History to repeat? B&M and Arrow

They are wise investments for parks and unless that changes, they will be around for quite some time.

Which longterm, may be a problem for them. Why buy a new coaster when you have one that's reliable, still popular, and already payed for?

Arrow did try to do a few unusual inversion elements on the ever-popular Drachen Fire (cutback, cobra roll, corkscrew off the lift), but we all know how successful that ride was! ;)

Ray P. (who actually enjoyed Drachen Fire)

The inversions weren't the problem on Drachen Fire.

I'll assume it was the transitions on DF that was the problem? The turn coming offthe "camelback" and heading up into the brake run may very well have been the most painful one I have ever experienced. Yet I still rode the ride 11 times in a row without exiting the train! That could explain a lot about me...

Ray P. (glutton for punishment I guess!)

*** Edited 10/19/2004 7:26:45 PM UTC by ProgRay***

I kinda agree, while I do love B&M, it'd be nice to see them come up with some new inversions. I know it doesn't matter to the GP, but having some unique and completely innovative inversions sure would be refreshing. They've almost done a Top Hat with Daemonen's modified Immelman, why not just make it bigger!

http://www.nojespark.net/tivdaemonen/index.php?show=6

While Hydra is different, the inversions are more or less just modified versions of already proven inversions. I have a feeling these loops will be alot like Medusa West's Sea Serpent, looks cool, but not anything wildly innovative or ground breaking.

jomo - who'd still like to see what B&M could do with a shuttle loop.

ok, im the resident Drachen Fire whore, lol...having gotten about 52 rides one day back in 96...

one of the main problems was the trains...they had a poor center of gravity, although i cant explain that very well.....i remember the corkscrews (one being removed after 94) were taken at insane speeds, especially the one that was removed....but honestly, i dont remember the transitions being that bad.

and to set the record straight, it wasnt SOME of DF's elements were unique....every single element on Drachen Fire was new for Arrow, and has never been attmepted since on another Arrow....granted, only one other Arrow looper after that that i know of (TN Tornado).....

anyway...i loved that coaster. just thought offer my 2 cents.....id love to see a company ressurect its layout someday....

Tim....proud to be resident Drachen Fire whore :)

The problem with simply "coming up with new inversions" is that its just not that easy. Go on, try it...come up with something that is unique *AND* stays within the acceptable G-force limits.

Again, if an enthusiast is bored with the existing inversions it is probably because they travel to many parks. The average park guest does not travel. Nor do they seem to care that a park like SFMM offers 9 loops, 8 corkscrews, 3 dive loops, 2 zero-g rolls, 2 cobra rolls...and so on.

Right... how else could anyone explain Hulk being so popular? Yawn!

I think the future of B&M inversions is variations of existing ones. Look at Dueling Dragon's "wraparound Immelman" and the inversion on Daemonen that was mentioned a few posts ago. As Moosh said, there is a lot of R&D to be invested in new inversions and I think that B&M feels they are better off working with what they have instead of going for something entirely new.

Although that isn't to say that their next product won't find a new way to invert the rider, just as the Superman flyers did with the Pretzel Loop.

There are no new inversion on Daemonen. Given the tight plot of land B&M Had to work with they just slightly tweaked a loop, immelman, and zero-g.