark earlier than in many places. Sort of the exact opposite of Michigan's Adventure, which is at the *extreme* Western edge of the Eastern time zone (with DST) so it *never* gets dark.

--Dave Althoff, Jr.

I managed to get a handful of pretty dark rides right at closing time at 8pm at the end of August. Those weird time changes in Indiana are good for some things!
------------------
Ripple Rock Amusement Park
*** This post was edited by millrace 9/21/2003 10:29:36 PM ***