Hard Rock Park closing early...

But what percentage of visitors to the park are going to be aware of that? Are you suggesting that the reason the park's attendance is suffering is because too many non-customers who have never been to the park and therefore don't know what rides it has therefore somehow know that those rides are identical to other rides at other parks which they also haven't visited?

Makes my brain hurt.

Well, when IoA's rides included Hulk, DD, Spidey, Dudley-do-right, JP and theming up the yinger-yanger, perhaps it isn't just a numbers thing.

<- who has no idea what or how well themed the rides at HRP are.

...just laughing thinking about how few rides at IoA are seriously fun and rerideable even ten years later. I got Dudley's, Fire Dragon, and Spidey. (I might even get tired of PF if given the opportunity, LOL). It's not the number of attractions, it's the quality of the theming, the ambience, the (dare I say it?)...charm. :)

Since the park's been open, I still keep renewing my pass every time it comes up. I have no idea if HRP is like that in terms of being able to generate repeat visits. Likely they don't know either, since almost no one has made a first visit. The HRC franchise probably has too much invested to give up this quickly. But even with the economy, if I were the one making the decisions, the marketing people at HRP would be very worried about pink slippage...and there would be more butts in the park, pronto! Give away the gate if you have to - at least get the rides running, some in-park spending, and get the word OUT! ;)

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matt. said:

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kpjb said:
If the place is doomed, why would another buyer be interested?

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Just speculation here but isn't basing your operating model on 30,000 people coming through the gates a day, like...a lot? I'd imagine someone could make a purchase, somehow pare down operating costs and begin to turn a profit within a few years.

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In that case, see the first half of my post that you cut out of your quote:

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If there's a good opportunity for improvement and investment, why would they close?

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Lord Gonchar said:

I dunno. How has IOA gotten away with it for almost a decade?

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IOA is absolutely my favorite theme park out there, but I really don't think it'd thrive as a seasonal park alone in South Carolina. It draws off of Disney, and even the Studios half of the park.

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kpjb said:
In that case, see the first half of my post that you cut out of your quote:

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Probably because I don't think they'd close or sell this fast, mainly for the reason Jeff said. I can't imagine investing this sort of dough into a park without being able to incur serious losses for at least a few years.

Then again, 30,000 guests a day to survive? If that's operating 365 days a year, that's nearly 11 million guests each year. Just operating half the year that's 5.5 million and um...well I think there's just a lot of numbers here really don't make sense and I'd be inclined to think they're not on HRP's side. If they are I have a couple bridges to sell them....

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Ensign Smith said:
...Are you suggesting that the reason the park's attendance is suffering is because too many non-customers who have never been to the park and therefore don't know what rides it has therefore somehow know that those rides are identical to other rides at other parks which they also haven't visited?

Makes my brain hurt.

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Nope. If I had to take a guess at why the park isn't doing well, I would say it's because the park was designed to be similar to IOA, but the attractions (which are well described on their web site) are not of the same kind of quality. I would also say that the price of admission seems pretty high for a park that lack many high tech experiences.

I'll take the price thing back. I just checked the HRP site...$45 for a single day admission, which to me still seems a little high for what they offer, but add an additional day for only $10, or the next 7 days for $25, and now you're talkin'!

I'd pay $35 for a one day ticket to HRP and not feel like I was getting riped off. YMMV.

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LostKause said:
If I had to take a guess at why the park isn't doing well, I would say it's because the park was designed to be similar to IOA, but the attractions (which are well described on their web site) are not of the same kind of quality. I would also say that the price of admission seems pretty high for a park that lack many high tech experiences.

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I'd be interested to see if you thought the same thing after a visit.

I don't think they've tried to copy or base the park on the IOA model at all. I do think what they ended up with feels a lot like IOA did when it first opened. Not a lot of rides to do, but a great place to hang out, do more than just rides and soak it in.

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rollergator said:
...just laughing thinking about how few rides at IoA are seriously fun and rerideable even ten years later. I got Dudley's, Fire Dragon, and Spidey. It's not the number of attractions, it's the quality of the theming, the ambience, the (dare I say it?)...charm.

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Yup. Why does the hippie always be the one who seems to be reading my mind? ;)

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kpjb said:
IOA is absolutely my favorite theme park out there, but I really don't think it'd thrive as a seasonal park alone in South Carolina. It draws off of Disney, and even the Studios half of the park.

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Yup. Myrtle Beach is no Orlando.

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I still say the problem isn't the park, but rather the perception of the park. If that makes any sense.

I'd just like to chime in here that I listen to everything, absolutely everything, 100% of the time. I can go from hardcore to hip hop to classical in a single 10 minutes and find something I like about it all.

I'm very easy to please.

Musically, that is.

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Lord Gonchar said:I still say the problem isn't the park, but rather the perception of the park. If that makes any sense.

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Which is exactly why I'm so hard on the marketing...they have totally failed to pump up the volume. Before IoA opened, you'd had to have been living in Bin Laden's cave not to know about it - there was NO lack of awareness about the place. Get thousands of people in there (however you have to - walk the beachfront playing games with people with admission tickets as prizes or WHATEVER you have to do). Then the "buzz" starts to spread, the local news channels and radio stations start broadcasting from the park, and you've got a business that's up and running.

Kinda reminds me of all the stand-alone upcharges like Katanga on I-Drive. If you don't get the rides MOVING, with people SCREAMING, then it really looks for all the world like the place is *already* closed...the drawing power is in the people already being there having a good time.

They advertised IoA heavily here on the West coast.

That 30,000 number doesn't make sense. Peak capacity at KI, which is no small park is about 55,000. Peak at Carowinds is around 30-35. I haven't seen the HRP, but I have trouble believing anyone would build their business model based on their average number being higher than most similar parks peak number.

I don't know anybody on the business side of this thing, but some of the people on the maintenance side are former PP folks. If the business model didn't make sense, I don't think those people would be there. They know where the bear s***s.

Why would you want to be where a bear s***s? He'd probably be pissed that you were watching him do his business, and rip your face off. :)

-Tambo

*** Edited 8/20/2008 8:36:28 PM UTC by tambo***

Does Pooh poo in the woods?

Right turn Clyde - right into the weeds.

Who said anything about watching the bear? The important thing is to know where he is so you don't step into things. Like Cedar Fair Employment or Pooh Poo.

If this news is true about Hard Rock Park closing I will be HEARTBROKEN! :(

It's not news, it's a disgruntled ex-employee crying.

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kpjb said:

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Lord Gonchar said:

I dunno. How has IOA gotten away with it for almost a decade?

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IOA is absolutely my favorite theme park out there, but I really don't think it'd thrive as a seasonal park alone in South Carolina. It draws off of Disney, and even the Studios half of the park.

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How about it also has stuff that is in the mainstream today like Incredible Hulk, Jurassic Park, Storm, Spider-Man, and you can find some Dr. Seuss books in the library. However, I don't think that park would do that good if it was in a colder environment because it has too many water rides. Again, as I said before, it's got other things to make that park survive (IOA) just like you are saying.

A podcast said that the Myrtle Beach area is more for like families. In my opinion, I don't think that Hard Rock Park is geared in the same direction even though they do have some family rides. They probably have more family rides than thrill rides which is quite strange for a park that is drug friendly.

You would think it would be thrill ride, drug ride, thrill ride, sex ride, thrill ride and so on, but it's not. It's looks to me like thrill ride, drug ride, kid's area, drug ride that's a kids ride, kids ride with music, and kids ride that doesn't much of anything also with music.

Heh. What's a drug ride?

I'm pretty sure I'm interested. :)

I'll fourth that!